The Confusing Quail Calculator..

Discussion in 'Quail' started by adubsroit, Dec 15, 2010.

  1. adubsroit

    adubsroit Chillin' With My Peeps

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    First off, maybe it is because chickens make more sense to me, but the Quail Calculator seems impossible to me. I don't think it helps that some of the colors don't even have pictures for reference. That aside, now for the real questions..



    Okay.. First off, is saying "Tuxedo split"correct? My Rosetta pullet and Tibetan were both hatched with Tuxedo like markings and now both are almost their respectable coloration aside from some white markings. The Tibetan has an X-pattern right on her face and the Rosetta (and Tibetan) have white feathers in their wings/tails.
    - Would they be considered partially expressed/incomplete tuxedos?
    - If this is the case and in theory, would breeding a split to a tuxedo (versus a solid colored bird) improve ratio of tuxedos in the subsequent hatch?
    - Is there a difference in the genes of an entirely white quail versus a white quail with a spot on it's head? Isn't this something to do with said-# of doses of the pied gene?
    My male and a female have a single Tibetan colored spot on their heads, and the other female is entirely white.

    Finally, regarding colors and how they breed, because the calculator is too confusing, what can I expect from breeding:
    - English White to [Jumbo] Brown= ??
    - English White to English White (spot on head)= ??
    - English White to English White (entirely white)= ??
    - English White to Tibetan [Tuxedo split?]= ??
    - English White to Rosetta [Tuxedo split?]= ??


    For fun, here is my currently nameless Tibetan (Tuxedo split?) with her "X" face-mask:
    [​IMG]
     
  2. joe125

    joe125 Chillin' With My Peeps

    Sep 20, 2010
    What a pretty face!

    - English White to [Jumbo] Brown= ??

    =Brown (wild) what ever you call the color. Size will vary.

    - English White to English White (spot on head)= ??

    = English White with or without spots here and there.... You can't really breed a spot here and there on a white pattern bird. You just get what you get. Sometimes you get a solid white bird with a brown/black butt, speckled head/back, or totally white with a black/brown spot on it's head, etc... Go figure. [​IMG]

    - English White to English White (entirely white)= ??

    Same as above.

    - English White to Tibetan [Tuxedo split?]= ??

    You get various splits based on % , and you may even get a nasty ugly white lacking Tibetan color or 2. The % break down will be covered by others. They have fare more time on their hands than I have [​IMG]

    - English White to Rosetta [Tuxedo split?]= ??

    Same as above. The % of this and that will be different, but pretty much the same. [​IMG]

    I'm not sure about the "Quail Calculator" but I'm going to put it in my pipe and smoke it later. Thanks for that link!​
     
  3. shelleyd2008

    shelleyd2008 the bird is the word

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    I agree, thanks so much for that link! I didn't realize that kippenjungle had a quail calculator too, I love that site! [​IMG] Too bad it doesn't have an option to choose the color like the chicken calculator does, that makes it sooooooo much easier! Will be playing with that later [​IMG]
     
  4. Stellar

    Stellar The Quail Lady

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    Tampa Bay
    Quote:Finally [​IMG] Someone I can answer [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Here is something I concocted that may help you a little https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=416724

    - English White to [Jumbo] Brown= Jumbo Browns...if the English whites are homozygous, you can get them to show up on the browns...you never know until you try.
    - English White to English White (spot on head)= mix of both
    - English White to English White (entirely white)= depends on heterozygosity and homozygosity
    - English White to Tibetan [Tuxedo split?]= ?? British Range Tuxedos, whites, beginnings of tuxedos..

    British Ranges can have the double factor gene like in Button quail, white have been seen in the so called "Tibetan" British Range...usually under the chin. Button quail Blue Face get this if you breed two blue faces together. SInce I have the British Ranges together, there are more with the little white around the face...so my theory is the double factor you may be seeing in your split.
    - English White to Rosetta [Tuxedo split?]= ?? Same thing as above as it is British Range in my eyes just lighter.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2010
  5. adubsroit

    adubsroit Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Apr 9, 2010
    Finally smile Someone I can answer big_smile big_smile big_smile

    Here is something I concocted that may help you a little https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=416724

    - English White to [Jumbo] Brown= Jumbo Browns...if the English whites are homozygous, you can get them to show up on the browns...you never know until you try.
    - English White to English White (spot on head)= mix of both
    - English White to English White (entirely white)= depends on heterozygosity and homozygosity
    - English White to Tibetan [Tuxedo split?]= ?? British Range Tuxedos, whites, beginnings of tuxedos..

    British Ranges can have the double factor gene like in Button quail, white have been seen in the so called "Tibetan" British Range...usually under the chin. Button quail Blue Face get this if you breed two blue faces together. SInce I have the British Ranges together, there are more with the little white around the face...so my theory is the double factor you may be seeing in your split.

    - English White to Rosetta [Tuxedo split?]= ?? Same thing as above as it is British Range in my eyes just lighter.

    [​IMG] Thanks Quail Lady!! I wish someone with your know how would talk to the Calculator person and help simplify and make it more concise for those of us who are not as gene-knowledgeable.


    Quote:I TOTALLY agree with this ShelleyD!! The calculator is way to confusing, especially when there are so few options and even fewer references.. Especially because in that situation, in theory, things should be "easier," lol.​
     
  6. Stellar

    Stellar The Quail Lady

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    Tampa Bay
    Those letters are confusing...well let me tell you one hint...quail genetics is very close to chicken in the colors... I am trying to explain it more for those who just want symplicity. It's tough with splits, you never know what you get... The splits do improve some traits for lethality though I have experienced recently, and had made some genes stronger in survivor rates after hatch. I am trying to cook while writing and all I need is to test survivor rates of the household! Lol
     
  7. adubsroit

    adubsroit Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Can pied/white genes be lethal?? One of my three English White, which was entirely white, was always very sluggish and never looked as vigorous as the others. Could it be just a happen-chance that this one quail was just not healthy??
     
  8. Stellar

    Stellar The Quail Lady

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    Tampa Bay
    Yes, white genes can be lethal. There is a "light down lethal" and they are English Whites but in 3 weeks they die or don't make it as little chicks. Some make it but carry the gene.
     
  9. adubsroit

    adubsroit Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Apr 9, 2010
    Hmm, good to know. For good measure we have already culled the bird about a day ago because she was just looking pathetic and lethargic all at the same time.

    On the subject of genetics, which I find CRAZY interesting even though in school Sciences were NEVER a forte: where do dilutes come from?? I have been reading a lot about the silver and blue/lavender bird, but from European sites and to them these birds seem to be normal. If it can be a common place in Europe, is there any sort of sequence of breeding that could be beneficial to increasing one's chances to breed and hatch a silver or blue bird?

    I assume that since both are recessive, silver being autosmal rec, that it would be difficult to know what your bird carried without having extensive knowledge of its genetic lineage. Is there anything to look for in a bird that may give some sign as to if they would be better for breeding to result in silver or blue? I know chickens are different but I can't help recall colors like gold, which if present in a lavender chicken will be expressed as a light- golden straw color (I have a lavender Orpington that is a great example).

    Sorry if my questions are going every which way and are broad, feel free to speak as simply as you please, lol. I'm a newb and got no problem admitting it.



    Here is a link to some ridiculously cool looking coturnix: CoturnixCorner.com
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2010
  10. joe125

    joe125 Chillin' With My Peeps

    Sep 20, 2010
    Quote:Finally [​IMG] Someone I can answer [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Here is something I concocted that may help you a little https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=416724

    - English White to [Jumbo] Brown= Jumbo Browns...if the English whites are homozygous, you can get them to show up on the browns...you never know until you try.
    - English White to English White (spot on head)= mix of both
    - English White to English White (entirely white)= depends on heterozygosity and homozygosity
    - English White to Tibetan [Tuxedo split?]= ?? British Range Tuxedos, whites, beginnings of tuxedos..

    British Ranges can have the double factor gene like in Button quail, white have been seen in the so called "Tibetan" British Range...usually under the chin. Button quail Blue Face get this if you breed two blue faces together. SInce I have the British Ranges together, there are more with the little white around the face...so my theory is the double factor you may be seeing in your split.
    - English White to Rosetta [Tuxedo split?]= ?? Same thing as above as it is British Range in my eyes just lighter.

    I'm no genetics expert, but that's basically what I said. I'm sorry I can't give a % of this and that color, but most colors, other than white and brown are new to me.

    Crossing a "JUMBO" any color, with a non jumbo any color, does not result in a "JUMBO" anything! The adult size will vary....Over and above the coturnix natural size/weight variation, which is HUGE. This is why people get very white birds that are small, and not so white birds that are larger and the other way around.
     

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