The American Paint Silkie

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Quote:
I know I will repeat some information in previous posts so bear with me. This is a long thread so it would not hurt repeating the information.

Paints are a heterozygous dominant white or only carry one dominant white gene. Under the white they are most likely extended black at the E locus. Birds can be black and carry another allele at the E locus but from what I can gather from the posts they are extended black.

I have worked with dominant white for years and it is a quirky gene. You are not going to get the same pattern of black markings in each bird because of the nature of the dominant white gene. I have even had heterozygous birds that were a very light gray color over the entire body.

You would only want to breed paint to paint or paint to black. Breeding paints to variates that carry gold would cause problems. The problems would be buff or red and black spots on a white ground color.

Here is an example of a red and black paint. You would get this color pattern if a person were to breed a black tailed red to a paint and then did some additional crossing with the offspring.


13371_100_2955r.jpg



Here is an example of a paint.


13371_image1.jpg



To produce a paint, the breeder wants a solid black bird under the white- that is why it is best to breed paint to paint or black to paint. If a person were to breed to a partridge this would introduce the gold gene to the offspring. The paints would start to show buff colors on the breast, head and neck in the females and the males would start to look similar to a red pyle.

Any red or red shades ( buff etc. ) would begin to leak through the white. You could get strong spots of red or the red will sometimes appear as smear of red on white( best way I can explain the color).


If a person is dealing with dominant white the following ratios apply to the crossings. To get the ratios you would have to hatch a large number of chicks. I believe some one posted this earlier but I am going to post the information again.

Black X paint = 50% black and 50% paint with a few solid white

paint X paint = 25% white, 25% black and 50% paint You will most likely get a higher percentage of white because some heterozygous dominant white birds can be solid white. This of course would decrease the percentage of paints.


If red begins to show in the paints- back cross the paint to black to eliminate the red in future offspring.


Tim
 
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Can you take a photo without using a flash? I cannot see anything.

Yes I will do it here in a few sec's I will try to go outside inside pics without flash don't take so well.
 
they almost do...but thats the only markings on it. The chick has a ring of a dark brown/buff color on its neck and the rest of the chick is also darker then white chicks when hatched. The others from the batch look like buff chicks.

ETA: I wanted to add I was not saying the chick was a paint. Alot of people think crossing a dom white with black will make paints. I am just showing a chick that hatched from a Dom white to a black breeding.
 
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Quote:
I know I will repeat some information in previous posts so bear with me. This is a long thread so it would not hurt repeating the information.

Paints are a heterozygous dominant white or only carry one dominant white gene. Under the white they are most likely extended black at the E locus. Birds can be black and carry another allele at the E locus but from what I can gather from the posts they are extended black.

I have worked with dominant white for years and it is a quirky gene. You are not going to get the same pattern of black markings in each bird because of the nature of the dominant white gene. I have even had heterozygous birds that were a very light gray color over the entire body.

You would only want to breed paint to paint or paint to black. Breeding paints to variates that carry gold would cause problems. The problems would be buff or red and black spots on a white ground color.

Here is an example of a red and black paint. You would get this color pattern if a person were to breed a black tailed red to a paint and then did some additional crossing with the offspring.


https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/13371_100_2955r.jpg


Here is an example of a paint.


https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/13371_image1.jpg


To produce a paint, the breeder wants a solid black bird under the white- that is why it is best to breed paint to paint or black to paint. If a person were to breed to a partridge this would introduce the gold gene to the offspring. The paints would start to show buff colors on the breast, head and neck in the females and the males would start to look similar to a red pyle.

Any red or red shades ( buff etc. ) would begin to leak through the white. You could get strong spots of red or the red will sometimes appear as smear of red on white( best way I can explain the color).


If a person is dealing with dominant white the following ratios apply to the crossings. To get the ratios you would have to hatch a large number of chicks. I believe some one posted this earlier but I am going to post the information again.

Black X paint = 50% black and 50% paint with a few solid white

paint X paint = 25% white, 25% black and 50% paint You will most likely get a higher percentage of white because some heterozygous dominant white birds can be solid white. This of course would decrease the percentage of paints.


If red begins to show in the paints- back cross the paint to black to eliminate the red in future offspring.


Tim

Tim, Can you comment on this paint of mine, please?
20590_sam_1819.jpg
20590_sam_1786--chocolate_man.jpg
 
Quote:
I know I will repeat some information in previous posts so bear with me. This is a long thread so it would not hurt repeating the information.

Paints are a heterozygous dominant white or only carry one dominant white gene. Under the white they are most likely extended black at the E locus. Birds can be black and carry another allele at the E locus but from what I can gather from the posts they are extended black.

I have worked with dominant white for years and it is a quirky gene. You are not going to get the same pattern of black markings in each bird because of the nature of the dominant white gene. I have even had heterozygous birds that were a very light gray color over the entire body.

You would only want to breed paint to paint or paint to black. Breeding paints to variates that carry gold would cause problems. The problems would be buff or red and black spots on a white ground color.

Here is an example of a red and black paint. You would get this color pattern if a person were to breed a black tailed red to a paint and then did some additional crossing with the offspring.


https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/13371_100_2955r.jpg


Here is an example of a paint.


https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/13371_image1.jpg


To produce a paint, the breeder wants a solid black bird under the white- that is why it is best to breed paint to paint or black to paint. If a person were to breed to a partridge this would introduce the gold gene to the offspring. The paints would start to show buff colors on the breast, head and neck in the females and the males would start to look similar to a red pyle.

Any red or red shades ( buff etc. ) would begin to leak through the white. You could get strong spots of red or the red will sometimes appear as smear of red on white( best way I can explain the color).


If a person is dealing with dominant white the following ratios apply to the crossings. To get the ratios you would have to hatch a large number of chicks. I believe some one posted this earlier but I am going to post the information again.

Black X paint = 50% black and 50% paint with a few solid white

paint X paint = 25% white, 25% black and 50% paint You will most likely get a higher percentage of white because some heterozygous dominant white birds can be solid white. This of course would decrease the percentage of paints.


If red begins to show in the paints- back cross the paint to black to eliminate the red in future offspring.


Tim

Tim, Can you comment on this paint of mine, please?
https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/20590_sam_1819.jpghttps://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/20590_sam_1786--chocolate_man.jpg

I'll be watching for an answer on this since I have one with even more of that champagne color. I love it, wouldn't mind seeing more of it.
 
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Paint show girls are now 5 days old and the skin color is darkening each day
chicks007.jpg

chicks005.jpg

Also had another 4 chicks hatch today from my white showgirl male over dutch paint hens and got these
chicks010.jpg

All 4 are naked neck
chicks009.jpg

one is paint with light colored skin but does have dark shanks
chicks010.jpg
 
Darn, you beat me to the paint showgirl!
wink.png
They are super cute!!

I have to say, I've gotten partridge from paint x paint breedings..... There's no telling about these genetics sometimes!
 
Sonoron Silkies,

I am assuming the bird is a male.

Your bird is a good example of the unpredictable nature of the dominant white gene. It is difficult for me to tell the actual color leaking through the white.. It may be a mixture of black and red pigments and if so, this would correspond to neck feathers that were red with a black central stripe. This would indicate a lack of melanotic in the bird and most likely the bird is birchen or brown at the E locus. The bird is not columbian restricted because it would show some red on the breast. Why the saddle hackles do not show the color is again the strange nature of the dominant white gene. You would think the color found in the neck hackles would be also found in the remainder of the pyle zone- the saddle hackles and top of the head. There is some in the wing also.

I am thinking you have a partridge like silkie under the white. He may be heterozygous at the E locus- birchen/brown. A good test cross would be to cross the male with some partridge hens. Some of the offspring should have a similar color: it should cover the pyle zone in the males and the body of the female. If you cross him with darker females- there will be less red in the offspring and with redder females the offspring colors should be a darker red color.

Thats my two cents.

Tim
 
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