What do i feed SHOW BIRDS!!

[ThePolishPrincess]

I've always been told that gamebird feed is great for show birds, any breed of chicken. From what I gather, it's lower in fat and higher in protein? When our TSC had game-feed, I fed it to both my show-chickens and the rest of my flock and the difference of everything was noticeable. It even stopped my feather-picking problem that was occuring in the flock. Sadly, our TSC stopped buying it because very few people wanted it anymore (the farmer-types up here only care for egg-laying quality, and very few people here raise exhibition birds). Pecking came back soon after we started on regular feed.

Point being, gamefowl feed is generally better than layer feed. But it usually costs twice the amount.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Most poultry feed is formulated for cost effectiveness rather than ideal nutrition. Just as with other animals, some manufacturers do make a higher quality "show" feed.

There are very few nationwide brands; what is available in New England is not necessarily available in the southwest, and what is available in the south likely differs from that in the mide-west. Etc. My recommendation is to read labels, looking at ingredients as well as nutritional percentages.

 

[bantam_n00b]

Ok, so gamebird feed is better, that's what i thought because of all the different vitamins and nutrients they would be getting in their diet due to various seeds and what not. So what do you guys recommend in the protein intake? Is any protein percentage too high or is any protein percentage is too low? I was thinking about maybe buying a 22% percent protein bag of gamebird feed, and then buy a box of worms at the bait shop and mixing it or giving it to them a couple of times a week (we have hawks here so i dont let them free range unless i am there watching them). What do you guys think? Any good or nay? Let me know what you guys think

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Just as with layer feed, some gamebird feeds are better than others. I've seen gamebird as low as 21-22% protein, but I've also seen it as high as 35%. IMO that is WAY too high.

Some of the gamecock feeds (which are largely a mix of various seeds plus pellets, and often containing large amounts of fish oil) make a good supplement. Nearly all the leftovers and plate scrapings make good supplements. Just about any type of fruit or vegetable is good. A handful of cat or dog kibble is good now and then, or a spoonful of canned cat/dog food.

 

[Resolution]

Due to the requirements of superior plumage development and stress from being moved about and potential exposure to communicable disease and or toxins, show birds require Optimal nutrition at all times of the year. I would feed them as if they were rare, endangered junglefowl, not chickens. Canary seed and or an inexpensive finch or budgerigar food would be my first choice as a bulking agent- that is the element in the diet that takes up the most room in the crop on any given day.
I would feed a high quality extruded kibble to provide the best possible amino acid profile. Remember, all proteins are not alike. What % is digestible protein?
For example, chick starter is generally 20-22% protein-that's what it says on the label but the primary source of protein in these feedstuffs is a defatted soybean meal or some other form of steamed soybean meal. Soybean meal is less than forty percent digestible to chicks unless it has been baked to a certain temperature, which then renders nutrients locked up in the vegetable portion of the feed more readily digestible. Chicks, in nature of course, are highly insectivorous. Their digestive system is hard-wired for the consumption of invertebrates not legumes. What this amounts to is energy. The birds' systems are taxed attempting to break down all the nutrients in the steamed soybean meal and consequently, their hormones are thrown off and reproductive health/development can be greatly compromised.

In nature, the Red Junglefowl lives largely on bamboo seeds which are high in fat and protein as well as non-soluble fibres.
They gorge on any invertebrates they come into contact with. The Red Junglefowl requires an ~ 20% protein diet and this can be comprised of both animal and vegetable protein. It's chicks will ideally be raised on a 35% protein starter and that starter should include generous proportions of fish meal.

People complain about the prices of feed all the time and will often use the cheapest feed they can purchase. This makes a certain amount of logical sense until you realize that upwards of 40% of that commercial lay pellet or crumble is being pooped out undigested. Consequently, the birds are obliged to eat non-stop in order to feel satiated much less reach their daily nutritional requirements. Its true that these domestic birds have been select-bred for countless generations to subsist on inferior feedstuffs but soybean meal was never a part of that equation until very recently in the history of domesticated chickens. These feeds do not optimize health they actually can comprimise long-term health. Ulcers and subsequent chronic bacterial infections of the hind gut and respiratory systems are typical of domestic poultry flocks fed on these feedstuffs (according to the Avian Pathologist Union ).

What has worked for our farm with over four hundred laying hens and anywhere from two to five hundred broilers, muscovies, turkeys etc . ( and many other sustainable farms here in New England) is giving up the "inexpensive" lay pellets and crumbles and switching over to whole scratch grain with no soy with the appropriate % of Ultrakibble or Mazuri extruded kibble mixed in. We are saving upwards of twenty % in feedcosts using this method and this is largely because the amount of food the birds consume is greatly reduced. Cleaning up after the birds is much easier as well as the manure is of a very different texture and has much less moisture content than that of chickens fed on status quo lay pellet.

If your feedstop does not carry the feed demand that they do.If they refuse, you may have to improvise.
A decent quality cat kibble is preferable over dog kibble because it is higher in animal protein and certain lipids than dog food.
That cat kibble should make up % 5-10 % of the total diet- and the rest of that diet will consist of Budgie seed. You may need to add an avian vitamin supplement to the water of birds fed on a kibble formulated for mammals because obviously their nutritional requirements are quite a bit different. Irregardless of their respective nutritional requirements for specific vitamins and minerals- both carnivorous mammals and bug hunting birds absolutely require high quality animal protein and fat in their diets.
An alternative route would be to- miix the aforementioned finch or budgie seed in a 25% seed to 50% whole scratch grain with no soy blend. So far you are spending ~ six dollars a bag for 50 lb bag. Next, make certain oystershell is always available to breeding stock and lay hens naturally but not to chicks or growers-
and here is the kicker- find a nice gallon glass jar and fill it with tepid water. Send your kids or the neighbors kids down to a local stream or pond and ask them to dig up a few handfuls of mud and net up as many interesting bugs and moss/aquatic weeds as they can fit in a cereal bowl. Add them to the jar- creating a habitat that the pond creatures can easily survive in.
Go to the pet store and buy ten or twenty guppies. Place the jar someplace it can't tip over- without its top of course- and let nature take its course. Guppies are live birth fish- they give birth to literally hundreds of baby fish every few weeks. They can live on mosquito larvae alone- but you can feed them an inexpensive fish flake.
Now you have a superior source of animal protein, non-soluble fiber, and fish oil all in the same material.
If you are worried about parasites freeze the fish and or freshwater snail over night. Parasites living in a warm weather pond that use intermediary hosts cannot survive being frozen solid.

Lastly, foragecakes are a huge improvement for birds- ending feather pecking while increasing the nutrient balance of the overall diet.

 

[bantam_n00b]

Quote:
Wow, that was really thorough and a really good piece. So basically the higher the protein the better? I've heard many people say sometimes the higher the protein the more it can cause their internal organs to malfunction. So I was going to try maybe a low 20% of protein gamebird feed, but according to you it seems i should just find feed that is composed more of fish meal instead of soy meal. That's hard to find do you know any specific brand or specific food that is comprised mainly of fish meal? Or do you have any recommendations of what exact feed?

 

[bantam_n00b]

Ok, so i think i figured out what im going to do with the feed, i went to the local feed store today and all their gamebird feed is out and their shipment isnt coming in until monday or tuesday, well anywho i saw that they had this high protein pellet that were 27 or 28% protein and i was thinking of getting that and mixing it with some bird seeds from petsmart. The links to the ones that i was looking at were:

http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2753580

or this

http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2753578#prodTab1

but i think the first one looks a lot better so i might go with that and the high protein pellets and giving them a ration. What do you guys think the rationing should be?

 

[bantam_n00b]

Quote:
Also what do you guys think any good or should i just stick with the gamebird feed?

 

[Resolution]

Higher digestible protein is never an issue. An invertivorous bird or any bug hunting animal is designed to eat as many bugs as they possibly can stuff into their gut at one time. Take for example those species that live on termites, ants or fly larvae? Copepods or sow bugs? Birds that require high levels of very specific amino acids mostly procured via the ingestion of specific forms of animal protein, they have evolved a method to gorge on select food items- high in nutrients- when it's available. The rest of the time they are gorging on food items that are generally quite low in nutritional value- especially ground birds like Junglefowl and chickens. This is why we were able to domesticate one species and none of the other species of Junglefowl. Those other species of Junglefowl, especially the Green and Ceylon, they require that most of their daily intake is of a high nutritional value. The Red Junglefowl and to a lesser degree the Grey JF, they subsist on larger quantities of food items with low nutritional value. What makes this so confusing to follow is the very idea of commercial feed. Animals in nature don't go about searching for vending machine that gives them their three square meals in one half cup of pellet. The feedstuff materials -that go into these feeds are such a fine powder- there is no variation in the diet. Every single gullet filled with pellets is identical to the next.

In that application- whereby a bird is maintained entirely on a single commercial diet, one that ignores seasonal variations and different cycles within the growth cycle- for example moulting- these birds could end up having something malfunction- indeed they do- every single day some hen is on her last legs because she has lived her entire life on these industrial formula feedstuffs. These feeds are not designed to perpetuate a long healthy life. They are not designed for reproductive health. These feeds are designed to be "cheap" and filled with just enough filler and thin air that the birds are in a perpetual state of starvation so that you are obliged to buy another bag of feed as soon as the last one runs out.

Too much protein isn't the issue- its too much indigestible protein in the maintenance diet. Of course you don't need to have a fish meal based diet to produce a healthy bird. An extruded avian kibble is the best possible choice. There is no waste involved. Its much more highly digestible. Thusly- it is more efficient and cheaper to use.
All the same, it is up to the consumer to demand not ask their feed stores and pet stores to carry the extruded kibbles for birds.
Mazuri makes a number of kibbles- one for exotic pheasants comes in several different formulas reflecting different ages and or periods of time in the growth cycle.
I'm sold on their extruded kibble for cranes. I've also used their extruded kibble for waterfowl and have heard great things about their exotic pheasant kibble.
The best possible product on the market is Ultrakibble. You just have to persuade your favorite farm supply store to carry it.
If this is just not possible, go the guppy route. If a bird is fed a decent quality finch seed - preferably one with vitamins added and supplements this with a generous portion of guppies every few days, this is probably the best way to go about it- especially if you are only feeding a few birds of the "best in show" category.
Just make sure the birds have plenty of grit if they are eating guppies so that the fish's little bodies can be ground up adequately in the gizzard.

Some folks might be asking themselves. why not use earthworms or mealworms or something else? The reason is that the fish have a better amino acid spread.
They provide 85-90% of the nutrients the birds need and thefinch or budgie seed that has been vitamin enriched for birds insures that the birds are getting most of their micronutrients as well.
The combination of a soy-free scratch grain, grit, enriched canary/finch/budgie seed and fresh raw guppies is a nearly perfect food if you are rearing just a few birds- or maintaining a specific pair or trio for shore. You can also present them with an Optimal foragecake, which is loaded with the Ultrakibble and is readily available in many retail outlets.

Your feed store should be able to order the extruded kibble products for you, especially if you present a case that many people will also buy the products, potentially more than utilise the inefficient and nutritionally deficient lay pellets and crumbles.

 

[Resolution]

Quote:
The second is better but both are overkill. You just need some enriched finch/canary seed and either a cat kibble or an avian one- or alternatively the fish.