Toad Raising.

[CindyinSD]

Okay never mind. I just read through the whole saga thus far. So it’s CX by CX, then CXCX by Dixie Rainbow (DR) (aka RedRanger), then CXCXDR by CX... after which (I’m guessing) the CXCXDRCX is bred to an Ohio Buckeye. Sheesh! You’ve been working hard, hard, Ralphie. Hats off to you and all the rest of ya’ll! If you’re still into selling chicks, I’d be excited to get the chance to raise some.

 

[duluthralphie]

Okay never mind. I just read through the whole saga thus far. So it’s CX by CX, then CXCX by Dixie Rainbow (DR) (aka RedRanger), then CXCXDR by CX... after which (I’m guessing) the CXCXDRCX is bred to an Ohio Buckeye. Sheesh! You’ve been working hard, hard, Ralphie. Hats off to you and all the rest of ya’ll! If you’re still into selling chicks, I’d be excited to get the chance to raise some.

I would love to get you some.. but I have refused to do AI.. and toad natural toad breeding is difficult. In addition I have some egg eaters, which means I am not getting a lot of eggs or chicks. At this point you might do best getting them from @MNChickMom .. we both have identical birds.. she has done better at breeding them than me lately.

As soon as I had enough to spread them to another breeder, she got some.

We are breeding them back to themselves this year... so it is the buckeye babies being bred now.

Btw the eggs are huge!! I have to mark them so I do not confuse them with turkey eggs.

 

[MNChickMom]

I would love to get you some.. but I have refused to do AI.. and toad natural toad breeding is difficult. In addition I have some egg eaters, which means I am not getting a lot of eggs or chicks. At this point you might do best getting them from @MNChickMom .. we both have identical birds.. she has done better at breeding them than me lately.

As soon as I had enough to spread them to another breeder, she got some.

We are breeding them back to themselves this year... so it is the buckeye babies being bred now.

Btw the eggs are huge!! I have to mark them so I do not confuse them with turkey eggs.

My luck took a turn for the worse. I had 17 go into day 18 lock down, then day 21 temp spiked to 105. Only 4 made it. Next my only cock died day before the temp spike. I am at a stand still unless I get a roo from Ralphie. I would not even chance moving an adult bird by car until feb or March. The temp (-25 Fahrenheit) and change may cause cardiac issues.

 

[duluthralphie]

My luck took a turn for the worse. I had 17 go into day 18 lock down, then day 21 temp spiked to 105. Only 4 made it. Next my only cock died day before the temp spike. I am at a stand still unless I get a roo from Ralphie. I would not even chance moving an adult bird by car until feb or March. The temp (-25 Fahrenheit) and change may cause cardiac issues.

Hoover or Bert are available to you.

But I agree no way we can move them in this cold.

 

[CindyinSD]

Sheesh! Minus 25! We do get temps like that, but only rarely and of course at the most inconvenient times. And it’s typically a lot drier here than you guys. My sincere condolences. It’s a balmy 26 here. Ha! And I was feeling sorry for us... Not nice (windy and snowing) and not improving anytime soon, but definitely not -25 and (I’m guessing) humid.

 

[CindyinSD]

Anyway... bummer. What you’re doing is SO difficult. I’m really impressed by your stamina and dedication (all of you). It would be a huge deal to develop a meat bird capable of breeding true. So many people would benefit, but I guess there might not be a lot of motivation to do it in the industry. A bird that’s so complicated to create does guarantee a huge market for breeders.

I’ve got meaties coming April 3rd—a Red Ranger type (allegedly faster finish by a week). A month later turkeys are arriving and some regular chickens including Buckeyes and standard Cochins (which I guess are pretty large) Maybe I can try mixing them up to come up with something reproducible. I’d be happy with a bird as good or nearly as good a grower as the CX, that would typically not get bigger than, say, 10lb? I’m wondering whether a lot of the instability has to do with the nearly indeterminate growth of the CX? I’m definitely not up to the task, but who knows? I might get lucky. If enough of us try, someone’s bound to stumble across a better bird than the CX.

 

[duluthralphie]

Cindy,

There are many factors in the modern day Toad that come to play.

One is the size of the birds. It is a long raise up for the rooster to mount the hen. The size itself becomes a hindrance to breeding. I believe if we could get enough people raising these birds that would take care of itself.

The rate of fertile to non fertile eggs is high, granted. But if you have 50 eggs incubating and get 25 birds we might have enough to keep the variety going. My wife and I do not need 25 birds in the freezer each year.

These birds will never replace the CX the commercial market uses. They have spent too many years spending millions of dollars to convince the consumer a 3-5 pound bird is the size a chicken has to be to eat. What so many do not know and particularly the city born and raised person under 50, these 6 week old giants have no taste.

When I was a kid we ate a red-ranger type bird or we ate leghorn. None of them were 6 weeks old, the leghorns were a year or better many times, all were at least 6 months. BUT they tasted like chicken.

I am trying to recreate that with the toads. I do not expect anyone to be eating 6 week old toads. I want them consumed at an older age so they get time to gain the chicken flavor.

I also want a bird that can free range and wants to free range. A bird that I do not have to give all it's food too. A bird willing to run around and gather bugs and seeds to eat.

I am not a fan of white meat so I purposely sought to increase the dark meat to white meat ratio. This does no mean the breasts are not large on the toad. It simply means we increased the size of the hind quarters. It was MnChickmom and Holm's idea to add in the buckeye to eliminate the single comb. This was a good idea, in addition it reinforced the large hind quarters. When you look at Hoover or Bert you are looking at a rooster that stands nearly 2 ft tall and has legs like a kangaroo.

When they are roasted and placed side by side on the table with a turkey most my family and guests will dive into the chicken and comment on how good it is before they eat the turkey. I wish I could convey the mouth watering taste of a roasted toad to everyone.


In addition, my wife and I, albeit late in our lives have opted for a more minimalist or naturalist type of life style. I want meat that is not pumped full of antibiotics simply so they can be raised in close confinement and turn a profit for a multinational corporation.

I understand the need for confinement raising of meat animals. We simply have too many mouths to feed to raise everyone's feed with my methods.

I chose to raise my own meat in this style. I firmly believe many people could do this for themselves. Even if in a city a person could easily raise 20 birds on most city lots. Sure it would take work and not be neat and clean, but to me neat and clean is over rated.

My wife and I have this "discussion" often. She is a city girl, did not move to the country until she was in High School. She hates chicken and turkey poop on the sidewalk and deck,,,,Yep, we have a sidewalk to our old farm house. She insisted.....I find it easier to go along than argue over those little things...I would never do anything she does not approve of agree with..


She has really embraced the country life style though, she knows I cannot survive in close contact with my neighbors, like in a city..and the neighbors might not either.

The toads are as much of a political statement for me as they are a challenge. Simply stating " I can do this myself" I do not need the government or the market telling me how I have to live and eat.

To this end I will gather maple sap again this year, after several years of not gathering it. I am thinking of getting honey bees. I am going to try grafting my own fruit trees this year. I raise a huge garden.

Toads are just an extension of all that. I am worried they will go extinct. But I am getting older, a lot older fast, and need others like you to help with this project.

I will surely let you and everyone that has asked for toads know when I have enough to spread around. I might even have to employ AI.....if I can talk Holm's into doing it again to increase the toad numbers then try to go back to natural breeding. I see nothing wrong philosophically with AI.....I just hate to do it myself or get involved in a chickens sexlife...it should remain between the two chickens involved and maybe @holm25 .....

 

[duluthralphie]

I lost another toad hen today. I did not think I would lose anymore toads this winter. BUT this 20 below stuff can surprise you, the weak ones seem to just keel over in it.

 

[OneMountainAcres]

I lost another toad hen today. I did not think I would lose anymore toads this winter. BUT this 20 below stuff can surprise you, the weak ones seem to just keel over in it.

So sorry I hope the rest make it through. I'm sick of winter.

 

[CindyinSD]

Ralphi, that is EXACTLY how I feel about it, too. Factory farming is immoral at best and produces a meat that is tasteless (pork, too) and no more than a substrate for sauces, etc. Salatin insists that if we turned all our lawns into food production we in the USA could easily feed the world (but not make the mechanistic factory farm “growers” rich, alas). I’m getting into meat/dairy/eggs first because it’s just easier and more viable for where we live. (I can’t understand why I waited so long.) Our growing season is short and fickle, but we do have a lot of grass/forbs.

If you have chicks by fall, then I’d absolutely be interested. I couldn’t take many at this point until the end of May anyhow. I have limited brooder space and limited space to put brooders IN. So... We have two buildings we’re not using that would serve, but DH doesn’t want to use either for chickens. Well, they’re both kind of residential type so I guess I get it, but what good is it if you can’t use it? We can’t rent either of them because... bureaucrats.