Virulent Newcastle Disease or VND, Lots of Anguish, Little Solutions Offered

[SurferchickinSB]

Clearly those of us who are hobbyists by and large don't. But CDFA and probably others have lumped us together with the folks breeding roosters to fight to differentiate us from the large commercial operations who raise chickens for eggs and for meat. Those cockfighters (I have a different second syllable in mind...) DO take their birds to gatherings where some can and do spread the virus to birds who dispatch to dozens of other areas in and outside the quarantine zones. They deliberately hide their birds from inspection by CDFA authorities or move them when they anticipate an inspection. Furthermore, we have a group of folks who probably fall into what I'm calling the hobbyist group -- folks like us at BYC -- who has whipped up fear and now actively incites backyarders to hide and move their birds as well.

The case of vND recently diagnosed in AZ is the same strain as the one we're battling. That owner's bird was in contact with a bird from a quarantine area.

The people involved in the cockfighting are so much different from the backyard chicken enthusiast. They are not going to give up their cocks because they make tons of money off of that, it is a huge gambling operation!

 

[SurferchickinSB]

This is another thing I can't get a firm handle on. I'm reading official sources to try to get the information I rely on and repeat. I get that death comes rapidly after the onset of the visible phase of the disease but the duration of incubation period in which a seemingly "healthy" bird can pass on the contagion is very elusive. I've read anything from 2 days to 21. That's a pretty huge discrepancy!

Yes, I have been trying to find that information too and from what I have read it sounds like the birds die very rapidly. It just seems like if that is the case it would be easy to contain unless the virus is being tracked in by people.

 

[SurferchickinSB]

Clearly those of us who are hobbyists by and large don't. But CDFA and probably others have lumped us together with the folks breeding roosters to fight to differentiate us from the large commercial operations who raise chickens for eggs and for meat. Those cockfighters (I have a different second syllable in mind...) DO take their birds to gatherings where some can and do spread the virus to birds who dispatch to dozens of other areas in and outside the quarantine zones. They deliberately hide their birds from inspection by CDFA authorities or move them when they anticipate an inspection. Furthermore, we have a group of folks who probably fall into what I'm calling the hobbyist group -- folks like us at BYC -- who has whipped up fear and now actively incites backyarders to hide and move their birds as well.

The case of vND recently diagnosed in AZ is the same strain as the one we're battling. That owner's bird was in contact with a bird from a quarantine area.

The only way the poultry industry is going to control it is to require their workers to done hazmat type suits before they enter, something like what they do in engineering clean rooms. It can also be tracked in the areas by the tires on their vehicles, so they need to make sure that they park further from the poultry areas.

 

[Fishkeeper]

PETA came through when my sister's school district threw a fair and baby chicks were being given out as prizes for games. PETA shut that down after my sister and several other staff members alerted them.

PETA is a for-profit organization that euthanizes most of the healthy pets given to them to adopt out. They have literally stolen people's pets to euthanize them. They've claimed that drinking milk causes autism, and that shearing sheep for wool harms them. They've also handed out pamphlets of things like "your mother kills animals" with graphic depictions to literal children. If they had their way no one would own any pet or domesticated animals. They'd call every chicken keeper an abuser, especially anyone who's ever culled a bird. We don't want them involved in this. They're animal rights people. We want animal welfare, because the animal welfare people are the ones who advocate for things like humane conditions for farm animals. The humane societies are animal welfare people.

 

[IamRainey]

Yes, I have been trying to find that information too and from what I have read it sounds like the birds die very rapidly. It just seems like if that is the case it would be easy to contain unless the virus is being tracked in by people.

Not sure I was clear. Birds are still contagious and capable of infecting others before their own illness becomes apparent. That period of incubation when birds appear to be "healthy" may be as long as 21 days according to CDFA, USDA and drug company sources. That's a long time for people to transport birds and spread the disease IF it's the case.

What's more, there is a 10% recovery rate and those birds may shed the virus for up to 4 months.

That's what makes trying to gather reliable information so frustrating.

 

[SurferchickinSB]

Not sure I was clear. Birds are still contagious and capable of infecting others before their own illness becomes apparent. That period of incubation when birds appear to be "healthy" may be as long as 21 days according to CDFA, USDA and drug company sources. That's a long time for people to transport birds and spread the disease IF it's the case.

That's what makes trying to gather reliable information so frustrating.

Yes, when I first started looking into this last year because of the situation around here. I was thinking about vaccinating my chickens, but the more I read the more it sounded like you vaccinate them with a live vaccine and then it makes them carriers for a certain amount of time. They can then infect the whole area. I would guess that that is what the commercial poultry ndustries will be doing and then it will probably destroy a lot of wild birds and backyard chickens, through the spread of it.

 

[Animalfisherwoman]

Yes, I have been trying to find that information too and from what I have read it sounds like the birds die very rapidly. It just seems like if that is the case it would be easy to contain unless the virus is being tracked in by people.

The December 2018 USDA-APHIS study gives a rate of infection-to-symptoms of 0.4 days; death or recovery in approximately 4.2 days. Mortality 70 to 100 percent.

Newcastle's vaccine in backyard chicken flocks was seen to HEIGHTEN risk to VND; it's speculated that this may be dosage/timing error.

 

[SurferchickinSB]

The December 2018 USDA-APHIS study gives a rate of infection-to-symptoms of 0.4 days; death or recovery in approximately 4.2 days. Mortality 70 to 100 percent.

Newcastle's vaccine in backyard chicken flocks was seen to HEIGHTEN risk to VND; it's speculated that this may be dosage/timing error.

There are also many different strains of Newcastles. The VND strain, from what I have read can have almost 100% mortality rate.

 

[Animalfisherwoman]

The people involved in the cockfighting are so much different from the backyard chicken enthusiast. They are not going to give up their cocks because they make tons of money off of that, it is a huge gambling operation!

In the 2003 outbreak, euthanized layers were paid out about $5. Gamebird roosters averaged about $76. (This is a reliable source, but shoot, I didn't bookmark it so I have to look again.)

That apparently was too low for some gamecock owners, so they moved their roosters.

I've heard the rootstock argument, but come on. There's a lot of gamecock breeding going down south with birds going for $100/up. And that's over time. It's realistic that it's not just about getting a novelty. Not over that period of time, and not with the numbers that appear to be involved.

 

[SurferchickinSB]

In the 2003 outbreak, euthanized layers were paid out about $5. Gamebird roosters averaged about $76. (This is a reliable source, but shoot, I didn't bookmark it so I have to look again.)

That apparently was too low for some gamecock owners, so they moved their roosters.

I've heard the rootstock argument, but come on. There's a lot of gamecock breeding going down south with birds going for $100/up. And that's over time. It's realistic that it's not just about getting a novelty. Not over that period of time, and not with the numbers that appear to be involved.

People will not give up their birds if they have the potential or are making them thousands of dollars by winning for their owners in the cockfights.They are hiding them and moving them into different areas to conceal them.