What is the purpose of Organic Feed if it has Synthetic Vitamins and Minerals?

[farmgrl23]

We got a new batch of chicks this past week and I was able to find a local mill that sells soy free organic feed for 42cents a pound - I was super excited! However, when I was looking at the 'tag' at least half of the ingredients are vitamin supplements, which is not something our family eats.... I understand they are allowed in 'organic' crackers, flours, ect but we do not buy those items and make our own from home using non fortified flours.

So - how can this chicken feed of mine be so 'healthy' when it is pumped full of synthetic vitamins which are proven to feed cancer cells and are made from items like coal tar, cyanide, acetone, ect... How come the organic section still buys into the FDA's idea of healthy?!! (that last questions was more of a rant, not a real question!).

I really want to buy my feed and not make it - are there any options for me? The idea of 'sprouting' 'foding', ect is NOT going to happen so please do not bother suggesting it - I have too many young children in my care 24/7 and am due with another in less then two months... lol. My chickens do have a VERY large area to room (there are 25 chickens currently) and it requires trimming they can not manage keeping it down.

 

[Ridgerunner]

This topic comes up a lot. What you are talking about is certified organic. You can do your own research to verify anything I say, but I’ll copy what is prohibited by certified organic.

Prohibited
• Use of animal drugs, including hormones, to promote growth
• Urea or manure added to feed or in feed formulas.
• Direct fed mammalian or poultry by-products such as animal fats and rendered products (does not
include fishmeal).
• Providing feed supplements or additives in amounts over what is needed by the livestock for nutrition and health.
• Kitchen and garden scraps that are not certified organic.

The one that surprises a lot of people is the third one. Animal proteins are not prohibited, slaughter by-products are prohibited. Certified organic does not mean vegetarian or vegan.

But the fourth one is the one you are talking about. Chickens need certain amino acids to be healthy. Under certified organic rules these are allowed if they are necessary for the animal’s health, even if they are synthetic. The purpose of certified organic rules is not to cause an animal to be unhealthy.

I’m not a great believer in certified organic, but if you see that on a label you at least have the ability to know what the rules are of you bother to look up the rules. A lot of the labels you see on animal products don’t mean what most people think they do, things like “free range” or “cage-free”. But they do have a specific meaning that you can educate yourself and know. Things like “natural” however don’t have any meaning at all.

To me, organic is a lifestyle much more than a set of rules. But that is personal. If you don’t have the rules those words basically have no meaning that everyone recognize. Anyone can use them to mean anything.

 

[SunHwaKwon]

So - how can this chicken feed of mine be so 'healthy' when it is pumped full of synthetic vitamins which are proven to feed cancer cells and are made from items like coal tar, cyanide, acetone, ect... How come the organic section still buys into the FDA's idea of healthy?!! (that last questions was more of a rant, not a real question!).

Do you have sources for that? I've only read such stuff (often misinterpretations) on blogs and such. For instance, the cyanide thing is a misinterpretation of the metabolism of B12. Often times we have an association with something and as soon as we hear it we thing "oh my god" even though that thing is not as as sinister as we think, such as (organic) arsenic or E. coli in our gut. There certainly are "naturally derived" vitamin and mineral supplements, though they tend to be expensive and environmentally unfriendly. I do understand where you are coming from, though, since you can't be sure of possible contaminants.

I know it's a rhetorical question, but "organic" is not synonymous with nor is it meant to imply "healthy"... healthy is not easily defined, anyway, especially when it comes to food, which is why there are so many opinions and debates about it.

I really want to buy my feed and not make it - are there any options for me? The idea of 'sprouting' 'foding', ect is NOT going to happen so please do not bother suggesting it - I have too many young children in my care 24/7 and am due with another in less then two months... lol. My chickens do have a VERY large area to room (there are 25 chickens currently) and it requires trimming they can not manage keeping it down.

Buy organic grains, either locally if possibly or online, and mix it yourself. There are many recipes online.

 

[farmgrl23]

Do you have sources for that? I've only read such stuff (often misinterpretations) on blogs and such. For instance, the cyanide thing is a misinterpretation of the metabolism of B12. Often times we have an association with something and as soon as we hear it we thing "oh my god" even though that thing is not as as sinister as we think, such as (organic) arsenic or E. coli in our gut. There certainly are "naturally derived" vitamin and mineral supplements, though they tend to be expensive and environmentally unfriendly. I do understand where you are coming from, though, since you can't be sure of possible contaminants.

I know it's a rhetorical question, but "organic" is not synonymous with nor is it meant to imply "healthy"... healthy is not easily defined, anyway, especially when it comes to food, which is why there are so many opinions and debates about it.



Buy organic grains, either locally if possibly or online, and mix it yourself. There are many recipes online.

Some of the vitamins state it in the name: vitamin a acetate, acetate is acetone which is in nail polish remover The medical community used to promote baby formula before breastfeeding but now there are multiple studies which show formula feed babies are 60-70% more likely to get childhood cancer then a breastfeed child - and the child who does get formula but starts real foods early have less of a chance to get childhood cancer.Formula is nothing but synthetic vitamins... sure a bit of cows milk and fat too. The percentage of women who have the MTHFR mutation is so high - yet those women after multiple miscarriages are told to finally told to stop taking synthetic folic acid or eating foods with it in there. It is toxic to our bodies (and so many people do not realize they have it yet poison them self because the FDA states its good for 'everyone'... Oh, I could go on and on and on...lol

I do know that I can mix it myself BUT like I stated in the first part - I do not want to. Physically I cant right now (limited to lifting 15 pounds after a minor placenta abruption earlier in this pregnancy). Even after I have the baby and can lift the idea of taking multiple young children and a newborn 30-45 miles away from home to 5+ stops to find the things I need is logical. Sure, all the moms with older children, publicly education children, ect... can but realistically it is not an option.

So, are there any other options for me?

 

[lazy gardener]

Quote: Are you feeding your family strictly organic foods? If not, then, IMO, the organic standard for chicken feed is a moot point. I am growing a garden and raising chickens to provide as much natural food as I can. but, I buy my groceries at the local store, and do not have the funds, nor the desire to spend my money on organic foods for myself, or for my animals. The big criteria for me when choosing my chicken feed is this: it must be reasonably fresh. according to a published poultry nutrition expert, 6 weeks from mill date is the turning point. I sprout, and I ferment feed for the birds, free range when I can be out to supervise (due to heavy hawk predation). Otherwise, I don't sweat the details about organic/not organic. Sadly, GMO is also something I don't have the financial resources to fight.

BTW, congrats on your pregnancy. Hoping you have an easy and healthy delivery. Wishing the best for you and your growing family.

 

[SunHwaKwon]

Some of the vitamins state it in the name: vitamin a acetate, acetate is acetone which is in nail polish remover The medical community used to promote baby formula before breastfeeding but now there are multiple studies which show formula feed babies are 60-70% more likely to get childhood cancer then a breastfeed child - and the child who does get formula but starts real foods early have less of a chance to get childhood cancer.Formula is nothing but synthetic vitamins... sure a bit of cows milk and fat too. The percentage of women who have the MTHFR mutation is so high - yet those women after multiple miscarriages are told to finally told to stop taking synthetic folic acid or eating foods with it in there. It is toxic to our bodies (and so many people do not realize they have it yet poison them self because the FDA states its good for 'everyone'... Oh, I could go on and on and on...lol

I do know that I can mix it myself BUT like I stated in the first part - I do not want to. Physically I cant right now (limited to lifting 15 pounds after a minor placenta abruption earlier in this pregnancy). Even after I have the baby and can lift the idea of taking multiple young children and a newborn 30-45 miles away from home to 5+ stops to find the things I need is logical. Sure, all the moms with older children, publicly education children, ect... can but realistically it is not an option.

So, are there any other options for me?

That is rudimentary interpretation of information like I was talking about. Everything is a chemical, and there are only so many chemicals in the world. You aren't going to not drink water just because it is only one oxygen molecule away from being hydrogen peroxide are you? Assuming you are referring to the ALL study, the factor that contributes to the cancer is a delay in eating solid food, and the suspicion is that the cause is related to delayed stimulation and activation of the immune system, not by ingestion of a causative agent. I also have not read of exploration of confounding variables when exploring the differences in breast fed v formula fed babies (in relation to ALL). The inability of someone with MTHFR to metabolize folic acid does not mean that folic acid is bad for everyone. Dietary recommendations are understandably broad; hopefully personalized medicine will become more feasible and available in the future so that medicine, including dietary recommendations, can be tailored to the individual. Accurate prevalence of the MTHFR mutation is probably hard to measure or extrapolate given the small sample sizes of the studies, though it appears to be estimated at 6-14% for whites, 2% for blacks outside of Africa, and 21% for hispanics. Being that it is so rare and given the proven benefits of folic acid supplementation, I can't see that recommendation being suspended.

I am not arguing - just trying to understand how you would lift premixed feed but not feed that you need to mix. It can be mixed in smaller batches.

 

[SunHwaKwon]

Are you feeding your family strictly organic foods? If not, then, IMO, the organic standard for chicken feed is a moot point. I am growing a garden and raising chickens to provide as much natural food as I can. but, I buy my groceries at the local store, and do not have the funds, nor the desire to spend my money on organic foods for myself, or for my animals. The big criteria for me when choosing my chicken feed is this: it must be reasonably fresh. according to a published poultry nutrition expert, 6 weeks from mill date is the turning point. I sprout, and I ferment feed for the birds, free range when I can be out to supervise (due to heavy hawk predation). Otherwise, I don't sweat the details about organic/not organic. Sadly, GMO is also something I don't have the financial resources to fight.

BTW, congrats on your pregnancy. Hoping you have an easy and healthy delivery. Wishing the best for you and your growing family.

I am the same way. It would be pointless for me to buy organic feed (even if I had money to just throw away) since I don't buy organic food for myself. I do like to buy local stuff, but I can't justify buying organic from a financial or scientific stand point, and any "moral" benefits may or may not be accurate, as well, especially if you are not buying local.

 

[Ridgerunner]

So, are there any other options for me?

The only option I can think of is to look online until you find something that meets your criteria and have it delivered if you can stand the cost.

I wish you luck, it's not always easy.

 

[Kiki]