The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[fallenangel79]

sorry about miss gray

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

So ... we're in the middle of processing BBB Turkeys a few at a time (one killing cone, hand plucking) and they are huge at this time of year and I really wish we'd do it sooner, though getting the team enthusiastic about it any sooner wasn't possible. These birds were brought here as "day olds" on the 25th of April... Here they are saying howdy (I hope this link works).

The toms we processed so far have been so strong it is difficult to remove their legs and neck -- they are very meaty birds, but range around a lot strutting their stuff. I think the one we did yesterday started at about 45 lbs and finished at about 35 (excluding feet, neck, gizzard, liver and heart). The Tom looks like an oversized Butterball ... practically round, not super fatty, very photogenic. The one we ate a month or so ago was still very tender and very tasty, so I hope these birds are equally good as they are going to customers.

The hen started at 35 lbs and was very fatty inside -- I don't have a dressed weight for her, but I can get one today. I'm surprised she was so fatty considering how active the hens are. They have picked a spot rather far away from their coop to lay their eggs, and are much more active foragers than the toms. They climb stairs to come to the kitchen deck to invite me outside to play. The hen we processed yesterday is more streamlined than the tom, but still has a good sized double breasts and nice thick drumsticks. I was a little surprised at how fatty the hen was, and this alone is reason enough for me to process the bird earlier ... I ended up pulling the fat out of her and throwing it away, which is "wasted feed", and BBB turkeys at this age/size are NOT easy keepers (meaning they eat a LOT, so it is better to stop feeding them and process them soon after they stop making muscle and start making extra fat, meaning processing should have happened sooner for at least that hen). The hen was laying, and I always think that is super interesting during processing.

One tip I discovered yesterday (finally -- I've already dressed a few of the toms) was that starting on the backside of the bird after plucking ... take off the head, oil gland, and feet (obviously -- and on the stronger birds some twisting really helps things pull apart so you can find the space between the bones to cut the tendons), but then remove ALL of the neck. Meaning slice the back of the skin open well up (down?) the neck to between the "shoulders" of the bird. Spend some time separating the skin from the bones/muscle ... and also separating the layer of connective tissue and the two "tubes" from both the skin and the bone/muscle of the neck. Then remove the neck at the first neck bone. Then flip the bird over to continue separating the skin from the connective tissue. This really helps you find and remove the crop, which isn't as distinct on these turkeys even if it is full. I use my fingers to get everything free, but it takes strength and my hands are small and if I have to I will use a knife to get started ... I find the knife a bit awkward and prefer to use my fingers to "feel" where the separation should happen. This makes finding and separating the crop SO much easier, and allows me to pull everything cleanly through the bird when I eviscerate.

The connective tissue in the turkeys is very strong, particularly in the toms, and the neck on the tom is so thick that without removing it down at the very base there isn't a space between the neck and the wishbone big enough to pull the crop through very easily. It also takes me more time to separate the connective tissue in the cavity of the bird before I pull anything through, but it is time well spent. I hope this tip helps me with the rest of the processing so it goes a little easier and faster.

This is a discovery for me as I don't remove the neck when I dress a chicken, and on a chicken the tubes and crop are easier to find and separate from the skin and everything pulls through very easily ...

 

[ki4got]

Lost another Red Star. I decided to do a necropsy. I happy to say I saw NO mites or worms! The first thing I noticed was the skin was green near her vent. Can anyone tell me what I'm looking at and what looks wrong? I know the pictures are small but I had a heck of a time uploading them in a larger format. Thank you in advance for advice & comments!!

I won't argue that it is or isn't egg yolk peritonitis, but usually you see whole or broken egg yolks filling the body cavity.

that bright green tells me it's more to do with gall bladder/bile duct issues... a ruptured gall bladder will coat everything in the green bile juices and stain the organs and skin inside and out.

if you've ever butchered a chicken (or any other animal), you know that you don't want to cut the gall bladder or you get that horrid green gunk over everything and it taints all it touches.

from another post, this is what egg yolk peritonitis looks like early on and not infected...


if infection has set in, usually the entire yellow area becomes crumbly white.

 

[Leahs Mom]

KI - I was wondering the same thing. Unless I missed something, it didn't look like there was yolk inside and the there was way more green. I thought I had read somewhere that green tint inside could also be some kind of metal poisoning and the liver not being able to detox it. Not sure though on that one.

 

[SallyinIndiana]

the turkey video was amusing. They are lovely. I'm curious at what age does the young Turkey look more like a turkey and not a large chicken. I've ordered some baby turkeys for DH's surprise birthday present. I'm wondering how long it will take him to realize they are not chickens.

 

[ki4got]

KI - I was wondering the same thing. Unless I missed something, it didn't look like there was yolk inside and the there was way more green. I thought I had read somewhere that green tint inside could also be some kind of metal poisoning and the liver not being able to detox it. Not sure though on that one.

green could relate to copper salts, but unless she was inhaling pennies or eating chemicals that have copper as a primary ingredient, I wouldn't think it'd be easy to get... even then, copper salts are more blue-green not that horrid bile-green that's very distinctive.

can't photo a smell, but I dare say, if you were to cut open a fresh gall bladder, and compare, I bet she smelled 'bile-ey'...

 

[RedRidge]

LM I am SO sorry about Miss Grey

 

[Gramma Chick]

An article about EY Peritonitis

http://simplelifeainteasy.blogspot.com/2012/03/egg-yolk-peritonitis-diagnosing-sick.html

 

[zinia8]

I am sorry for posting a controversial topic. My intent was for jocular purposes. I am removing my original post and ask that it not be argued about please.
Again I apologize to anyone who has been upset.

Not upset here. I will share alittle on this. Do self exams and if you think something is wrong tell your doctor no matter your age. I was 36 and diagnosed with stage 2b breast cancer with lymphnode involvement. Lumpectomy(2), sentinal node biopisy, chemo and radiation that was 9 yrs ago. My oncologist said yes your young for breast cancer but your not my youngest breast cancer patient.

 

[delisha]

Quote: You sure can do this and it will work great!!

Lost another Red Star. I decided to do a necropsy. I happy to say I saw NO mites or worms! The first thing I noticed was the skin was green near her vent. Can anyone tell me what I'm looking at and what looks wrong? I know the pictures are small but I had a heck of a time uploading them in a larger format. Thank you in advance for advice & comments!!

Green skin near vent
I see a nicked bile duct and gangrene in this photo

Cavity
You can see the discoloration of yolk and infection in this photo..it has infected the muscle tissue also

Liver
The liver is totally diseased and has surface ruptures (little raised bumps) The green smear is the bile
The bile duct is located on the left side of the abdominal cavity so when you slice open a bird...slice on the right.

Ceca?
This might be an infected and gangrene ceca if it is a ceca...the ceca is located behind the intestines..I do not see intestines.. it is huge and remarkable. i would have loved to do this and find out where this stuff was and if the parts are what I think they are. I am thinking this is an egg going threw necrotic development before the uterine part of the oviduct. Like the isthmus part of the oviduct..not positive..but that is my guess..I find this so interesting..



Inside the thing from above.
necrotic tissue

Egg
I would say ovum

Fat or Egg Yolk?
tumors

Gizzard contents


Inside of intestines
those intestines are diseased.

Lung?
more necrotic tissue

Ovaries & Kidneys?
I would say yes..kidneys..necrotic and diseased..ovaries are tiny little yellow balls in different sizes..I might see a few but they are the wrong color..necrotic also

Inside of Spleen--I think
I can't see

Heart?
If that is a heart..she had a heart attack..(blood pool)

One thing i can say about this bird is she has serious stamina...she was very ill.
I suggest you take your next bird that dies into a test lab. This is not simple peritonitis. The cavity would have been filled with liquid too. I honestly think it was something else. Lymphoid Leukosis possibly.

please watch these videos available from the University. It lets you see the how to and what to look fors when doing a necropsy..
I do love to learn and these photos tell a story..thank you again for sharing and allowing us to learn.


http://partnersah.vet.cornell.edu/veterinarians/avian-necropsy-examination/intro-practical