The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[armorfirelady]

Yes....that is definitely a "general statement" about the collar. I'd have to see the specific personality of the dog.

In my dog-owning past (I haven't had one since 2007...for the first time in my life living w/out a dog), our dogs were "pets" and part of the family. NOW, if I get a dog, it will have to have a job and won't be a family pet. If I ever start trying to train a dog for guarding duties I will not keep it if it does not train to the purpose for which I get it.

That is totally different than anything I've ever done before. In the past they were family members and it would have been like giving your kid away ... it was a "life-long" commitment.

Yup my 2 are house dogs & family members. But they are great at keeping unwanted critters out of the yard. Lily is exceptionally good at finding/killing baby bunnies

And I have no squirrels or chipmunks in my yard. They have learned it will be a quick death if they cant out run the dogs lol

 

[SallyinIndiana]

...
Quote:

I need to catch up on NCK.
But as for your question I use a still air incubator as my hatcher. Here are the ways it helps me.
1. I can use my 1588 fancy digital incubator for multiple settings of small batches of eggs of varying sizes.
2. I can have eggs set every 6 days and not need to change the settings on the 1588.
3. I have found it easier to maintain a higher level of humidity without the use of a fan. There is no way to turn the fan off in my fancy incubator. Thus the still air has an advantage for the last 3 days. Still monitoring the temps in the still air can be annoying.
4. I only need two incubators as long as I'm setting smaller batches. If I was to leave the eggs in the incubator they started in, I would need 4 incubators to set eggs every 6 days.

@SallyinIndiana
Could you elaborate on your specific procedure. Are you saying that at day 6 you move the eggs to the "hatcher" incubator?

Sure here is a break down, tt is not always exact as sometimes I will wait more days between batches but this is as condensed as I recommend.
Day 1 Gather and store eggs in a 45 degree cardboard egg carton. I mark the date, the hen, and if the egg was cold (all but frozen). I only keep the good clean single yolk eggs. For now I am setting a few barn yard mixes as I only have 2 laying breeder quality hens.
Day 2 Gather and store. Due to cold weather, I gather / look for eggs frequently until I have gotten all of the eggs for the day. This is where having the time on the stored eggs helps. No need to rush out at 7 am for eggs if all the hens laid around noon the day before.
Day 3 Gather and store, remember to keep changing the tilt on the carton 3 times a day.
Day 4 Gather and store, set up 1588 incubator in the mid afternoon.
Day 5 Gather and store, monitor 1588 to make sure the right well is filled for the humidity level
Day 6 Gather and store, if eggs are gathered by noon and the humidity is good in the 1588 set up to 15 eggs. So far I have not had to toss any eggs to stay at 15 or below. But the first to go after the basic elimination of dirty, porous, 2 yolks, will be the mixed eggs.
Day 7 Set eggs if not on day 6, set by 2 pm to allow for monitoring (it takes time for the bator to get back to temp after adding eggs), gather and store new batch if any eggs are laid after 2 pm. Typically I set on Day 6 but if the bator was not consistent or I was having trouble with the humidity I would delay a day.
Day 8 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 9 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 10 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 11 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 12 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588 If eggs were set on day 6, then set batch 2 of eggs today in the 1588
Day 13 (7 for eggs) Set eggs between noon and 2 pm. Gather and store. Once the room where the incubator is located is dark enough candle and toss from first batch. ****Note this is a day later than the rest of the setting season to allow for the possible setting on day 7 instead of day 6 above. I then candle eggs older than 7 days every other night.
Day 14 Gather and store
Day 15 Since it is the first time of the season to set up the still air, set it up and get temps a bit lower than desired and humidity about right. When the eggs are added the temps increase, sometimes humidity does too but not significantly for me. My still air takes a lot of tweaking and adjustments need 2-4 hours to be consistent so setting up a few days early and leaning how much water and sponges are need is a good thing. Candle + toss
Day 16 Gather and store, Monitor still air closely
Day 17 Gather and store, Have good feelings about the settings on the still air incubator to use for hatching. Candle + toss
Day 18 Gather and store, keep monitoring both the 1588 and still air. If eggs were set on days 6 and 12 then set batch 3 in the 1588 today.
Day 19 between 9 am and noon move the first batch of eggs from the 1588 to the still air. MONITOR the still air to make sure the temp is where you want it and the humidity too. Start the lockdown around 4 pm is all is well, if not keep adjusting but don't open the lid after 7 pm. Candle before setting the eggs in hatcher.
Day 19 Set eggs in 1588, I try to do this the same time as the others are pulled if pulling eggs and setting on the same day.
Day 20 Monitor the still air, I over do watching the still air but... Gather and store eggs for batch 4. Candle + toss from 1588
Day 21 Monitor both incubators squirt in water in the still air if humidity is dropping, don't open lid unless all eggs are hatched. Gather and store
Day 22 Chicks should be coming in the still air. Gather and store. If all eggs are done clean still air and air dry. Candle + toss from 1588
Day 23 Most likely eggs are done hatching, clean still air, if need be blow dry it but with our furnace running so much the bater drys fast. I have a second set of sponges and liners for setting it up again. Set up still air. Should not need a lot of adjustments. Keep gathering and storing eggs.
Day 24 is now day 17 or 18 for batch 2. Go to that day for what to do with batch 2 eggs. Set eggs in 1588 today or tomorrow.
Eventually if eggs are set every 6 days it works out that there are 4 batches of eggs cooking at any given time. If eggs are set every 8 days it is more likely to have only 3 batches of eggs cooking at a given time.

I set eggs based on several factors, but aim for every 6 days. Having only 5 days in between means I break out a second still air for hatching as the other is not done being cleaned and re set up. I like to have the hatcher run for several hours at the right temp / humidity before putting eggs in it. The 1588 I feel more comfortable with the temp not falling suddenly if the furnace slows down a bit.

 

[lazy gardener]

Been using a plastic fount set in a heated dog water dish...might have to go back to using just the dog dish.
.hates big black dogs especially. Tried to get him to look in the mirror once...didn't work.

Scott: Are you using the fount in the heated bowl to keep the chicken's wattles out of the water? I've been setting a filled gallon milk jug in the middle of mine to make a moat. May not work for you b/c your flock is bigger, and you'd need to top off the bowl more often from the milk jug. Is the kettle calling the pot black?

My aggressive, wing flapping, feather puffing hen is broody..... Since it has been years and years and years since we had chickens on the farm and this is my first year for having them on my own... I didn't even realize that is what it was. She does get off of the nest to eat and I collect whatever eggs are there-- except for the wooden egg- which I know put it together that she thinks she is hatching.... She does roost at night though instead of sitting on the nest.... so she isn't too broody.... but she is broody enough that she isn't laying any eggs either....when I separated her for being so nasty to the other hens I thought it strange she was so happy in her own pen....just sitting in a nesting position. I feel extremely stupid that I missed this. We don't have a rooster so she can't hatch anything and I would get her hatching eggs but it sure doesn't seem like she is serious enough if she only sets during the day....isn't she supposed to set at night too? but when she was separated she was very dedicated now that I think about it in hindsight....

I was so worked up about her bossiness that I didn't even realize what was causing it-- I just put it together when I was washing dishes last night and had 5 minutes to myself and was thinking about how she sure does get in the nest a lot and puff her feathers but never lays and then I thought-- hmmm...maybe that is broody behavior?

If you want her to get serious about brooding, how about putting half a dozen golf balls in there? Might work??? Otherwise, you can break her in a pen without bedding.

 

[RedRidge]

...

 
[CONTENTEMBED=/t/729605/the-natural-chicken-keeping-thread-ots-welcome/27810#post_12760960 layout=inline] [/CONTENTEMBED]
I need to catch up on NCK. 

But as for your question I use a still air incubator as my hatcher.   Here are the ways it helps me.

1.  I can use my 1588 fancy digital incubator for multiple settings of small batches of eggs of varying sizes. 
2.  I can have eggs set every 6 days and not need to change the settings on the 1588. 

3.  I have found it easier to maintain a higher level of humidity without the use of a fan.  There is no way to turn the fan off in my fancy incubator. Thus the still air has an advantage for the last 3 days.   Still monitoring the temps in the still air can be annoying.

4.  I only need two incubators as long as I'm setting smaller batches.  If I was to leave the eggs in the incubator they started in, I would need 4 incubators to set eggs every 6 days. 

[CONTENTEMBED=/t/729605/the-natural-chicken-keeping-thread-ots-welcome/27840#post_12762388 layout=inline]
@SallyinIndiana

Could you elaborate on your specific procedure.  Are you saying that at day 6 you move the eggs to the "hatcher" incubator? 
[/CONTENTEMBED]

Sure here is a break down,  tt is not always exact as sometimes I will wait more days between batches but this is as condensed as I recommend.
Day 1 Gather and store eggs in a 45 degree cardboard egg carton.  I mark the date, the hen, and if the egg was cold (all but frozen).  I only keep the good clean single yolk eggs.  For now I am setting a few barn yard mixes as I only have 2 laying breeder quality hens.

Day 2 Gather and store.  Due to cold weather, I gather / look for eggs frequently until I have gotten all of the eggs for the day.  This is where having the time on the stored eggs helps.  No need to rush out at 7 am for eggs if all the hens laid around noon the day before.

Day 3 Gather and store, remember to keep changing the tilt on the carton 3 times a day. 

Day 4 Gather and store, set up 1588 incubator in the mid afternoon.
Day 5 Gather and store, monitor 1588 to make sure the right well is filled for the humidity level
Day 6 Gather and store, if eggs are gathered by noon and the humidity is good in the 1588 set up to 15 eggs.  So far I have not had to toss any eggs to stay at 15 or below.  But the first to go after the basic elimination of dirty, porous, 2 yolks, will be the mixed eggs.

Day 7 Set eggs if not on day 6, set by 2 pm to allow for monitoring (it takes time for the bator to get back to temp after adding eggs), gather and store new batch if any eggs are laid after 2 pm.  Typically I set on Day 6 but if the bator was not consistent or I was having trouble with the humidity I would delay a day.
Day 8 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 9 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 10 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 11 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 12 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588 If eggs were set on day 6, then set batch 2 of eggs today in the 1588
Day 13 (7 for eggs) Set eggs between noon and 2 pm.  Gather and store.  Once the room where the incubator is located is dark enough candle and toss from first batch. ****Note this is a day later than the rest of the setting season to allow for the possible setting on day 7 instead of day 6 above.   I then candle eggs older than 7 days every other night.

Day 14 Gather and store
Day 15 Since it is the first time of the season to set up the still air, set it up and get temps a bit lower than desired and humidity about right.  When the eggs are added the temps increase, sometimes humidity does too but not significantly for me.  My still air takes a lot of tweaking and adjustments need 2-4 hours to be consistent so setting up a few days early and leaning how much water and sponges are need is a good thing.  Candle + toss

Day 16 Gather and store, Monitor still air closely
Day 17 Gather and store, Have good feelings about the settings on the still air incubator to use for hatching. Candle + toss
Day 18 Gather and store, keep monitoring both the 1588 and still air. If eggs were set on days 6 and 12 then set batch 3 in the 1588 today.
Day 19 between 9 am and noon move the first batch of eggs from the 1588 to the still air.  MONITOR the still air to make sure the temp is where you want it and the humidity too.  Start the lockdown around 4 pm is all is well, if not keep adjusting but don't open the lid after 7 pm.  Candle before setting the eggs in hatcher.
Day 19 Set eggs in 1588, I try to do this the same time as the others are pulled if pulling eggs and setting on the same day.
Day 20 Monitor the still air, I over do watching the still air but...  Gather and store eggs for batch 4.  Candle + toss from 1588
Day 21 Monitor both incubators squirt in water in the still air if humidity is dropping, don't open lid unless all eggs are hatched.  Gather and store
Day 22 Chicks should be coming in the still air.  Gather and store. If all eggs are done clean still air and air dry. Candle + toss from 1588

Day 23 Most likely eggs are done hatching, clean still air, if need be blow dry it but with our furnace running so much the bater drys fast.  I have a second set of sponges and liners for setting it up again.  Set up still air.  Should not need a lot of adjustments.  Keep gathering and storing eggs.
Day 24 is now day 17 or 18 for batch 2.  Go to that day for what to do with batch 2 eggs.  Set eggs in 1588 today or tomorrow.

Eventually if eggs are set every 6 days it works out that there are 4 batches of eggs cooking at any given time.  If eggs are set every 8 days it is more likely to have only 3 batches of eggs cooking at a given time. 


I set eggs based on several factors, but aim for every 6 days.  Having only 5 days in between means I break out a second still air for hatching as the other is not done being cleaned and re set up.  I like to have the hatcher run for several hours at the right temp / humidity before putting eggs in it.  The 1588 I feel more comfortable with the  temp not falling suddenly if the furnace slows down a bit.

This is basically what I am doing but am setting eggs every 5 days. I use two 47 egg Styrofoam bators with auto turners to set eggs. I use an Octagon 24 to hatch because it is so easy to keep my humidity up in it.

 

[CourtsCacklers]

Scott: Are you using the fount in the heated bowl to keep the chicken's wattles out of the water? I've been setting a filled gallon milk jug in the middle of mine to make a moat. May not work for you b/c your flock is bigger, and you'd need to top off the bowl more often from the milk jug. Is the kettle calling the pot black?

If you want her to get serious about brooding, how about putting half a dozen golf balls in there? Might work??? Otherwise, you can break her in a pen without bedding.

Yeah....Lazy Gardner... I am now debating on whether to attempt breaking her or if I should entertain her with hatching eggs if she persists.... Though I use the eggs and like when they are laying which has slowed a little....It would be fun to have her brood some chicks. I do not have an incubator or any other back-up plan if she just decides she is done with it though.... then I would just be 'out of luck'...

 

[Scott H]

As for E-Collars...so many people think that they are for punishing. They are not. Used properly, they are used to "steer" a dog to the behavior you want. I highly recommend Dogtra E Collars because they offer a rheostat control for the amount of correction desired. You can hold the "transmit" button down with a finger and slowly turn up the juice with your thumb until the dog complies to the command you are giving.
To have Jake walk on heel, like he was on a leash, it took very little stimulation. I couldn't feel it pressed into my palm it was so minute.He used to run other dogs, not only off the property, but out of the country so we started leaving the collar on him to change this behavior. One day, when he was young, he took off after another dog and as I called him I was turning up the rheostat dial. I couldn't believe how much juice it took him to start a U-turn back to me. When he started to comply I started to turn the rheostat down and by the time he got back to me there was no juice to his neck. Then he got praise. Good Boy. You are not the bad guy and he decides the amount of juice he gets.

Here is a great page to train you about training your dog using an E collar....

E Collar Introduction

I highly recommend researching E Collars before using them. It bothers me when I hear people say something like, "wait til I get that collar on him and he starts to do XYZ...I'll really light him up! That's not how to use them.

Five Myths About Shock Collars
Off soap box now.

 

[aoxa]

Sure here is a break down, tt is not always exact as sometimes I will wait more days between batches but this is as condensed as I recommend.
Day 1 Gather and store eggs in a 45 degree cardboard egg carton. I mark the date, the hen, and if the egg was cold (all but frozen). I only keep the good clean single yolk eggs. For now I am setting a few barn yard mixes as I only have 2 laying breeder quality hens.
Day 2 Gather and store. Due to cold weather, I gather / look for eggs frequently until I have gotten all of the eggs for the day. This is where having the time on the stored eggs helps. No need to rush out at 7 am for eggs if all the hens laid around noon the day before.
Day 3 Gather and store, remember to keep changing the tilt on the carton 3 times a day.
Day 4 Gather and store, set up 1588 incubator in the mid afternoon.
Day 5 Gather and store, monitor 1588 to make sure the right well is filled for the humidity level
Day 6 Gather and store, if eggs are gathered by noon and the humidity is good in the 1588 set up to 15 eggs. So far I have not had to toss any eggs to stay at 15 or below. But the first to go after the basic elimination of dirty, porous, 2 yolks, will be the mixed eggs.
Day 7 Set eggs if not on day 6, set by 2 pm to allow for monitoring (it takes time for the bator to get back to temp after adding eggs), gather and store new batch if any eggs are laid after 2 pm. Typically I set on Day 6 but if the bator was not consistent or I was having trouble with the humidity I would delay a day.
Day 8 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 9 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 10 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 11 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588
Day 12 Gather and store / Monitor humidity in 1588 If eggs were set on day 6, then set batch 2 of eggs today in the 1588
Day 13 (7 for eggs) Set eggs between noon and 2 pm. Gather and store. Once the room where the incubator is located is dark enough candle and toss from first batch. ****Note this is a day later than the rest of the setting season to allow for the possible setting on day 7 instead of day 6 above. I then candle eggs older than 7 days every other night.
Day 14 Gather and store
Day 15 Since it is the first time of the season to set up the still air, set it up and get temps a bit lower than desired and humidity about right. When the eggs are added the temps increase, sometimes humidity does too but not significantly for me. My still air takes a lot of tweaking and adjustments need 2-4 hours to be consistent so setting up a few days early and leaning how much water and sponges are need is a good thing. Candle + toss
Day 16 Gather and store, Monitor still air closely
Day 17 Gather and store, Have good feelings about the settings on the still air incubator to use for hatching. Candle + toss
Day 18 Gather and store, keep monitoring both the 1588 and still air. If eggs were set on days 6 and 12 then set batch 3 in the 1588 today.
Day 19 between 9 am and noon move the first batch of eggs from the 1588 to the still air. MONITOR the still air to make sure the temp is where you want it and the humidity too. Start the lockdown around 4 pm is all is well, if not keep adjusting but don't open the lid after 7 pm. Candle before setting the eggs in hatcher.
Day 19 Set eggs in 1588, I try to do this the same time as the others are pulled if pulling eggs and setting on the same day.
Day 20 Monitor the still air, I over do watching the still air but... Gather and store eggs for batch 4. Candle + toss from 1588
Day 21 Monitor both incubators squirt in water in the still air if humidity is dropping, don't open lid unless all eggs are hatched. Gather and store
Day 22 Chicks should be coming in the still air. Gather and store. If all eggs are done clean still air and air dry. Candle + toss from 1588
Day 23 Most likely eggs are done hatching, clean still air, if need be blow dry it but with our furnace running so much the bater drys fast. I have a second set of sponges and liners for setting it up again. Set up still air. Should not need a lot of adjustments. Keep gathering and storing eggs.
Day 24 is now day 17 or 18 for batch 2. Go to that day for what to do with batch 2 eggs. Set eggs in 1588 today or tomorrow.
Eventually if eggs are set every 6 days it works out that there are 4 batches of eggs cooking at any given time. If eggs are set every 8 days it is more likely to have only 3 batches of eggs cooking at a given time.

I set eggs based on several factors, but aim for every 6 days. Having only 5 days in between means I break out a second still air for hatching as the other is not done being cleaned and re set up. I like to have the hatcher run for several hours at the right temp / humidity before putting eggs in it. The 1588 I feel more comfortable with the temp not falling suddenly if the furnace slows down a bit.

That's a lot of detail!

I collect eggs after work, and mark the date and breed on each egg and store at 50F. I do not turn the eggs, as it is not needed if they are only held for 7 days.

My Sportsman is now going to be constantly running until May 28th. I set eggs weekly, every Wednesday. That way I can have people pick them up every Saturday once they dry off, fluff up and get their land legs.

Day 17 I candle looking for any early internal pips. I once had 30 barred rocks hatch 3 and 4 days early, so I candle day 17 once, day 18 twice, day 19 three times. I don't put them in the hatcher until they have internally pipped. I stop turning them on day 18 either way, and increase humidity only once they have internally pipped (thanks Del for sharing this technique, my hatch rates have gone WAY up).

I have two 1588 Genesis incubators for hatching. I am not sure the capacity for hatching, anyone know? I did have 65 silkie eggs in it before, and room for more. How many standard eggs can it hold without turner?

Anyway.. It helps to have two in case I am hatching mutts or two breeds that look similar.

 

[SallyinIndiana]

I like the setting on Wed. plan to have a good pickup for Saturday. I may have to convert over to it. I had been trying to time it to hit the almanac days, just to see if there was a difference between the batches.

 

[Leahs Mom]

Thanks Sally, Red Ridge & Aoxa. Just finished reading through.

That helps (at least me) have a better understanding of the procedures and how you use the "hatcher" vs. the "incubator". And I LOVE the detail. Really helps me grasp the process much better.

*************************************

Now another question for you both.

Some of the folks here will never hatch for others (or maybe will graduate to doing that) but will hatch some for themselves every once in awhile.

-How would you do things if you were just hatching a few for yourself? Do you just take the turner out of the incubator and let them hatch in the same incubator? Or do you still recommend that they have a second for hatching?

 

[RedRidge]

Thanks Sally, Red Ridge & Aoxa.  Just finished reading through.

That helps (at least me) have a better understanding of the procedures and how you use the "hatcher" vs. the "incubator".  And I LOVE the detail.  Really helps me grasp the process much better.

*************************************

Now another question for you both.

Some of the folks here will never hatch for others (or maybe will graduate to doing that) but will hatch some for themselves every once in awhile. 

-How would you do things if you were just hatching a few for yourself?    Do you just take the turner out of the incubator and let them hatch in the same incubator?  Or do you still recommend that they have a second for hatching?

If I wasn't in a hurry and was just hatching for me, I would just use my Octagon. I love it... It does it all... It is just too small for my needs. Mine has the turning cradle so I just take out off the cradle on day 18, increase the humidity and have had a very high hatch rate with it.
Even though it's too small I have been looking for a used gqf or dickey cabinet bator and haven't found one so I'm still using it.