Treating for Coccidiosis

[Isaiah53]

I am new to this, so question, does everyone automatically treat for Coccidiosis each spring as a preventative measure or only during an Outbreak? We're in spring thaw and it's pretty yucky out muddy, wet and impossible to keep things dry. I was wondering if it's worthwhile doing a corrid treatment for all my flock in water (chickens, turkeys, ducks and peafowl all share the same area).

 

[EggSighted4Life]

I don't... But it will depend on your cocci load (flock density). We never get dry here in the pacific northwest either. But I'm not too muddy and I keep my flock size in proportion to my pasture. Thawing indicates cold to me and cocci are *most* active in warm environments. Though it's still possible for it to become an issue. (and puddles may become warm during the day. Using things when they aren't needed, including amprolium the active ingredient in Corid, develops resistant strain and some are already resistant to it. One reason I won't treat cocci without symptoms or worms without verification of species and load.

If you do.. I would think the preventative dose. And I DON'T think it's OK for ducks since when I was getting ducklings everything I read said do NOT use medicated starter. So you may need to research a little better and implement a means of separation if you do need to treat. Ducks are know resistant to cocci already. I would think if your birds have been there this whole time, they will already have SOME resistance to the strains that present.

I personally would only treat upon outbreak and it only works by blocking thiamine to starve out the coccidia and slow their growth rate. But it's awesome that you are thinking ahead and taking a proactive role.

Putting your general location on your profile might help others give you more appropriate recommendations without having to ask extra questions.

 

[Isaiah53]

I don't... But it will depend on your cocci load (flock density). We never get dry here in the pacific northwest either. But I'm not too muddy and I keep my flock size in proportion to my pasture. Thawing indicates cold to me and cocci are *most* active in warm environments. Though it's still possible for it to become an issue. (and puddles may become warm during the day. Using things when they aren't needed, including amprolium the active ingredient in Corid, develops resistant strain and some are already resistant to it. One reason I won't treat cocci without symptoms or worms without verification of species and load.

If you do.. I would think the preventative dose. And I DON'T think it's OK for ducks since when I was getting ducklings everything I read said do NOT use medicated starter. So you may need to research a little better and implement a means of separation if you do need to treat. Ducks are know resistant to cocci already. I would think if your birds have been there this whole time, they will already have SOME resistance to the strains that present.

I personally would only treat upon outbreak and it only works by blocking thiamine to starve out the coccidia and slow their growth rate. But it's awesome that you are thinking ahead and taking a proactive role.

Putting your general location on your profile might help others give you more appropriate recommendations without having to ask extra questions.

Thank you for your input. That's my thoughts as well. I just keep getting others telling me to worm and to do cocci at the same time.

I thought I had updated my profile, my apologies. I'll update that now. I am from Osoyoos BC where it's supposed to be desert area but we live in the mountains so we have weather ranging from the low of -25C in winter and a high of 40C in the summer. This winter was extreme snow with about 4-5 feet. It'll be a long thaw.

Thanks again.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

I just keep getting others telling me to worm and to do cocci at the same time.

I won't treat for worms without getting a fecal float at the vet. Any vet doesn't have to be avian to run a float. Cost is $18-25 at my vet (too high really). And I do a flock sample, herd sample, or pack sample. In other words combine several collected sample from an individual species into one.. Like the goats, dogs, or chickens. It saves $, still gives an overall look, and is an accepted practice. I also bough a microscope to run my own samples since I have so many animals, the vet gets pricey and isn't always an option. But I'm still gaining that skill.

The reason I get a float is because not all wormers treat all species of worm. And I don't wish to treat for what I don't have while accidentally not treating what I do. Wormer meds are actually poison and hard on the system of the birds. So never worm an ill bird without verification. Under heavy load round worm and tape worms *may* be seen in the droppings. But all other species stay inside the intestine and only their microscopic eggs will pass. I would treat if I saw round or tape worms in droppings as that's pretty clear you do have them.

So in 8 years of raising chickens... I have never wormed yet. Partly because I didn't know you "needed" to. Once I learned, it was still hard to spend the $ on a float instead of just treating... I have one gal with muddy bumm all the time, and one of my dogs was scooting their butt on the ground recently. Both symptoms that people will SWEAR is worms.

So I spent the funds for 2 floats in this instance... and both came back NEGATIVE for worms. So now I didn't have to spend the time, energy, or $ treating AND withholding eggs! And my birds and dogs were not subjected to poison needlessly. The worms also aren't building their resistance to the drugs I'm not using.

And while I do work hard to maintain my coop and pasture... worms are part of the environment. So not getting them doesn't mean I'm doing anything better... just that maybe it isn't as much of an issue at my location. And my floats prove that no matter what other people say or think doesn't mean their right. Every situation will be unique. I'm not saying they're wrong either. So just use the information you have available at the time and make the decision you think is best or makes the most sense. If you learn something new, switch it up.

I used to live in the "high desert" here in California. Elevation was only 4000 feet, but we still got some snow and around 100 f+ (38 c+) in the summer. It had a beauty all it's own! BC is actually one of the very few places I'm interested in visiting. It just seems so beautiful and comparable to where I currently live.

Then I had to wonder if you are Christian, from your user name... but I'm thinking maybe a Pulp Fiction or a Samuel L Jackson fan?

Hope you have a great day!

 

[Isaiah53]

I won't treat for worms without getting a fecal float at the vet. Any vet doesn't have to be avian to run a float. Cost is $18-25 at my vet (too high really). And I do a flock sample, herd sample, or pack sample. In other words combine several collected sample from an individual species into one.. Like the goats, dogs, or chickens. It saves $, still gives an overall look, and is an accepted practice. I also bough a microscope to run my own samples since I have so many animals, the vet gets pricey and isn't always an option. But I'm still gaining that skill.

The reason I get a float is because not all wormers treat all species of worm. And I don't wish to treat for what I don't have while accidentally not treating what I do. Wormer meds are actually poison and hard on the system of the birds. So never worm an ill bird without verification. Under heavy load round worm and tape worms *may* be seen in the droppings. But all other species stay inside the intestine and only their microscopic eggs will pass. I would treat if I saw round or tape worms in droppings as that's pretty clear you do have them.

So in 8 years of raising chickens... I have never wormed yet. Partly because I didn't know you "needed" to. Once I learned, it was still hard to spend the $ on a float instead of just treating... I have one gal with muddy bumm all the time, and one of my dogs was scooting their butt on the ground recently. Both symptoms that people will SWEAR is worms.

So I spent the funds for 2 floats in this instance... and both came back NEGATIVE for worms. So now I didn't have to spend the time, energy, or $ treating AND withholding eggs! And my birds and dogs were not subjected to poison needlessly. The worms also aren't building their resistance to the drugs I'm not using.

And while I do work hard to maintain my coop and pasture... worms are part of the environment. So not getting them doesn't mean I'm doing anything better... just that maybe it isn't as much of an issue at my location. And my floats prove that no matter what other people say or think doesn't mean their right. Every situation will be unique. I'm not saying they're wrong either. So just use the information you have available at the time and make the decision you think is best or makes the most sense. If you learn something new, switch it up.

I used to live in the "high desert" here in California. Elevation was only 4000 feet, but we still got some snow and around 100 f+ (38 c+) in the summer. It had a beauty all it's own! BC is actually one of the very few places I'm interested in visiting. It just seems so beautiful and comparable to where I currently live.

Then I had to wonder if you are Christian, from your user name... but I'm thinking maybe a Pulp Fiction or a Samuel L Jackson fan?

Hope you have a great day!

That does make sense. There are no signs or symptoms of anything I see, just wanted to see what the view was on treating /preventing Coccidiosis. Thank you for advice. I agree it's harsh to do if not needed I will go the route of natural prevention for good health.

Yes, I am a born again Christian, by God's grace. Not a fan of pulp fiction. You were right the first time, Isaiah 53 one of my favourite pieces of scripture. My other is the whole book of Romans, especially chapter 8.

Thank you again! Really appreciate your advice!

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Yes, I am a born again Christian, by God's grace.

It's hard not to appreciate the books of Romans. I'll have to look at Isaiah though. Lots of believers here!

Naturally preventing is good. Maybe deep litter or making your run as much like the forest floor as possible so it isn't bare dirt in order support the micro organisms that can break down waste, if it isn't already. And picking up as much droppings off where they forage as you can. Just beware of things that claim they work but either have zero scientific research to back their claim or in some instances research that proves it's ineffectiveness... like diatomaceous earth, pumpkin seeds, or red pepper for worming. Hear say means nothing to me, I like to see numbers. Coming from someone who also walks by faith!

Other than your ducks, cocci treatment wont hurt anyone that I know of. As far as I can tell it looks like there may be no withdrawal time for eggs if you do decide to treat, though I think the treatment *can* cause cloudy looking yolks. Here is a link that you can see if that is the same time frame you gather...
http://www.farad.org/publications/digests/122015EggResidue.pdf

 

[Isaiah53]

It's hard not to appreciate the books of Romans. I'll have to look at Isaiah though. Lots of believers here!

Naturally preventing is good. Maybe deep litter or making your run as much like the forest floor as possible so it isn't bare dirt in order support the micro organisms that can break down waste, if it isn't already. And picking up as much droppings off where they forage as you can. Just beware of things that claim they work but either have zero scientific research to back their claim or in some instances research that proves it's ineffectiveness... like diatomaceous earth, pumpkin seeds, or red pepper for worming. Hear say means nothing to me, I like to see numbers. Coming from someone who also walks by faith!

Other than your ducks, cocci treatment wont hurt anyone that I know of. As far as I can tell it looks like there may be no withdrawal time for eggs if you do decide to treat, though I think the treatment *can* cause cloudy looking yolks. Here is a link that you can see if that is the same time frame you gather...
http://www.farad.org/publications/digests/122015EggResidue.pdf

I have been doing the deep litter method. But was considering switching to sand on the floor in our new coop. I'll have to do some more research on the pros and cons of health issues. And I agree with you on natural health. I was thinking though more on the lines of less scratch, (diet the previous owner was on was half scratch half pellets) and using apple cider vinegar, garlic and yogurt for a healthy gut biome. And adding more fresh fruit and vegetables as treats. I figure the healthier they are the better to fight off bad bugs.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Yes, that sounds good.

If you can, aim for not more than 10% of the total daily ration to be treats like scratch. It is low in protein (7% usually) The other things can be helpful too, I think within reason. Scratch cost the same as pellets for me.

I use washed river sand in my bigger coops. It's nice to have a constant source of grit and easy enough to clean up. It does get quite dusty and the chickens don't dirt bathe in it. But that isn't why I use it and I wear a particulate mask when cleaning if I want. Some people like to remove and clean everything if the have to treat for lice or something. I've never done that. I use droppings boards under my roosts so the sand below stays mostly poo free since they usually just come in to lay eggs during the day. It isn't like beach sand though, think similar to small pebbles with other sizes of sand mixed in.