The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[Leahs Mom]

@oldhenlikesdogs
I will write more later when I have time to explain my "take" on Natural Chicken Keeping ..... (working right now....)

But I wanted to say thanks for that post. Lots of good info there.

I suggested the AVI Culture 2 as a response when LG suggested fermented feed only because I know that some folks don't want to ferment but would like the benefits of the probiotics and enzymes when their birds are mostly inside for the winter without the benefit of getting out much.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

I look forward to hearing what you do Leahs Mom, and I enjoy alternative options, especially if they are less work.

 

[lazy gardener]

@oldhenlikesdogs
I will write more later when I have time to explain my "take" on Natural Chicken Keeping ..... (working right now....)

But I wanted to say thanks for that post. Lots of good info there.

I suggested the AVI Culture 2 as a response when LG suggested fermented feed only because I know that some folks don't want to ferment but would like the benefits of the probiotics and enzymes when their birds are mostly inside for the winter without the benefit of getting out much.

LM, you have Buck Eyes, yes??? Just hens, or roo also? What's your impression of them? Productivity, temperament???

 

[Leahs Mom]

This is my first season with the bucks. I only have 2 pullets and 1 cockerel. They are just starting to lay so I can't give a good review on that part.

I'm hoping to get some more up to date photos of them in the next few days if my schedule allows to post here.

The girls that I kept all have very sweet personalities. They were all slow to mature. If you're looking for a dual purpose, they will have a good amount of meat on them. Small wattles even on the roos keep them from getting into the water and having frostbite in the winter which is great.

I think I'll have a better review after this summer and can observe them longer. I did get these kiddos from a breeder that was driving distance from me and they came from good lines originally. Not sure how they compare to what I could get from the hatchery. I hear that Meyers has bucks.

Here are a couple of photos from November or October.... they were around 4 mos old...I'd have to go back to my records to see hatch date...

 

[lazy gardener]

Nice looking birds. I've ordered 5 pullets and 2 cockrels from Cackle. Hoping I won't be disappointed. In my ideal, perfect little world, one of the cockrels will get to stay in my flock. My avatar roo, Jack is a great roo. He loves his babies, is not feed aggressive, and the older he gets, the more mellow his personality. Hoping... that I can keep a BE along with him for future breeding. Both roos will make some wonderful sex links.

 

[CuzChickens]

Nice to hear everybody's opinion on the added stuff to their water...I have decided to cut back doing it to once a week instead of all the time, because I do feel like they benefit from it to some extent.

I bought 1,000 lbs of feed today....I'm set for the next 12 weeks.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

Nice to hear everybody's opinion on the added stuff to their water...I have decided to cut back doing it to once a week instead of all the time, because I do feel like they benefit from it to some extent.

I bought 1,000 lbs of feed today....I'm set for the next 12 weeks.

How many birds are you feeding?

 

[Leahs Mom]

@oldhenlikesdogs Asked us to tell what we think of when we think of natural chicken keeping. I went back through a bunch of my old posts and put together what I've said in the past and am re-stating it here. So if it sounds a little disconnected, sorry! I just didn't want to re-invent the wheel.


When I think of "natural" chicken keeping, I think in terms of prevention.
So I try to use healthy husbandry methods and provide them with the most healthy environment possible so that they can develop strong immune systems.

I try to emulate as best as I can - with the resources available to me - what they would get if they were a wild flock.
So the hope is that they will be raised in a health-producing environment that will help prevent many of the maladies that are common to 'modern" CAFO-type farming operations.


Plenty of room to roam, fresh air and sunshine, good feed, fresh clean water, deep litter in runs if they are in a more confined situation, adequate housing space for the number of birds ....all of these things help with that. (Deep litter in runs makes the difference between an impacted, disease-producing soil that becomes slimy when wet and a healthy life-giving soil that soaks in the rain. Lots of bugs, worms, and healthy soil probiotics proliferate in a well-done deep litter vs. a breeding-ground for disease in the other scenario.)

Good feed in my understanding includes animal-based protein (bugs are also included in "animal-based") and trying to avoid or eliminate items they wouldn't eat if given a choice (soy for example). I also avoid all items that have been farmed with chemical input.


I DO NOT - AND DON'T RECOMMEND - ROUTINE WORMING!
Worming causes significant stress on the system and doing it routinely can cause more problems than it solves - including weakening the animal's own immune system and making them more susceptible to....WORMS!!!!!!! I would never put them through that stress "just in case".

If I see symptoms that make me think there is a problem, it is not a significant cost to take a stool sample to a local vet to find out if worms are present. Usually less than $10. For the undue stress that it causes their system to do routine chemical worming, it is worth it to find out if they need it and specifically what kinds of worms they may have.

It's my opinion that if birds show significant signs of needing to be wormed, there is something in my husbandry that needs to be tweaked. I've never had that problem, but if I did, I'd stand back a bit and take a look at the things I've already mentioned to be sure that things are done in such a way as to promote health and PREVENTION of the need for remediation.

That being said, if I do have an issue that needs to be addressed, I will address it. So far I'm never had to worm. But one thing I do know is that using an herbal approach when needed is my first choice because the herbs come at the issues from a multi-facited approach which makes it much less likely that the parasites, or bacteria, or virus can become resistant.


I'm sure I could elaborate and define many of these statements if anyone wants to put up with it ....but will quit for now

 

[Leahs Mom]

Forgot to say lots of thing I imagine....

I don't use medicated feeds for new chicks.

Start my chicks (that don't have a broody mamma) using litter from the existing hen house so they're exposed to the environment right from the start. If they have a broody mamma, that happens naturally. This also helps them start out with an immune system that is exposed to things they need to be able to build up immunity to.

If no broody, add plugs of soil/grass into the brooder as well from areas the adult birds run in. They love to dig in the soil and they get exposed to the balance of good and bad bacteria, etc.

Part of the deep litter situation for chicks is that it does allow for a reasonable amount of ammonia. EEEK...DID SHE SAY AMMONIA? QUICK, GET OUT THE DISINFECTANT! Okay...really, the research is that if there is a bit of ammonia in the litter, it keeps cocci under control.

Quote: http://www.plamondon.com/wp/deep-litter-chicken-coops/


THIS IS NOT TO SAY THAT THERE IS A LOT OF AMMONIA IN THE LITTER!!!! If I can smell ammonia something is wrong. Just noting that deep litter is possibly helpful toward cocci level control if done well.


I don't use antibiotics routinely (really, never at all). I imagine I might use if I thought there was an emergency need, but, again, would check the environment I've provided to find out if remediation was needed. I've also studied herbal antibiotics enough to know which I'd use in an emergency that are useful against anti-biotic resistant strains. I imagine the only time I'd need something would be for an injury that needs disinfecting. If these birds are so weak immune-wise that major diseases are an issue, then husbandry needs to be re-thought.


Hmmmm...... didn't she say that she was going to quit.....


Anyone interested in hearing what the farm vet told me about worming and cocci?

 

[Leahs Mom]

PS: I could have just said "What @oldhenlikesdogs said and never written a post. Would have saved a lot of reading