Vaccinate or Not

[NHMountainMan]

Nice! I don't even know what breeds I'm incubating right now. I was given 3 dozen eggs from a guy who took 4 of my roosters. He just wanted some cockerels in return.

I'm thinking about ordering chicks that are vaccinated just to see what happens in the long run.

What breeds are you planning to order? More JG?

 

[FortCluck]

you're right. As I'm flipping back and forth between website's and BYC - it basically seems to me that the sole benefit of the vaccine is survivability of an infected bird. Been on MD, Penn State, Ms, UNH websites, all with some commentary about marek's. All confirm that Marek's has no human risk - in meat or eggs.

So - if I want the rangers, and existing / egg flock to survive - for me, I'll vaccinate. As the cornish won't survive, I'll save $.50/ bird. I may cross contaminate if I do have marek's in my flock, but as long as the cornish last 6-8 weeks, nothing to worry about.
Just my personal POV for my flock.

Yeah the Cornish aren't made to live long term. Sounds like a good plan!

 

[FortCluck]

What breeds are you planning to order? More JG?

I never want another JG unless Squatch passes. They're big pigs even though they're very gentle, they also require large housing... That's why we have that large coop I could live in

I'm looking for colored egg layers, but I'm not sure when to order. I'm honestly thinking about going to the local farm and getting what I want there. That's where I got all my birds besides a few we were given by other breeders.

If it's not broken don't fix it... I'm going to place my order after these chicks hatch and are about 6 weeks. I don't even know what I'm hatching so I may have some interesting chicks.

 

[NHMountainMan]

I never want another JG unless Squatch passes. They're big pigs even though they're very gentle, they also require large housing... That's why we have that large coop I could live in

I'm looking for colored egg layers, but I'm not sure when to order. I'm honestly thinking about going to the local farm and getting what I want there. That's where I got all my birds besides a few we were given by other breeders.

If it's not broken don't fix it... I'm going to place my order after these chicks hatch and are about 6 weeks. I don't even know what I'm hatching so I may have some interesting chicks.

Looking forward to seeing the pictures!

 

[ShrekDawg]

you're right. As I'm flipping back and forth between website's and BYC - it basically seems to me that the sole benefit of the vaccine is survivability of an infected bird. Been on MD, Penn State, Ms, UNH websites, all with some commentary about marek's. All confirm that Marek's has no human risk - in meat or eggs.

So - if I want the rangers, and existing / egg flock to survive - for me, I'll vaccinate. As the cornish won't survive, I'll save $.50/ bird. I may cross contaminate if I do have marek's in my flock, but as long as the cornish last 6-8 weeks, nothing to worry about.
Just my personal POV for my flock.

I think that makes sense.

I'd have to get vaccinated birds first I've never put thought into chicken vaccines.

I vaccinate my dogs and cat, but never had a vaccinated chicken unless I was never told when I bought them.

The farm I buy from gets chicks from a hatchery... Now it's got me wondering if I do have vaccinated ones. Would a farm risk Marek's when buying large bulk of chicks every year. We are talking about thousands.

Ahh okay. Idk if they do or not. More expensive so who knows.

Well they all eventually got murdered by dogs so I have no long term results to discuss, but they did all live in the same coop. Here is my reasoning.

Sorry about your birds.

And thanks for sharing that again!! I think I do remember reading that now.. whoops.. sorry.

My mind’s a bit foggy atm apparently.

Funny thing is I remembered the older post, the one from the other day about your dad’s flock having it and all that, but yet completely forget something I just read less than an hour ago...

Not just your posts either, those whole few pages are lost to me

Anyyyyywaaaaaaayyyyyyyy.....

This makes me feel a lot better about putting my chicks outside so thank you.

Also for the record, I can’t for the life of me remember what the weather was Tuesday but I remember Monday and Wednesday and yesterday.

 

[Kiki]

Can I say I'm shocked you don't.

Just whatever vaccines these hatcheries offer. I don't even know everything they offer. I'm hoping someone can tell me

I would've pissed if someone knew they had Marek's in their flock and sold me birds.

If you see any post about sick or injured chickens on BYC - limping chicken, won't eat, etc, etc, almost always, the symptoms point to a variety of illness, and almost always, Marek's could be one of the reasons the chicken is suffering. The advice by most of the experienced "healers" on BYC almost always say - if it get's better, great, as many survive Marek's. But they also survive strains, sprains, egg bound etc. But if the chicken doesn't survive, or is humanely put down - the recommendation is always to have a state lab necropsy performed.

What percent of those that are recommended for necropsy actual get the necropsy done? That's why looking at the experience of diagnosed Marek's on BYC isn't a good proxy for the incidence of Marek's.

As NPIP certification doesn't test Marek's - doesn't that mean that Marek's isn't a "closed flock" illness?

 

[FortCluck]

I would've pissed if someone knew they had Marek's in their flock and sold me birds.

Yeah true. I only buy from honest sellers. I still want quail

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

Hmm...I guess the only sure fire way to know is have a necropsy done. Does that tell you which strain or just that they're Mareks +/-?

Necropsy just tells you if Marek’s contributed to cause of death. Separating MDV strains is actually really difficult and is done by inoculating specific pathogen free chicks with known quantities of virus and counting the deaths! I am supposing that we have a moderately hot strain of virus, since it killed most of our chicks but didn’t kill the adults that were vaccinated with the cell-free vaccine...

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

Thank you @Mixed flock enthusiast for all the research you have presented here. After 6 years of having chickens and never having an ill or injured bird I have been hit with Mareks. I lost 2 Onagadori pullets last month. Necropsied one myself and took the other to University of Arkansas Poultry Diagnostic Lab. The veterinarian there advised me to vaccinate my flock even though it may provide little benefit. I am sad that none of my birds will ever be able to leave my property but would wish this disease on no one. I have also had to treat my flock for coccidiosis at the same time. I am going to vaccinate. I wonder if I hatch eggs indoors will those chicks be safe to sell? I do practice biosecurity on my premesis and don’t visit other areas with poultry. My current flock were purchased from several different breeders and I wonder if the source of the infected pullets is where the disease originally came from. I would add that any hatchery that recommends vaccination probably has had the disease on their premises since it is so prevalent and difficult to eradicate. I don’t know if Mareks virus mutates like influenza but if not, I don’t see how vaccination could ‘create’ hotter strains as some people think.

Hi CatWhisperer, I am so sorry about your pullets and that you have this disease in your flock! We were devastated by our diagnosis too - it’s such a game changer and really alters the chicken keeping experience!

We had intended to breed and sell chicks, and so considered whether there was an ethical way to make that work. Since the MDV virus isn’t passed into eggs, selling hatching eggs only is one idea. My DD and I also talked about having her friend hatch the eggs and sell the chicks from her chicken-free household. We did also discuss the possibility of having a “clean-room”’ for hatching, staffed by one of us that would temporarily avoid the chickens. TBH, the “clean room” idea made me nervous, as it would be so easy to breach biosecurity.... Best of luck figuring out how to go forward with your flock!

 

[FortCluck]

Hi CatWhisperer, I am so sorry about your pullets and that you have this disease in your flock! We were devastated by our diagnosis too - it’s such a game changer and really alters the chicken keeping experience!

We had intended to breed and sell chicks, and so considered whether there was an ethical way to make that work. Since the MDV virus isn’t passed into eggs, selling hatching eggs only is one idea. My DD and I also talked about having her friend hatch the eggs and sell the chicks from her chicken-free household. We did also discuss the possibility of having a “clean-room”’ for hatching, staffed by one of us that would temporarily avoid the chickens. TBH, the “clean room” idea made me nervous, as it would be so easy to breach biosecurity.... Best of luck figuring out how to go forward with your flock!

So it can't be passed into eggs?