The Sussex thread!
- Thread starter americana-chick
- Start date
I see the information about creation of the Brussbar, interesting, but wondering about the recreation of the Brown Sussex still - is it in any way similar to Red Sussex?
I just looked at Greenfire's site and they have a picture of a Brown Sussex on their Sussex page but nothing listed about them anymore. I'll send them a message on Facebook and see what they say about them.
- May 19, 2009
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http://sussex.webs.com/restofthesussexcolours.htm
Note the salmon breat on ths lovely hen. technically, it should be pale wheaten brown. Maybe this is because it is e+ hetero or homozygous based. and/or has some Mh in there to (which will darken an e+ salmon breast.)
excellent correct Brown Sussex hen.
the Brown is a classic eWh based coloring.
The Buff is a Black-Tailed Buff(has a lighter back).
The Red is a Black-Tailed Red. More like a New Hampshire coloring.
http://www.irish-poultry.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=85314466
lovely brown sussex rooster
Note the salmon breat on ths lovely hen. technically, it should be pale wheaten brown. Maybe this is because it is e+ hetero or homozygous based. and/or has some Mh in there to (which will darken an e+ salmon breast.)
excellent correct Brown Sussex hen.
the Brown is a classic eWh based coloring.
The Buff is a Black-Tailed Buff(has a lighter back).
The Red is a Black-Tailed Red. More like a New Hampshire coloring.
http://www.irish-poultry.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=85314466
lovely brown sussex rooster
Last edited:
The Red Sussex were the same variety until the early 1900's.
- May 19, 2009
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The Brown Sussex
Ok this is going to take a while. Here is the excerpt from Outram's 1925 , "The Sussex Fowl", regarding the Brown Sussex, "from an 1914 Sussex Poultry Club yearbook article by John Ade, the poultry man who introduced the Brown for acceptance in England and a noted Brown Sussex breeder: Comments on the Brown in their raw state, Pages 34 and 35. "In the early state the Brown presented many difficulties for the fancier to overcome. For instance the breast of the cock had a tendency to throw some red instead of a pure black and the tail commonly had some white feather, whereas pure black was aimed for. In the hen a difficulty was experienced getting the dark motley back and wing together with a pale wheaten breast, also many of the earliest hens were almost devoid of mottling on the wing. These primary difficulties were in the end mastered, the chief difficulty now being the getting of a strong contrast between the color of the back and of the breast, with a freedom from blotchy red feathers below the shoulders.". Thus we see what problem beset the breeders of this variety in pre-war days . (Karen: he writes of WWI.). Outram related the Brown are , "very fine layers of a big deep tinted egg varying often to that of a rich brown color.".
Ok this is going tot take a while. Here is the excerpt from Outram's 1925 , "The Sussex Fowl", regarding the Brown Sussex, "from an 1914 Sussex Poultry Club yearbook article by John Ade, the poultry man who go introduced the brown for acceptance in England and noted Brown Sussex breeder: Comments on the Brown in their raw state, Pages 34 and 35. "In the early state the Brown presented many difficulties for the fancier to overcome. For instance the breast of the cock had a tendency to throw some red instead of a pure black and the tail commonly had some white feather, whereas pure black was aimed for. In the hen a difficulty was experienced getting the dark motley back and wing together with a pale wheaten breast, also many of the earliest hens were almost devoid of mottling on the wing. These primary difficulties were in the end mastered, the chief difficulty now being the getting of a strong contrast between the color of the back and of the breast, with a freedom from blotchy red feathers below the shoulders.". Thus we see what problems beset the breeders of this variety in pre-war days . (Karen: he writes of WWI.). Outram related the Brown are , "very fine layers of a big deep tinted egg varying often to that of a rich brown color.".
Ok, page 35. Here we go on the coloring, " When we first attack the colour subject of this variety it looks as if we are in for some study.
The cock has two "master colours", a top shade which is a dark mahogany, and the underbody a very rich deep beetle green black, the latter being as rich in sheen as possible.
There should be no signs of red or gingeriness, the whole breast colour extending throughout the lower parts of the body including the stern fluff.
The top parts of the bird's body are marked thus:-neck hackle with characteristic Sussex black stripe, not very wide; the shoulders and back rich mahogany and the saddle hackle with a very fine stripe; the tail beetle green and bushy in feather. The wing marking if not clear in color will very much spoil the bird's appearance; there being actually three colours; the bow- deep mahogany, flights- a light brown which is divided from the mahogany by a blue-black bar, this latter really being the flight coverts. All these three colours should be pure and definite in themselves, or the effect will be entirely lost.
Turning our attention to the hen we find ourselves compelled to give a very close study, for we have a colour contrast that, unless it is nearly perfect in combination , all the bird's attractiveness will be lost.
As with the male, there are two "master" colours the whole top part of the body being somewhat a dull brown , whilst the lower is a rather delicate shade of pale wheat. With this color contrast the bird has an appearance of having its body divided in two, and it can be seen that it is quite necessary to have the colours perfect in shade or the effect of the contrast will be lost.
The back and wings of the hen should be finely "peppered" with black, but this peppering must be clearly defined, otherwise the bird will appear to have an almost black back; yellow shafting or any light or red shades of colour must not be seen. The neck hackle should be a dull mahogany brown with the usual characteristic black stripe and the tail a sound black.
Now with the breast colour it is quite important that one light shade of pale wheaten colour should rule throughout, and it must be free of lacing, red tinge, or any foreign colouring, this shade extending to the stern fluff which should fade to almost a grey.
Some breeders assert that to get perfect colour combination in both sexes, it is necessary to resort to double mating, but it has been proved beyond all doubt that this method of breeding is quite unnecessary and that good specimens of each sex can be secured from one breeding pen." end quote.
http://sussex.webs.com/restofthesussexcolours.htm
Note the salmon breast on this lovely hen. Technically, it should be pale wheaten brown. This hen has to be e+ based . The Mh is darkening the salmon breast which should be a pale wheat color if the bird was eWh based. This bird is a Red Duckwing. I have had this color several times in my yard when incorrect Golden Salmon Marans hatched out. GSM are e+/e+ s+/s+ (s-). Red Duckwing are e+/e+ s+/s+ (s-) Mh.
Really nice breed type on this hen.
The Brown Sussex is a classic eWh based coloring.
Here is a Wheaten Marans which is the same, I think:
See the color of the Wheaten hen: http://maransofamericaclub.com/wheatenmarans.php
Note the hen has some red tinges which we would not like to see in our Sussex. It is noteworthy that we have a black stripe in the hackle In e+ poultry the presence or lack of striping in the male hackle has a direct effect on the coloring in the female. Now we have an eWh based variety. I do need to check and see if the presence or lack of a black stripe in the male hackle has any effect on the coloring in the female. We need the striped hackle in any case, it is our SOP. I am just curious of lack of the stripe effects eWh based female coloring.
The Buff Sussex is a Black-Tailed Buff. It has the Co gene, which the Brown Sussex does not.
The Red Sussex is a Black-Tailed Red. More like a New Hampshire coloring.
http://www.irish-poultry.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=85314466
lovely brown Sussex rooster
Best Regards,
Karen
Waterford English Light Sussex
in western PA, USA
Ok this is going to take a while. Here is the excerpt from Outram's 1925 , "The Sussex Fowl", regarding the Brown Sussex, "from an 1914 Sussex Poultry Club yearbook article by John Ade, the poultry man who introduced the Brown for acceptance in England and a noted Brown Sussex breeder: Comments on the Brown in their raw state, Pages 34 and 35. "In the early state the Brown presented many difficulties for the fancier to overcome. For instance the breast of the cock had a tendency to throw some red instead of a pure black and the tail commonly had some white feather, whereas pure black was aimed for. In the hen a difficulty was experienced getting the dark motley back and wing together with a pale wheaten breast, also many of the earliest hens were almost devoid of mottling on the wing. These primary difficulties were in the end mastered, the chief difficulty now being the getting of a strong contrast between the color of the back and of the breast, with a freedom from blotchy red feathers below the shoulders.". Thus we see what problem beset the breeders of this variety in pre-war days . (Karen: he writes of WWI.). Outram related the Brown are , "very fine layers of a big deep tinted egg varying often to that of a rich brown color.".
Ok this is going tot take a while. Here is the excerpt from Outram's 1925 , "The Sussex Fowl", regarding the Brown Sussex, "from an 1914 Sussex Poultry Club yearbook article by John Ade, the poultry man who go introduced the brown for acceptance in England and noted Brown Sussex breeder: Comments on the Brown in their raw state, Pages 34 and 35. "In the early state the Brown presented many difficulties for the fancier to overcome. For instance the breast of the cock had a tendency to throw some red instead of a pure black and the tail commonly had some white feather, whereas pure black was aimed for. In the hen a difficulty was experienced getting the dark motley back and wing together with a pale wheaten breast, also many of the earliest hens were almost devoid of mottling on the wing. These primary difficulties were in the end mastered, the chief difficulty now being the getting of a strong contrast between the color of the back and of the breast, with a freedom from blotchy red feathers below the shoulders.". Thus we see what problems beset the breeders of this variety in pre-war days . (Karen: he writes of WWI.). Outram related the Brown are , "very fine layers of a big deep tinted egg varying often to that of a rich brown color.".
Ok, page 35. Here we go on the coloring, " When we first attack the colour subject of this variety it looks as if we are in for some study.
The cock has two "master colours", a top shade which is a dark mahogany, and the underbody a very rich deep beetle green black, the latter being as rich in sheen as possible.
There should be no signs of red or gingeriness, the whole breast colour extending throughout the lower parts of the body including the stern fluff.
The top parts of the bird's body are marked thus:-neck hackle with characteristic Sussex black stripe, not very wide; the shoulders and back rich mahogany and the saddle hackle with a very fine stripe; the tail beetle green and bushy in feather. The wing marking if not clear in color will very much spoil the bird's appearance; there being actually three colours; the bow- deep mahogany, flights- a light brown which is divided from the mahogany by a blue-black bar, this latter really being the flight coverts. All these three colours should be pure and definite in themselves, or the effect will be entirely lost.
Turning our attention to the hen we find ourselves compelled to give a very close study, for we have a colour contrast that, unless it is nearly perfect in combination , all the bird's attractiveness will be lost.
As with the male, there are two "master" colours the whole top part of the body being somewhat a dull brown , whilst the lower is a rather delicate shade of pale wheat. With this color contrast the bird has an appearance of having its body divided in two, and it can be seen that it is quite necessary to have the colours perfect in shade or the effect of the contrast will be lost.
The back and wings of the hen should be finely "peppered" with black, but this peppering must be clearly defined, otherwise the bird will appear to have an almost black back; yellow shafting or any light or red shades of colour must not be seen. The neck hackle should be a dull mahogany brown with the usual characteristic black stripe and the tail a sound black.
Now with the breast colour it is quite important that one light shade of pale wheaten colour should rule throughout, and it must be free of lacing, red tinge, or any foreign colouring, this shade extending to the stern fluff which should fade to almost a grey.
Some breeders assert that to get perfect colour combination in both sexes, it is necessary to resort to double mating, but it has been proved beyond all doubt that this method of breeding is quite unnecessary and that good specimens of each sex can be secured from one breeding pen." end quote.
http://sussex.webs.com/restofthesussexcolours.htm
Note the salmon breast on this lovely hen. Technically, it should be pale wheaten brown. This hen has to be e+ based . The Mh is darkening the salmon breast which should be a pale wheat color if the bird was eWh based. This bird is a Red Duckwing. I have had this color several times in my yard when incorrect Golden Salmon Marans hatched out. GSM are e+/e+ s+/s+ (s-). Red Duckwing are e+/e+ s+/s+ (s-) Mh.
Really nice breed type on this hen.
The Brown Sussex is a classic eWh based coloring.
Here is a Wheaten Marans which is the same, I think:
See the color of the Wheaten hen: http://maransofamericaclub.com/wheatenmarans.php
Note the hen has some red tinges which we would not like to see in our Sussex. It is noteworthy that we have a black stripe in the hackle In e+ poultry the presence or lack of striping in the male hackle has a direct effect on the coloring in the female. Now we have an eWh based variety. I do need to check and see if the presence or lack of a black stripe in the male hackle has any effect on the coloring in the female. We need the striped hackle in any case, it is our SOP. I am just curious of lack of the stripe effects eWh based female coloring.
The Buff Sussex is a Black-Tailed Buff. It has the Co gene, which the Brown Sussex does not.
The Red Sussex is a Black-Tailed Red. More like a New Hampshire coloring.
http://www.irish-poultry.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=85314466
lovely brown Sussex rooster
Best Regards,
Karen
Waterford English Light Sussex
in western PA, USA
Last edited:
Karen,
thank you for the wonderful information, ive printed it out for reference if I ever find some of the birds. I guess this is what I get for being a collector of breeds
thank you for the wonderful information, ive printed it out for reference if I ever find some of the birds. I guess this is what I get for being a collector of breeds
This is the responce I got from Greenfire when asked if they planed on releasing Brown Sussex.
" Not at this point. The stock we imported turned out to have too much red in their coloring. Sorry."
" Not at this point. The stock we imported turned out to have too much red in their coloring. Sorry."
im guessing that's why I couldn't find them advertised. if anyone hears of any please let me know.
edited to add: I don't mind importing a show quality healthy trio, im not limited to the united states.
Last edited:
- May 19, 2009
- 8,453
- 3,394
- 512
Quote: =======
Sounds like they got the Red Duck Wings , instead of the classic eWh birds.
Best,
Karen
Sounds like they got the Red Duck Wings , instead of the classic eWh birds.
Best,
Karen
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