Suggestions for ISA Brown longevity

[Weeg]

Interesting article, @Weeg! Thanks for thinking of me. It’s interesting that eggshell membranes are on that list. It drives my husband crazy, but I rinse and air dry all the egg shells I get, then crush into small pieces to give back to the ladies. Free calcium, in my eyes. Even better if the membrane is beneficial, I just figured it would be a small protein boost.

As far as other supplementation goes, I think it’s easy to go overboard and make things more complicated than they need to be. While the things listed in the article are potent sources of antioxidants, I only have easy access to two of those on the list. A friend who is a nurse practitioner pointed out to me once that all fruits and vegetables are also sources of many different antioxidants, which is one reason why we humans are encouraged to eat a wide range of them. While certain ones come and go as the latest ‘super fruit’, she said it’s more beneficial to focus on variety than loading up on just one. My ladies get the peels, seeds, cores, etc from the kitchen and they get to forage in the backyard when it’s not covered in snow, so that’s got to be a good start, least.

I’d love to learn more about what you’re reading up on - chicken physiology and their nutritional needs are quite a bit different than humans or dogs, so there may be somethings that are more helpful (or decidedly not) than others.

Thank you, I hope it can be helpful! I actually haven't read that entire article myself, nor have I gotten all the way to the list of things they suggest. I was really going for a better explanation as to why antioxidants may be beneficial for your ISA's.
If I were you, I'd avoid some of the pricey, complicated, dog style things on that list, and use, like you said, fruits and veggies. Blueberries and Cranberrys (lower in sugar) are great a source of antioxidants, and cinnamon is an easy one as well. Cinnamon is also antibacterial, and anti-inflammatory as well.
I have to agree with your above statement though, you have a very good point.

I read another article recently about a Danish research study that found that there was an alarmingly high percentage of commercial production hens with keel bone fractures. Their conclusion was that the young age that the bird starts laying was partially responsible - since their skeletons are still hardening, diverting calcium to eggshell production means it’s not going towards the pullet’s skeleton. That compound by a disproportional egg size to hen size ratio and the high rate of laying (almost daily) would also cause those fractures and prevent said fractures from healing quickly because they keep re-injuring the fracture every time they lay. Their solution was pretty simple - delay their egg laying onset via a hormone implant - and see if that helped the incidence of fractures.

This is very interesting. So sad how much we've jeopardized the breed for our own need of eggs. If you can't get ahold of a vet, @KaleIAm had a great setup for keeping one of her ducks from laying for medical reasons. I bet her method work would for chickens as well.

But I digress. I think a healthy diet is a very key factor in the health of birds that are predisposed to problems, though there’s definitely a limit that genes will put on them as well. Please feel free to share any interesting articles you read with me!

Yes! Diet plays a huge role! The gut is the largest part of the immune system, so a healthy diet makes for a healthy gut, making for a healthy bird.
I will certainly share any more information I find.

 

[NatJ]

...alarmingly high percentage of commercial production hens with keel bone fractures. ...Their solution was pretty simple - delay their egg laying onset via a hormone implant - and see if that helped the incidence of fractures.

I have a simpler, cheaper solution: delay the onset of laying by controlling the amount of LIGHT the pullets get.

For confined layers, it is quite common to raise them with limited light (short days), and lengthen the days when they are the right age to start laying. Just delaying that would delay laying.

For pullets with access to outdoors, raising new pullets at a different time of year would be one way to control their day-length as they approach laying age. Or if they are shut in each night (for safety), the light exposure could be controlled by letting them out at different times in the morning, depending on when the sun would go down at that season.

A hormone implant for every chicken would require buying the implants, and handling every individual chicken (stress for the birds, time for the employees, cost for the company.)

 

[ChicMomof10]

Thank you, I hope it can be helpful! I actually haven't read that entire article myself, nor have I gotten all the way to the list of things they suggest. I was really going for a better explanation as to why antioxidants may be beneficial for your ISA's.
If I were you, I'd avoid some of the pricey, complicated, dog style things on that list, and use, like you said, fruits and veggies. Blueberries and Cranberrys (lower in sugar) are great a source of antioxidants, and cinnamon is an easy one as well. Cinnamon is also antibacterial, and anti-inflammatory as well.
I have to agree with your above statement though, you have a very good point.

This is very interesting. So sad how much we've jeopardized the breed for our own need of eggs. If you can't get ahold of a vet, @KaleIAm had a great setup for keeping one of her ducks from laying for medical reasons. I bet her method work would for chickens as well.

Yes! Diet plays a huge role! The gut is the largest part of the immune system, so a healthy diet makes for a healthy gut, making for a healthy bird.
I will certainly share any more information I find.

We have 10 ISA Browns almost 2 years old in southern Vermont. All have stayed healthy. We do check their vents to be sure everything works well. We feed organic and add all healthy treats such as Grubblies worms, seeds, squash or pumpkin. They all lay most every day, thank you God. Cinnamon is very good for them. Hope this helps. No fun to have a sick chicken.

 

[Mrs. K]

I think another aspect other than diet and delayed laying, is exercise. I would imagine that commercial birds to not get exercise such as flying, and THAT can severely affect their musculature structure such as the keel bone.

Often times, people keep chicks in too small of brooders, way too long, because they are keeping them safe. They really do much better in as large of area as you can. They are much more active, and begin to climb and fly up to perches with in weeks, long before they are fully feathered.

Personally, I would not give hormones. I love to cook with fresh and wholesome ingredients, and want wholesome birds. If they are ready to lay, I would let them. I like the idea of playing with the light and time of year, rather than the hormone implant. That just seems too un-natural to me, and of very little value to the life of the bird. Plus a huge pain to maintain.

However, I don't doctor sick birds. And really, I don't know if it is my space, or predators, or just plain luck, but I have only had one sick bird in more than a decade of chicken keeping. I culled that bird immediately. I don't have forever friends, I keep a flock, whereas birds come in and out of the flock. I know that many of you, would like to keep your birds forever. Different ways for different folks.

Mrs K

 

[Robeenop]

Mine is actually ill again. She had something recently that lasted about 8 weeks, then she bounced back and had been doing pretty well for the past couple of weeks. But she is off again, not eating, and just being lethargic. Sigh…wish I could figure out what is wrong.

I have had them, and lost the last of 6 in the spring. Production birds like ISA and any Star or Cinnamon Queen are laying machines for a couple years. They are also greedy eating machines as well. They are not bred for free range. They are fairly friendly. But just out of the blue die. Mine started dying at the 3.5 year mark. One day fine, next morning on the floor of the coop . I have an 8 yr old Astrolorp. Also 7 year old Columbian wyandottes. Don't lay but are lap chickens.
I was told that was their lifespan from my father. My grandfather was a commercial poultry farmer.

 

[Robeenop]

I’m sorry to hear that, it’s never fun to see one of your flock struggle.

Almost forgot, a hungry chicken is a HEALTHY chicken!

 

[Mrs. K]

Really, maybe it is my age, but the idea of fine one day, and gone the next, without too much suffering, seems like a good deal to me. And then, as my granddaughter says to me, "Well circle of life, now we can get chicks!"

 

[Robeenop]

Really, maybe it is my age, but the idea of fine one day, and gone the next, without too much suffering, seems like a good deal to me. And then, as my granddaughter says to me, "Well circle of life, now we can get chicks!"

First loss I thought I sit something wrong....I was upset. Now I take in stride. There are other breeds that lay well and live longer. I love my Americana, Speckled Sussex,Brahma, Turkins,Salmon Favorelles, Dominique, Barred Rocks and Wyondottes. I have about 16 different breeds. I avoid Orpingtons , they go broody too much. My 4 averaged laying maybe 3 months a year.I don't break the broody. Works for a while, and is contagious...lol

 

[Solanacae]

I think another aspect other than diet and delayed laying, is exercise. I would imagine that commercial birds to not get exercise such as flying, and THAT can severely affect their musculature structure such as the keel bone.

Often times, people keep chicks in too small of brooders, way too long, because they are keeping them safe. They really do much better in as large of area as you can. They are much more active, and begin to climb and fly up to perches with in weeks, long before they are fully feathered.

Personally, I would not give hormones. I love to cook with fresh and wholesome ingredients, and want wholesome birds. If they are ready to lay, I would let them. I like the idea of playing with the light and time of year, rather than the hormone implant. That just seems too un-natural to me, and of very little value to the life of the bird. Plus a huge pain to maintain.

However, I don't doctor sick birds. And really, I don't know if it is my space, or predators, or just plain luck, but I have only had one sick bird in more than a decade of chicken keeping. I culled that bird immediately. I don't have forever friends, I keep a flock, whereas birds come in and out of the flock. I know that many of you, would like to keep your birds forever. Different ways for different folks.

Mrs K

I have not been keeping chickens for long, so I’m still figuring out my approach. I feel like I am morally obligated (for lack of a better term) to do what is reasonably within my power to ensure that the creatures I care for, be they my dogs or my chickens, are living a healthy and happy life. So I read lots of articles here and elsewhere to try and figure out what seems to be the best course for me.

Each of my kids has ‘their’ chicken and they have a say in how long it will stay with the flock. I’m curious to see how long each child decides to keep their chicken around. The others are mine, and my current plan is to replace aging layers with chicks so I can have a (more or less) steady supply of eggs. I don’t plan to eat my layers, I can rehome them to a rancher nearby who uses them for pest control or donate them to the local zoo, which will use them to feed their predators. I’m looking into raising meat birds, went and learned how to butcher birds this fall, but haven’t made that leap yet.

I don’t love the added hormone idea, I try to avoid added stuff in my food but I’m not hardcore organic. I would not do it regularly, if it’s even an option. It would simply be to delay the initial onset of their laying to give their skeletons a little more time. There has been too much genetic meddling, in my opinion, to assume that their skeletons are hardened and ready to lay two months earlier than a heritage breed just because they started laying. If that makes any sense.

I read in another thread that someone was paying $300 for an implant, which seems excessive to me. It certainly will to my husband, and so I’m unsure that I’d go through with it if it did cost that much. Like I said, I want to give my chickens as happy and healthy a life as I can, but within reason.

 

[Mrs. K]

To each his or her own way of doing things. They are your chickens. And my DH would commit me if I considered spending $300 on a hormonal implant.

Part of my lack of enthusiasm for this idea, is probably based on the fact that I have had numerous of these types of birds, and found them active, inquisitive, curious and great layers and a great addition to the flock. I will admit that they do tend to be fine and die the next day around 3 -3.5 years of age, but I only have hatchery birds, and a lot of them die around that age. Chickens are not dependably long lived birds.

So for me, this would not be a good idea, I do try to give mine decent food, clean water and good shelter and bedding. I don't worry too much about a lot of things, but just take what I get handed to me and move on. I think of this as being realistic, others might think of it as heartless.

Mrs K