The Plymouth Rock Breeders thread

[Fred's Hens]

A poultry judge can only judge the birds that show up. If a bird has no competition within it's variety at all, of course it gets tagged Best Variety but it is a somewhat hollow award. Many times, a judge has no choice. How many birds are there in that variety? Next, how many Plymouth Rocks, all varieites, cooped in? With 30+ Rocks shown, the judge is gonna pick a pretty good bird for BB, Best of Breed.

The real award is when a bird wins Champion American Class in a grouping of 150-200 really good birds. Now THAT'S a win worth crowing about. It means you had the best Rock, Red, Hamp, Wyandotte, Buckeye, etc, at the show. That's impressive and why only Ch Am can go onto champion row with a chance to compete against all the other champions for Best Large Fowl and/or Best of Show.

If you want to see Rocks with wrong backlines, go to most any show or just look for yourself on the FB pages where folks post birds. Shrug.
We need to breed Standard bred Rocks and show them to all the fanciers, fellow breeders and judges. That's our job, not the judges job.

Finally, read the Standard. Go by the written word. The end.

 

[Beekissed]

Will do! It helps me to see that SOP print, as I was starting to get an idea in my mind that all my hens would need that really horizontal backline but I can relax a bit now.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Male

Back: Rather long, broad its entire length, flat at shoulders, nearly horizontal from neck to saddle, then showing a slight concave sweep to tail.

Female

Back: Rather long, broad its entire length, flat at the shoulders, extending with a slightly concave incline to tail; feathers moderately broad.

 

[chicken pickin]

This is a cockerel you got from me?

OK, let's look at him. First his head and comb. The comb follows the skull nicely. Next his top line. It's a bit "down hill" but he's young and perhaps he's caught in a poor pose. Check that top line in real life. He still has sooooo much more time to finish, but his tail is coming in and it will be interesting to see it full adult furnished form.

I can safely predict that chest will really blossom and be something nice. You say his legs seem to get farther and farther apart. THAT is a good thing. To my taste, his wing is really nice. The legs are a nice yellow.

So, there you have it. He's quite nice. Yes, I would certainly give him a family, if you can. Unless he turns really goofy in finishing up, he'd be a keeper. He's pure XW/GSBR and it is interesting how some are darker and some are very, very light in overall appearance. Just the way it is with these birds.

This is a older post from earlier in this thread and Fred comments on the darker vs lighter appearance in the males. I see him say "Just the way it is with these birds."

I also have both darker and lighter males so I understand we will see both among flocks, but was curious if there is an actual preference in the dark or light. My eye is instantly drawn to the lighter males, they seem crisper and cleaner barred where some of the darker males while having nice barring they seem smudgy or sooty almost.

 

[Egghead_Jr]

Chicken Pickin, I think It would be nice if a flock throws both male coloring and female coloring. Maybe it's due to a recent crossing of lines and a lot of genetic diversity throwing out the different males. As it's already there you don't have to work so hard to obtain a male and female line for your breeding. If one is inclined to keep two lines of the same variety.

I'm sure your aware that to have the best male exhibition birds they'd come from a male line and the same with best females from a female line. To maintain that darker barring for instance in males (that is called for in the standard) you'd be using the darkest females that are not standard color. In a penciled variety you'd use males with some penciling or lighter colored smudging on chest area to improve the females/increase number of completely penciled birds. Those males would not be standard but desired for a female line.

 

[Fred's Hens]

I choose males based on type first. Big shock there, eh? LOL

Then, what do I need? This year, for example? I need heads. Big, ginormous, Freak Big Heads. I need to "un do" a couple of things tried over the past season or two. I know where the stock is, by and large, who has them, and most of the folks are very honest about what they've done and the choices they've made. I'm a very transparent guy who believes the breed comes first.

So for me, type needs to come first. That said, I also really like a light colored male and love sharp barring, full breasts, wide set legs, proper top line, wide through the tails, good deep heart girth, etc. We dare not fall in love with one or two basic aspects and get all "barn blind" to other important aspects.

A few years back, I hatched the lightest male EVER. Unfortunately, I never got the chance to hatch off him as I lost him to a rogue pitbull attack. That was a very sad day. Maybe I can find a photo of him. I probably would have posted him on here, hmmmm…. three years ago.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Egghead Jr brings up very, very good points. Doubling breeding Barred Rocks has historically been held or believed to be the only way to get the highest eschalon of both males and females for show.

Well, I actually found a couple of photos of that light male. I'm still bummed about him. I had a couple year project that would have worked off him. Sigh.

Anyhow, here is at 10 weeks I suppose.

 

[chicken pickin]

We put about 20 pure XW/GSBR males on the ground this year. I show you some rejects, some possibles and one or two that I believe we will use, if, if they finish well.






This is a reject example. He's headed for freezer camp. Old enough to judge a cull, frankly. I don't like that wing, pinched tail, humpy back line, crow head, etc. He'll taste really good in another 3 or 4 weeks.



Here's a guy that makes the grade. He could well be a finalist. I liked him alot. Don't judge him by my bad photographic skills. In person this is a good young cockerel. Notice he has a proper comb.



Hiding back in the shadows above is an ugly bird. No comment needed.



This is not gold leakage. This guys been rolling in the clay and got himself stained. Plus, the lighting and my camera gives a false impression. I like alot about this hefty guy, but the comb bothers me. Too many birds have this flying rear edge to the comb and we have enough to cull for that this year. Otherwise, a decent young man.



Same comments apply to this guy. He'll be culled. We aren't hurting for males. Freezer camp awaits.



I like this guy. I may give him a reprieve for now. Judge him more harshly later, if needed. Good chest, nice back, decent tail and great width. But…. that comb is't what I'm looking for and concerned his wing finishes correctly. Too many BR males have that down pointing wing feature and I'm not a fan.



This bird is also dirty. But his leg "set" is far too narrow for me. Cull.



I really, really like this young male. He's walking away and would not pose at all. Gosh, what a good young male, and how I wish I had had time to pose him. He's a nice bird, but far too young to pass final judgement. But the comb is good, as well as many other really fine features. I'd like to use this guy over my F1 pullets, if he finishes well, he'd be a good choice.



Ignore the Red who insisted on getting in the photo. He's a cull, BTW. Both of these males are OK. They're spared for now, but they'll have to really show their stuff to make the finals.

As you can see, the males are all penned and yarded up separate now. Males of this age, 15 weeks and up, are a nuisance to pullets who need their own space. We try to pull the sexes apart around 10 weeks, if pens and paddock space allow.

You posted this group a few years back, and the male 2 pics down caught many peoples eye. He may not be the male you are thinking of but he has the nice light appearance and clean crisp barring that I am liking.

 

[Fred's Hens]

That second photo down K? I did use him. Hatched about 50 chicks off him. Culled 99% of them for crow head. You don't always get what you want or expect. We also discovered that he carried a split wing gene and when matched with a female from that line? Most of the chicks got that split wing too. That was to be the last pure GSBR male I would ever use.

 

[chicken pickin]

That second photo down K? I did use him. Hatched about 50 chicks off him. Culled 99% of them for crow head. You don't always get what you want or expect. We also discovered that he carried a split wing gene and when matched with a female from that line? Most of the chicks got that split wing too. That was to be the last pure GSBR male I would ever use.

That's too bad, does go to show you never know what even a nice male or female will throw unless you try.