The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[Lacy Blues]

Facing the Music: Deep litter ain't working in my linoleum-floored coop. I've done all the things - put some compost/dirt down to get it started, throw scratch in to get the girls to kick it up. I rake around the area under the roost to keep it from piling up. But there's no composting of any kind happening. I think I'm ready to suck it up and just deal with the cost of keeping a minimal layer of pine on the floor and replacing the litter once a month. This is the only time I actually wish the coop were smaller - it takes a lot of pine to make a 2" layer in a 12 by 12 foot space. I also kind of hate that this means chickens skittering all over the place when they jump down from the roost. I'll have to build a ramp for them. In my spare time.

So. Before I give up completely, is there something I missed that might make deep litter work for me?

Is your coop elevated? A 12x12 coop, I'd think would be on the ground... and if it is, why do you have a linoleum floor?

 

[hoosiercheetah]

Is your coop elevated? A 12x12 coop, I'd think would be on the ground... and if it is, why do you have a linoleum floor?

It used to be a garden shed, so the floor sits on 4" tall floor framing. I put in linoleum because the floor is plywood and I didn't want it to rot.

I'd have ripped the floor out, but the walls sit on top of it, so I can't really do that.

Or could I? Maybe that's the answer? I'll have to look into it.

 

[ChickChickChicky]

It used to be a garden shed, so the floor sits on 4" tall floor framing. I put in linoleum because the floor is plywood and I didn't want it to rot.

I'd have ripped the floor out, but the walls sit on top of it, so I can't really do that.

Or could I? Maybe that's the answer? I'll have to look into it.

For deep litter to work in that situation you'd likely need to add moisture. I doesn't take a lot, but some is definitely needed for composting to occur. The linoleum has no effect whatsoever. Consider spraying it rather frequently with a LAB mix http://theunconventionalfarmer.com/recipes/lactobacillus-serum/

 

[hoosiercheetah]

It used to be a garden shed, so the floor sits on 4" tall floor framing. I put in linoleum because the floor is plywood and I didn't want it to rot.

I'd have ripped the floor out, but the walls sit on top of it, so I can't really do that.

Or could I? Maybe that's the answer? I'll have to look into it.

Yep. I can cut the floor out. Problem solved.

BYC is my favorite place to think out loud. ;-)



Also I love quoting myself.

 

[Leahs Mom]

@hoosiercheetah
I have a vinyl floor and situation very like yours.

Here's the deal as far as I understand.

On a vinyl floor you aren't going to have the same "composting" effect as you will have on a dirt floor. It does take the moisture from the ground and the weather elements to have a good compost situation going. You could spray w/a LAB type solution if you really want to help it along to break down inside. The will still take time without the weather and natural ground situation.

I do use deep litter in the shed on the vinyl. But I don't expect it to "compost" or break down the same way it will when used on a dirt floor.

I do the things you mentioned - put some regular dirt inside on the floor and sometimes add a little moisture, etc. I don't do the deep litter for the purpose of composting/break-down. I do it for the health benefits it adds so I'm not too concerned about the indoor litter breaking down.

After my litter gets pretty deep, I put most of it into the outdoor run where it is on a dirt base. With the rain and other elements going on out there, over the course of the year, it makes some of the best, most healthy soil you'll ever see. I just keep putting it out there - in addition to the wood chips I get from the tree service. The chickens scratch through it and it's healthy. Sometime I even go out w/a shovel and turn over some of the soil under it and they go nuts harvesting worms and other tasty things.


So..if it's composting you want, the dirt floor is really the way that is going to happen. But that doesn't negate the health benefits of the indoor deep litter. And if you really want to get that indoor litter composting more, I'd do the LABS and continue to throw in some of the outdoor dirt from time to time.

 

[LindaB220]

@hoosiercheetah
I have a vinyl floor and situation very like yours.

Here's the deal as far as I understand.

On a vinyl floor you aren't going to have the same "composting" effect as you will have on a dirt floor. It does take the moisture from the ground and the weather elements to have a good compost situation going. You could spray w/a LAB type solution if you really want to help it along to break down inside. The will still take time without the weather and natural ground situation.

I do use deep litter in the shed on the vinyl. But I don't expect it to "compost" or break down the same way it will when used on a dirt floor.

I do the things you mentioned - put some regular dirt inside on the floor and sometimes add a little moisture, etc. I don't do the deep litter for the purpose of composting/break-down. I do it for the health benefits it adds so I'm not too concerned about the indoor litter breaking down.

After my litter gets pretty deep, I put most of it into the outdoor run where it is on a dirt base. With the rain and other elements going on out there, over the course of the year, it makes some of the best, most healthy soil you'll ever see. I just keep putting it out there - in addition to the wood chips I get from the tree service. The chickens scratch through it and it's healthy. Sometime I even go out w/a shovel and turn over some of the soil under it and they go nuts harvesting worms and other tasty things.


So..if it's composting you want, the dirt floor is really the way that is going to happen. But that doesn't negate the health benefits of the indoor deep litter. And if you really want to get that indoor litter composting more, I'd do the LABS and continue to throw in some of the outdoor dirt from time to time.

An easier cheaper way is to take some of the fermented feed you make and add to a bunch of water. Let sit for a day and start spraying or sprinkling.

 

[hoosiercheetah]

Thank you for the replies! I'll feel better about keeping my litter until I can cut the floor and get it down on the dirt.

I have been dumping some in the run for the chickens to play in and spread out. They're remarkably efficient at it.

 

[Leahs Mom]

One thing I want to add...

With all the talk of adding moisture, there needs to be caution added too

If moisture is added, you must be careful not to create an environment that is conducive to mold growth that can lead to the birds getting aspergillosis. A LAB solution is great as it would deter the growth of molds. The soil from your garden, etc., will carry a little dampness with it also. When adding those, a good raking to mix things around should be okay.

Just be sure not to have wet/damp food sitting in the indoor litter or wet spots - like around a leaking waterer. These are vectors for mold growth over time.


If I ever have a wet area, from a broken waterer for example, I can usually rake it and mix it into the whole litter to spread a little moisture around. But If it had been sitting there for awhile and I didn't realize it was broken and leaking, I will remove the wet litter completely from that spot just to be safe. Aspergillosis is not something you want to tempt or experience

 

[hoosiercheetah]

One thing I want to add...

With all the talk of adding moisture, there needs to be caution added too

If moisture is added, you must be careful not to create an environment that is conducive to mold growth that can lead to the birds getting aspergillosis. A LAB solution is great as it would deter the growth of molds. The soil from your garden, etc., will carry a little dampness with it also. When adding those, a good raking to mix things around should be okay.

Just be sure not to have wet/damp food sitting in the indoor litter or wet spots - like around a leaking waterer. These are vectors for mold growth over time.


If I ever have a wet area, from a broken waterer for example, I can usually rake it and mix it into the whole litter to spread a little moisture around. But If it had been sitting there for awhile and I didn't realize it was broken and leaking, I will remove the wet litter completely from that spot just to be safe. Aspergillosis is not something you want to tempt or experience

Rog.

 

[Lacy Blues]

That was an excellent idea LindaB220. I hadn't thought of that as a shortcut to get the LABs going for spraying in the coop litter. I will do that.

hoosiercheetah, if you're going to remove the floor, you'll need to plan on predator prevention. As your floor is now, they cannot get in, but once you remove that floor, your coop will still be raised (right?) and predators will be able to smell them a lot better. Or if its sitting down on the ground and you cut out the floor, a predator will only need to dig under the outside wall. Adding a lot of stone if you have it, pavers if you don't, or hardware cloth attached to the building and held down with whatever you can get together along those lines will keep them out.