The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[SherrieC]

I'm really sorry about MG

It looks like one of my Wyandottes have decided to go broody, I was thinking about getting eggs even though we're almost 1/3 of the way into winter but then this afternoon I found what I think are tapeworm segments in one of the poos. It's the first time I've seen it and I always keep an eye on their poos so I don't know how long it's been a problem for and who did that poo. They did eat fresh chilli, garlic, turmeric, cayenne etc today (I do this atleast a few times a week) so I don't know if that's why I see them but they're still alive ewww

 

[slordaz]

Jules,my thinking is that if there was mold they would have spores in their systems still and that is why they aren't getting better, take a sample or one of the chickens and have the vet test it to see what it is as it would be a different type of treatment needed depending on the fungus present but once it's gone they should improve.

SherrieC. That bird looks to have a heavy load of worms, I don't like to use chemicals but your bird would probably love you for it.

JFYI one thing I do for my large dogs is give them about a cigarette amount of tobacco once every few month to keep them free from worms, for chickens you should only need a a stand or 2 though

sorry not on much right now, we getting extreme heat keeping a close eye on birds.

 

[tjo804]

I know the regular wormers do not work on tape worms for the cats and dogs I think they use capstar but I dont know what the active ingredient is nor if it is safe for chickens. I do not know what you can use in a chicken to get rid of them. I would be really interested to know this. And yes they look alive and crawley, My vet told me those are the eggs. the dropped segments. so anyone that snacks on the poo will also be infected.
Please keep us posted on how you get rid of them.

 

[Leahs Mom]

@JulesChicks
Any updates? Have you decided what you're going to do?

 

[JulesChicks]

Nope. But I'm leaning toward keeping them and maybe treating the sick ones. In doing some research I found Denagard, which is not used in humans and (I don't think) there is a withdrawal time. Does anyone have experience with this? It's not natural of course and it's expensive - $50/bottle (that would be more than I need). Also, I'm looking at using Oxine to disinfect the tractor and anywhere the birds have been. It biodegrades to table salt. I need to figure out if I would treat just the 3 sick ones, all 6 in the tractor or then entire flock. So, if hubby is ok with it (the extra $) this may be the route I take. The Oxine would need a fogger, which is an expense, but it is an excellent disinfectant and is very easy to use - you can fog everything including the birds and water bowls, feed bowls. You can put a small amount in the water too to keep down algae and biofilm. One lady I read about said she alternates between the Oxine and probiotics/electrolytes in the water. Here is the link to her page - very informative!
http://www.shagbarkbantams.com/oxine.htm

I'll let you all know what I end up doing. Thanks for the support!

 

[JulesChicks]

dutchlion, here's some information you might find interesting. Your mention of mold reminded me.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...istaken-for-crd-mycoplasmosis/60#post_9491676

Jules Chicks, here's one for you.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/587948/rebuilding-my-farm/270#post_15120657

Thanks for that Lacy, really interesting story. That young man is pretty amazing. I think though, that he restarted too soon after the first outbreak/culling. He had eggs in the bator while he was culling his flock and this was in late fall in MI. MG needs 30 days of warm, dry weather before it dies out in the environment (after culling and disinfecting), our vet said longer in colder/wet weather. So, this young man didn't even wait the whole month and it was colder/wetter weather (I presume - October-Nov I think it was) in MI. I think he is good now (it's been years) and lots of people learned from him. I wish I had known his story before I started. I did learn about the Oxine and the Denagard at the end of the thread too.

 

[Lacy Blues]

You're welcome. Keep us posted on how things go for you, ok?

 

[Leahs Mom]

Thanks for the update!

I imagine you've read about oxine pretty well, but I did want to just re-caution you NOT TO USED IT ACTIVATED around the animals. NON-ACTIVATED only.

There is some controversy about Oxine in it's unactivated form - whether it does what the claims are too. I have a gallon of it sitting around here in my first aid cabinet but not sure if I'll ever use it or not.

 

[JulesChicks]

I would use it un-activated. Do you have any sources I can read about the controversy before I make an investment in it? Thanks!

 

[Leahs Mom]

This thread mentions some of the questions and controversy:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...re-usage-dosage-storage-etc/110#post_13824134

I quoted a couple quotes from that thread below.

If you read through the successive comments in that thread, it talks about what various sources are saying. Seems that the manufacturer disagrees with what some of the other sources are saying...

(This thread also had some sources for foggers...and you "could" just use a cool mist vaporizer and shut up the coop.)



My disclaimer: I post this for reference so you have something to read through and consider - not as a recommendation for course of action. I encourage everyone to always be aware that using sanitation products can have unexpected results that you may not want in the long-term. As soon as you start to disinfect, you also disturb the natural bacterial/yeast/fungas etc. balance that help prevent overgrowth of unwanted or resistant strains so if you choose to use these products, you'll want to do everything you can to restore balance as soon as possible.

The folks posting on the byc thread quoted appear to be folks that routinely use disinfectants, antibiotic drinking water solutions, etc. This kind of husbandry would not be in keeping with "natural chicken keeping" husbandry methods or recommendations.

I have been using Oxine AH (activated/diluted) for a couple of years on my horses feet to clear up fungal issues (works great!) and sometimes for various uses regarding my chickens. I have read a lot of threads here (including the famous Shagbark Bantams article) and other things on the Internet as well as the bottle itself. It is good stuff as many have stated. I always questioned that the non-activated state would actually kill viruses, bacteria etc.

Finally I decided to write the company to get more clarity on what Oxine does Activated vs Non-Activated. I thought it would be helpful for people here. The main concern is does Oxine AH KILL bacteria, virus, etc. in the Non Activated state or must it be Activated in a backyard poultry use. Here is the response I got from the makers of Oxine AH:

"Oxine AH needs to be activated to kill viruses, bacteria.
Nonactivated Oxine AH is a Bacteriostat and Fungistat and inhibits growth.

Regards,

Trudy Spradlin
Director Of Customer Relations
Bio-Cide International, Inc.
800.323.1398
[email protected]"

So this means that the Non-activated (widely recommended here) will not kill the bacteria, but will inhibit growth. This is great for preventative or helping to control the growth of existing bacteria, etc. Perhaps best used as a preventative in regular cleaning. IF it works for respiratory ailments, my GUESS is that is slows the illness (oxine inhibiting continued growth of virus, bacteria) enough to help the chicken's immune response to take care of the illness and get back to good health.

However, if you feel it necessary to KILL virus, bacteria, fungus, etc. (such as a known and serious outbreak) then you would need to follow directions properly to use Oxine in an ACTIVATED form. THIS MEANS REMOVING YOUR CHICKENS BEFORE BEGINNING IT'S USE AND WEARING A RESPIRATOR MASK with PROPER VENTILATION. READ and FOLLOW THE DIRECTIONS IN FULL!!

I have used the activated and diluted solution in a spray bottle on my horses frogs (underside of feet) with great success and have sprayed my brooder cages with the activated solution after moving the now grown chicks to the coop. I have also used the Non-activated solution to fog my juveniles a couple of times a day when a few began to cough. Within a few days, they were all better. Once you mix a solution up (activated or not) it loses potency in time, so this is not something you can make up and use a week later. I mix it up and use immediately for best results.

Anyway, I really hope this helps clarify for anyone wondering as I did, what we should expect from Oxine AH and how best to use it.

(edited to add: you can find many places here on BYC, the internet and especially the bottle itself on how to use and mix Oxine AH for your application)

Quote: Seminole Wind https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...re-usage-dosage-storage-etc/110#post_13824864

Here is the info on the manufacturer's web site:
http://www.bio-cide.com/applications/animal-health/oxine-ah/

This is one of the sources that the thread talks about and all the claims made there that don't seem to be endorsed by the mfgr:
http://www.shagbarkbantams.com/oxine.htm

Also take a look all the way at the bottom of this page to see the things they've noted:
https://sites.google.com/a/poultrypedia.com/poultrypedia/chicken-fungal-infections