We got new additions!

[ButteCA]

That was almost 3 months ago of "cute"! How did it go when the mature pigs left? How did moving your coops go? Did all the little "pig-puppies" find new homes? If you did a re-homing or sale fee, what did you charge?

The only potbelly pigs I've come into contact with have been some of the ugliest in the pig world in my opinion. Nastiest dispositions, too. Probably because almost all that I've come into contact with have been the "rejects" left behind by folks that bought them to be house pets and then turned them out w/o handling or even basic care (in some instances) when they found out they weren't really meant to be house pets...

We eventually want pigs - would love miniature ones - but the research I've done has shown that that isn't really feasible, LOL. And ours will not be in the house. Nope, what I want eventually is a pig able to forage off the land and have good feed/weight conversion for becoming our lard, bacon & pork ribs selections. Friendly and used to people, yes. A pet, no....

Those were cute, though!!

The piggy sanctuary people were trying to get my babies. My outlook on the farm animals is quite the same. Now I didn’t breed the ladies on purpose there was just a male free roaming the property on a knock the females up free for all. So I will have one more litter due in August and then hopefully I will never have to raise the miniature pigs again. As far as I can tell I don’t think miniature pigs are necessarily a food source they are companion animals. I had pan fed a baby from one of my neighbors litters so I knew they could end up just as friendly as dogs but only if the mothers were not allowed to teach them to fear people. I think that’s why so many end up at sanctuaries. People see that friendly pig on the internet and just go out and get a miniature pig and I’m going to go ahead and assume here that most people don’t take them and pan feed and then people come along and buy them and the people breeding them can say whatever they want. “Yeah it will take time for them to warm up to you.” As part of their get rich quick scam when the reality is a miniature pig who is not socialized from week one will never fully trust people. The disgust the sanctuary people had for me after I had told them no many times that I would not be giving them my babies. I have homes in rural areas lined up for them some as service animals and they told me they can rehome them better they have people waiting this and that. Well I’m running a farm too apparently and as far as I can tell a farm needs to turn a profit if I’m going to continue feeding the animals and providing care for them and this is what I have to work with. As far as I can tell I’ve been responsible making sure people get that pig from the internet that they expect and making sure the males are neutered so they won’t be bred finding homes in advance and I know they want easily rehomeable pigs because their animals have to eat too. While I do have sympathy for the animals that end up in shelters I am trying to do my best not to contribute that. After the money and time spent on these little pigs it was just an odd experience. To be treated like I was doing something wrong when in reality I’m doing everything to correct the situation and provide for my abandoned animals as well. I realize this is a vent/rant. Being a stay at home mom anything I do that can provide financial gain I like to take pride in. I guess I was just offended that I knew they thought I had been spinning them B.S. I had already gladly surrendered the male pig to them and after waiting for two months and having him in a small pin I had already given up hope that they were coming and had made arrangements to have him neutered as well. If I was some sort of crazy back yard breeder would I really have gone through the trouble at all of reaching out? I felt like I was swimming in crazy soup. Life is a bowl of crazy soup.

 

[paintedChix]

The piggy sanctuary people were trying to get my babies. My outlook on the farm animals is quite the same. Now I didn’t breed the ladies on purpose there was just a male free roaming the property on a knock the females up free for all. So I will have one more litter due in August and then hopefully I will never have to raise the miniature pigs again. As far as I can tell I don’t think miniature pigs are necessarily a food source they are companion animals. I had pan fed a baby from one of my neighbors litters so I knew they could end up just as friendly as dogs but only if the mothers were not allowed to teach them to fear people. I think that’s why so many end up at sanctuaries. People see that friendly pig on the internet and just go out and get a miniature pig and I’m going to go ahead and assume here that most people don’t take them and pan feed and then people come along and buy them and the people breeding them can say whatever they want. “Yeah it will take time for them to warm up to you.” As part of their get rich quick scam when the reality is a miniature pig who is not socialized from week one will never fully trust people. The disgust the sanctuary people had for me after I had told them no many times that I would not be giving them my babies. I have homes in rural areas lined up for them some as service animals and they told me they can rehome them better they have people waiting this and that. Well I’m running a farm too apparently and as far as I can tell a farm needs to turn a profit if I’m going to continue feeding the animals and providing care for them and this is what I have to work with. As far as I can tell I’ve been responsible making sure people get that pig from the internet that they expect and making sure the males are neutered so they won’t be bred finding homes in advance and I know they want easily rehomeable pigs because their animals have to eat too. While I do have sympathy for the animals that end up in shelters I am trying to do my best not to contribute that. After the money and time spent on these little pigs it was just an odd experience. To be treated like I was doing something wrong when in reality I’m doing everything to correct the situation and provide for my abandoned animals as well. I realize this is a vent/rant. Being a stay at home mom anything I do that can provide financial gain I like to take pride in. I guess I was just offended that I knew they thought I had been spinning them B.S. I had already gladly surrendered the male pig to them and after waiting for two months and having him in a small pin I had already given up hope that they were coming and had made arrangements to have him neutered as well. If I was some sort of crazy back yard breeder would I really have gone through the trouble at all of reaching out? I felt like I was swimming in crazy soup. Life is a bowl of crazy soup.

U R my hero!!! Go check out the extra long post I made under "How do I feed my horse" post # 46 - https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/what-do-i-need-to-feed-my-horse.1212463/page-5 - I soooo completely understand where you are coming from.

I am/have been a pony breeder. In the last several years, we've had not 1 but 2 genetic anomalies show up. They can be treated, but can be very expensive w/o guarantees of living after the surgeries OR returning to a useful life or even a quality life. I've removed the ponies that produced the issue(s) from our breeding pool (euthanized in couple of cases). It's been hard and it sure did "slam" our breeding program. It also makes me wonder how many other ponies out there may have these issues. Folks with plenty of cash to throw at a pony hobby may be able to deal with them, but folks on a shoestring budget, getting a pony bred for riding and driving for themselves and their children - may not be able to. It hurts my heart and I get so totally angry when someone mentions - just give it away or send it off to a rescue... What - so someone else can deal with the problem? Is that how my previous donations to various rescues were spent? I don't think so... I no longer donate to those rescue operations after doing some digging into how donated funds are being spent (spending $10,000 on a surgery for a cat just blows my mind!!)... And what gives - that all "rescuers/rescues" seem to feel it is there god-given right to talk down to everyone including the ones that are providing volunteer hours and/or funds that are taken from their own families??? I agree - I like the term - "crazy soup of life".

A cryptorchid stallion (1 testicle retained somewhere in the abdomen) can be VERY dangerous. The surgeries here in NC, even for a #400 pony are VERY cost prohibitive! Also, abdominal surgery on a horse (any size) is difficult and can be extremely hard on the equine - no guarantees of any kind. You may spend that $$ only to have them die anyway... Not where we need to put our funds at the moment. Equine and livestock vets do not agree on how retained testicles are passed down genetically. From the sire through a daughter to grand son or directly from the sire to a son or having to come from both parents... Now, a friend who does tons of research, has pointed out to me that they've linked cryptorchidism to nutrition aspects at a specific point in gestation... OI - but that doesn't explain how it showed up in 2 different bloodlines of un-related ponies - in different years on different feeding regimens.

And then I had a beautiful little stallion that I bought. I was so thrilled when his price dropped to a reasonable amount that I could afford! Then years later - 7 of the 11 foals he sired for us have presented with slipping/locking stifles - I bought 3 that I'd sold, back, for the same $$ I sold them for. Usually on the left side, some are affected on both sides. We've tried with many of these to treat them - thru diet, specific exercise & muscle building or lack of, stall rest, pasture rest/work etc. Vets experienced in this condition state that none of the ponies (& none of the adults) display the conformation that pre-disposes to this issue. So now what? They don't even agree which of 2 procedures would be best for any given pony (I have not had them all checked out). One of those is significantly lower cost than the other - but if you do one and it doesn't work (one is actually going in and cutting the locking ligament - then will no longer be able to lock their own stifle to sleep standing up; the other is "blistering" the ligament so that it physically shortens as the scar tissue builds) - you can't go in and do the other as you've already done one and it wouldn't work... Also, again, neither promises a return to a useful (riding/driving) or even quality/comfortable life. Iiiiii.... I've been told since this ordeal started that it doesn't hurt the pony/horse and that they are ok. I beg to differ. Even with ACV, Devil's Claw, and Turmeric I've not seen any real improvement. I know what it feels like when my own hips hitch and/or lock (that is what finally stopped my riding activities in 2012 - I couldn't handle the pain OR the fear that I couldn't respond/move if something happened while i was riding). I have lost sales when someone comes out to view a sale pony and then sees another pony dragging a locked leg around behind them. In the past 2 yrs, I've watched as the devilish fun personality of the first pony (he's 8 yrs old this year - it started between 18m & 2ys of age) to be afflicted by this issue has changed. He's become sour & grumpy. He DOES look like he hurts during very humid weather. His posture has changed. I hurt for him. He does know how to unlock his own stifles (backing up is the best way) and you will see him stop/pause when he locks and then take a deliberate step back or two or three. When his stifle pops, he then continues forward to do whatever he may have been doing. Two weeks ago when another pony challenged him, he locked up, couldn't get out of the way and was bowled right off his feet... I cried. Especially for our little Cupid - he was to be a replacement stallion. I was so EXCITED when he arrived and I watched as he developed. He was castrated the spring after this issue started. He has been started in harness, but I wonder if his occasional "bouts" of stubbornness result from pain or the lack of ability to do what is asked. He's a smart fellow! He also hasn't taken to any little riders & while normally I'd push thru the attitude and have him learn - it's not been something we've pushed IN CASE the problem stems from his locking stifles... His full sister was a lot worse, his full brother is now 5yrs old and doesn't display the issue at all... However, he hasn't been started in harness or under saddle.

And then there's the move to this new property (moved the ponies in Jan 2015). Ever treated a herd of Shetland ponies for lice?? OMG... Never, ever in my life of being around horses have I ever had this come up. It's terrible... I haven't been able to eradicate it from our herds or this property... It takes a toll on me - physically, mentally and $$. It takes a toll on the ponies, too. The last 3 yrs have been an off balance time in our lives and it's been exceedingly difficult to swing that pendulum back our way.

So, yeah, I understand. AND certainly commiserate with you on what those irresponsible owners left you with and COMMEND you on how you are dealing with it. Hats off to you!!

 

[ButteCA]

U R my hero!!! Go check out the extra long post I made under "How do I feed my horse" post # 46 - https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/what-do-i-need-to-feed-my-horse.1212463/page-5 - I soooo completely understand where you are coming from.

I am/have been a pony breeder. In the last several years, we've had not 1 but 2 genetic anomalies show up. They can be treated, but can be very expensive w/o guarantees of living after the surgeries OR returning to a useful life or even a quality life. I've removed the ponies that produced the issue(s) from our breeding pool (euthanized in couple of cases). It's been hard and it sure did "slam" our breeding program. It also makes me wonder how many other ponies out there may have these issues. Folks with plenty of cash to throw at a pony hobby may be able to deal with them, but folks on a shoestring budget, getting a pony bred for riding and driving for themselves and their children - may not be able to. It hurts my heart and I get so totally angry when someone mentions - just give it away or send it off to a rescue... What - so someone else can deal with the problem? Is that how my previous donations to various rescues were spent? I don't think so... I no longer donate to those rescue operations after doing some digging into how donated funds are being spent (spending $10,000 on a surgery for a cat just blows my mind!!)... And what gives - that all "rescuers/rescues" seem to feel it is there god-given right to talk down to everyone including the ones that are providing volunteer hours and/or funds that are taken from their own families??? I agree - I like the term - "crazy soup of life".

A cryptorchid stallion (1 testicle retained somewhere in the abdomen) can be VERY dangerous. The surgeries here in NC, even for a #400 pony are VERY cost prohibitive! Also, abdominal surgery on a horse (any size) is difficult and can be extremely hard on the equine - no guarantees of any kind. You may spend that $$ only to have them die anyway... Not where we need to put our funds at the moment. Equine and livestock vets do not agree on how retained testicles are passed down genetically. From the sire through a daughter to grand son or directly from the sire to a son or having to come from both parents... Now, a friend who does tons of research, has pointed out to me that they've linked cryptorchidism to nutrition aspects at a specific point in gestation... OI - but that doesn't explain how it showed up in 2 different bloodlines of un-related ponies - in different years on different feeding regimens.

And then I had a beautiful little stallion that I bought. I was so thrilled when his price dropped to a reasonable amount that I could afford! Then years later - 7 of the 11 foals he sired for us have presented with slipping/locking stifles - I bought 3 that I'd sold, back, for the same $$ I sold them for. Usually on the left side, some are affected on both sides. We've tried with many of these to treat them - thru diet, specific exercise & muscle building or lack of, stall rest, pasture rest/work etc. Vets experienced in this condition state that none of the ponies (& none of the adults) display the conformation that pre-disposes to this issue. So now what? They don't even agree which of 2 procedures would be best for any given pony (I have not had them all checked out). One of those is significantly lower cost than the other - but if you do one and it doesn't work (one is actually going in and cutting the locking ligament - then will no longer be able to lock their own stifle to sleep standing up; the other is "blistering" the ligament so that it physically shortens as the scar tissue builds) - you can't go in and do the other as you've already done one and it wouldn't work... Also, again, neither promises a return to a useful (riding/driving) or even quality/comfortable life. Iiiiii.... I've been told since this ordeal started that it doesn't hurt the pony/horse and that they are ok. I beg to differ. Even with ACV, Devil's Claw, and Turmeric I've not seen any real improvement. I know what it feels like when my own hips hitch and/or lock (that is what finally stopped my riding activities in 2012 - I couldn't handle the pain OR the fear that I couldn't respond/move if something happened while i was riding). I have lost sales when someone comes out to view a sale pony and then sees another pony dragging a locked leg around behind them. In the past 2 yrs, I've watched as the devilish fun personality of the first pony (he's 8 yrs old this year - it started between 18m & 2ys of age) to be afflicted by this issue has changed. He's become sour & grumpy. He DOES look like he hurts during very humid weather. His posture has changed. I hurt for him. He does know how to unlock his own stifles (backing up is the best way) and you will see him stop/pause when he locks and then take a deliberate step back or two or three. When his stifle pops, he then continues forward to do whatever he may have been doing. Two weeks ago when another pony challenged him, he locked up, couldn't get out of the way and was bowled right off his feet... I cried. Especially for our little Cupid - he was to be a replacement stallion. I was so EXCITED when he arrived and I watched as he developed. He was castrated the spring after this issue started. He has been started in harness, but I wonder if his occasional "bouts" of stubbornness result from pain or the lack of ability to do what is asked. He's a smart fellow! He also hasn't taken to any little riders & while normally I'd push thru the attitude and have him learn - it's not been something we've pushed IN CASE the problem stems from his locking stifles... His full sister was a lot worse, his full brother is now 5yrs old and doesn't display the issue at all... However, he hasn't been started in harness or under saddle.

And then there's the move to this new property (moved the ponies in Jan 2015). Ever treated a herd of Shetland ponies for lice?? OMG... Never, ever in my life of being around horses have I ever had this come up. It's terrible... I haven't been able to eradicate it from our herds or this property... It takes a toll on me - physically, mentally and $$. It takes a toll on the ponies, too. The last 3 yrs have been an off balance time in our lives and it's been exceedingly difficult to swing that pendulum back our way.

So, yeah, I understand. AND certainly commiserate with you on what those irresponsible owners left you with and COMMEND you on how you are dealing with it. Hats off to you!!

I understand that the rescue people have a very biased outlook on things due to dealing with real cases of animal abuse and I wonder if their motive of coming and picking him up now was completely due to me having the babies. When she first called to see if I would be available she asked me “Is there anything else you want to tell me about?” And I paused for a minute and said “No.” I was suspicious of why they were picking up my male for free. I even called them and said when I first started to rehome I was originally looking for just a home for him so I could put a stop to the uncontrolled breeding. It was someone who wanted him as a pet that put the rescue in contact with me. I told them he is not abused in any way and he is well fed here and I have plans of having him neutered and I don’t know if you guys come and expect to find an abused pig here but you won’t find that and told them that he is fine with me and I would hate for him to fill a spot at a sanctuary that another pig that was in more need them him could fill but they insisted and they really were disappointed when I would not give up the babies and a little pushy about it. Responsible pet owners can rehome their animals just as well as hired pet owners. I don’t need a badge and paycheck to use common sense. I am grateful for the services they provide to animals that are truly in need but it felt like to me that they are just rounding up animals for profit,putting them on a waiting list and pulling on the heartstrings of people for donations. It changed my mind about what their actual intentions. I really don’t think rescuing needy animals is the only thing on the priority list. In fact I think it’s a little irresponsible to take an animal that is cared for even after being told that the animal does not need rescuing and on top of that they brought extra cages expecting more than the animal they were picking up. If they would have pulled that before they loaded up my male pig I would have told them they can pick up nothing sorry you wasted your time and kindly remove yourself from my property.They didn’t want my two year old,people shy unaltered male. He is cost effective and he won’t be easy to adopt out. They wanted my freaking babies! Now I’m kinda regretful that I let him go with those nut jobs! I should have kept him. At least he could be here around people he was familiar with at the most.