The Legbar Thread!

[WHmarans]

Sometimes you can take a clip out of a video to get a picture of them standing. Or put them in a small place. There was a good post about evaluating type on another thread that described why you need to pick a bird up to evaluate type. I think there is a lot if talk about color often because we can evaluate it by photo most easily. I'm still searching for photo or YouTube video to show me what to feel for and how. Do you know their weight and age?

 

[DeannaA]

Sometimes you can take a clip out of a video to get a picture of them standing. Or put them in a small place. There was a good post about evaluating type on another thread that described why you need to pick a bird up to evaluate type. I think there is a lot if talk about color often because we can evaluate it by photo most easily. I'm still searching for photo or YouTube video to show me what to feel for and how. Do you know their weight and age?

I haven't weighed them since putting them outside. They are almost 15 weeks. They are all the same size. I will try to get a clip.

 

[Brada Puhi]

Aloha, Not sure if you guys saw this site. Seems very informative.

Aloha, Puhi


http://www.harislau.info/legbar

 

[Runawaylobster]

My 4 legbar pullets are growing up, and are about 4 months old now. Three are doing fine but the 4th is getting more deformed by the day. At first i just thought i was a wry tail, but now it's involving her back, and she has one leg that is kinda bent but the other one is just fine. Apart from this she is happy as all the others and zooms around with them.. They are all on chick starter until they begin to lay, same as all my other chicks.

i was thinking that maybe it is just because of the small gene pool that deformities might be more common?? or am i way off base.

 

[chicken pickin]

My 4 legbar pullets are growing up, and are about 4 months old now. Three are doing fine but the 4th is getting more deformed by the day. At first i just thought i was a wry tail, but now it's involving her back, and she has one leg that is kinda bent but the other one is just fine. Apart from this she is happy as all the others and zooms around with them.. They are all on chick starter until they begin to lay, same as all my other chicks.

i was thinking that maybe it is just because of the small gene pool that deformities might be more common?? or am i way off base.

Hmmm Im not sure on that. I did see recently someone posted pics of their CLs and one of the CL roos had a back deformity. That is all I have heard though.

I wonder if chick starter has too much protein. For me I change feed over at about 8weeks old to a grower feed than between 16-20weeks I put them on a layer feed.

Do you have pics of her?

 

[ChicKat]

My 4 legbar pullets are growing up, and are about 4 months old now. Three are doing fine but the 4th is getting more deformed by the day. At first i just thought i was a wry tail, but now it's involving her back, and she has one leg that is kinda bent but the other one is just fine. Apart from this she is happy as all the others and zooms around with them.. They are all on chick starter until they begin to lay, same as all my other chicks.

i was thinking that maybe it is just because of the small gene pool that deformities might be more common?? or am i way off base.

You may want to isolate the chick...that is just about the age when Marek's can hit. Here is a link with tons of Mareks information if you aren't familiar with the disease.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/mareks-disease-fact-site

Hope that isn't it - but a bent leg or a dragging wing would have me concerned.

 

[Runawaylobster]

You may want to isolate the chick...that is just about the age when Marek's can hit. Here is a link with tons of Mareks information if you aren't familiar with the disease.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/mareks-disease-fact-site

Hope that isn't it - but a bent leg or a dragging wing would have me concerned.

symptoms do not indicate this. ummm.... did i mention anything about a dragging wing?

sorry but it is always the first thing everyone jumps to. I am more interested in frequency of deformities at this point.

you know the closest thing i can think of to describe it is scoliosis..?


after some probing i found this abstract:

Riggins RS, Abbott UK, Ashmore CR, Rucker RB, McCarrey JR
The Journal of Bone and Joint Surgery. American Volume [1977, 59(8):1020-1026]

Scoliosis developed in 55 per cent of sexually mature birds (68 per cent of male and 46 per cent of female birds) in a highly inbred line of chickens originally produced from white Leghorns. The curve could first be detected at five to six weeks of age and progressed until spontaneous fusion of the thoracic vertebrae occurred. Studies of these chickens indicated that abnormalities of growth and development of the spine are not the primary cause of the scoliosis. Preliminary studies of the paravertebral musculature also indicated that simple muscle imbalance is not responsible for the curve. Initial studies of collagen extracted from the scoliotic line of chickens showed it to be more soluble than similar collagen extracted from white Leghorn controls.


http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/1588169?uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=21103249364037

 

[Runawaylobster]

Hmmm Im not sure on that. I did see recently someone posted pics of their CLs and one of the CL roos had a back deformity. That is all I have heard though.

I wonder if chick starter has too much protein. For me I change feed over at about 8weeks old to a grower feed than between 16-20weeks I put them on a layer feed.

Do you have pics of her?

it is Nutrena chick starter grower.....

 

[dretd]

Quote:
That someone with the spinal deformation (both scoliosis and kyphosis) would be me..or rather the chick. In his case I suspect he has an underlying genetic predisposition exacerbated by the very adverse conditions the eggs were subjected to in transit (mailed on a Saturday, missed the fight and sat no doubt on a loading dock in CA when they experienced a heat wave of 95+ temps. 3/29 eggs hatched, 1 died at 1 day, 1 has the profound spinal defects and one is miraculously very normal. On the bright side, she is a very tough girl, genetically and hopefully will through that trait to her offspring!

Here are some links to abstracts regarding scoliosis:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3819867
Abstract

...the incidence of the lesion, defined as a spinal curve greater than 20 degrees, was influenced by deficiencies of copper, manganese or vitamin B-6. In the cross, scoliosis was expressed in 40-50% of birds. Vitamin B-6, manganese or copper deficiency, however, caused an increase in expression to 60-75% of birds. In contrast, protein deficiency, mild vitamin A deprivation, pantothenic deficiency, food restriction or calcium deficiency did not influence expression. Also, the addition of zinc (400 micrograms/g) or cadmium (5 micrograms/g) to a commercial nonpurified diet did not influence expression...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7204941
J Hered. 1981 Jan-Feb;72(1):6-10. Genetics of scoliosis in chickens.McCarrey JR, Abbott UK, Benson DR, Riggins RS.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6740317
Science. 1984 Jul 27;225(4660):440-2.Scoliosis in chickens: responsiveness of severity and incidence to dietary copper.
Opsahl W, Abbott U, Kenney C, Rucker R.
"the content of copper in the diet significantly affected the onset and severity of scoliosis...Abnormal spinal curvature was usually observed around 3-4 weeks of age in chicks receiving copper at 6 to 10 micrograms/g; however, abnormalities... (severe)...were sometimes observed as early as 2 weeks in chicks receiving 2 micrograms/g." (pg 441)

Conclusion: There is an underlying genetic predisposition that is more readily expressed in males (though it is not sex-linked) that will become apparent at 3-4 weeks in most chicks, but may be seen earlier under certain dietary influences such as deficiencies in Copper, Manganese and Vitamin B-6.

Bottom line: the diet may exacerbate the scoliosis, but it does not cause the genetic problems, just make them more easily spotted and any chicken displaying bodily deformities such as scoliosis should not be used for breeding.

 

[DeannaA]

Here are some of my girls. My rooster is very colorful. Beautiful so I will be looking for another one for breeding. He has a red back, white wing tips, rest of the wings blue sheen, purple sheen tail, green sheen on back, cream neck and the craziest crest. I love him. He will be great for my egg ladies.