White barred chicken...?

[Texasclucker]

Not to hijack this thread but not long ago i ordered some lavender cochins and when you look at one of the suspected roosters he has slight barring. Also that bird is gorgeous!

 

[NatJ]

Sorry, I’m confused, I thought all this time that dominant white replaced extended black, I didn’t know they could coexist in homozygous form. I guess that’s what I get for not learning the nomenclature.

At the E locus, a chicken can have Extended Black (or Birchen, or wheaten or wild-type or whatever else.)

So a chicken that is E/E is pure for Extended Black. It will be a solid black chicken, unless some other genes get involved.

Then there are genes that can modify black:
Blue turns black to blue or splash
Chocolate turns black to a dark brown
Lavender turns black to a light "self blue" color
Dominant White turns black to white-- although one copy of the Dominant White gene will let some bits of black leak through (Paint), while two copies of the gene will make the bird actually white.

For all of those genes that can modify black, they affect any black parts on the bird. So on an all-black bird, they affect the whole chicken. But a black-laced-gold chicken can become blue-laced-gold or chocolate-laced-gold or lavender-laced-gold or white-laced-gold. Or a chicken with black spangles can become a chicken with blue spangles (or chocolate or lavender or white). Or a black bird with white barring can become a blue/chocolate/lavender/white bird with white barring.

 

[RoostersAreAwesome]

At the E locus, a chicken can have Extended Black (or Birchen, or wheaten or wild-type or whatever else.)

So a chicken that is E/E is pure for Extended Black. It will be a solid black chicken, unless some other genes get involved.

Then there are genes that can modify black:
Blue turns black to blue or splash
Chocolate turns black to a dark brown
Lavender turns black to a light "self blue" color
Dominant White turns black to white-- although one copy of the Dominant White gene will let some bits of black leak through (Paint), while two copies of the gene will make the bird actually white.

For all of those genes that can modify black, they affect any black parts on the bird. So on an all-black bird, they affect the whole chicken. But a black-laced-gold chicken can become blue-laced-gold or chocolate-laced-gold or lavender-laced-gold or white-laced-gold. Or a chicken with black spangles can become a chicken with blue spangles (or chocolate or lavender or white). Or a black bird with white barring can become a blue/chocolate/lavender/white bird with white barring.

I know a lot of what you’re telling me- I just don’t really think about the actual genetic code most of the time. For instance, I know that chocolate is a sex-linked recessive gene, but I’m not entirely sure how to write out its genetic nomenclature.

 

[FrappcinoObsession]

Thought I’d give an update. @All4Eggz @RoostersAreAwesome @MysteryChicken @Amer
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I think his color is darker than it was before. Idk thoughts?

HE is so pretty what are hes parent or what is he mix with so I can make my own he is gorgeous

 

[NatJ]

I know a lot of what you’re telling me-

Sorry about that. I'm never quite sure who knows which details, but so many people do not know the basics that I tend to start there.

I just don’t really think about the actual genetic code most of the time. For instance, I know that chocolate is a sex-linked recessive gene, but I’m not entirely sure how to write out its genetic nomenclature.

In that case you might find the genetics calculator helpful:
https://kippenjungle.nl/kruising.html
Down the left side, there is a list of names and symbols.
Then each dropdown box shows all the possible combinations for that particular locus.
("Locus" is a spot on the chromosome where the gene is located.)

For any particular locus, a capital letter indicates a dominant gene, while a lower case letter indicates a recessive gene. (E or e, I or i)

+ means it's the wild-type gene (what the wild jungle fowl have: e+ or i+)

When there are more than two options (alleles) at one locus, they get extra letters added to tell them apart: E is Extended Black, but e^b is partridge (also called "brown") and E^R is Birchen and E^Wh is Wheaten. The extra letters are sometimes written up higher than the main letter (superscript), but that's harder to type, so ^ is used to show that they belong up there.

The letters for the various genes usually have something to do with the name of the gene, although sometimes it's a bit of a stretch to see how it relates. (Obvious: S for Silver, Lav for Lavender, B for Barring. Less obvious: E for Extended Black, Mh for Mahogany, Ig for Inhibitor of Gold which is also called cream. And I don't know why they used I for Dominant White, unless because it "inhibits" black.)

 

[3KillerBs]

In that case you might find the genetics calculator helpful:
https://kippenjungle.nl/kruising.html

Has anyone ever written a step-by-step tutorial article for how to use this calculator?

I just spent 10 minutes fiddling with it trying to find out what would happen if my suspicious French Cuckoo Marans chick is a rooster and I bred him to my Blue Australorp hens and I couldn't figure out how to switch from the partridge picture to cuckoo.

I can deal with it not being in English, but the learning curve is pretty steep.

 

[Amer]

Has anyone ever written a step-by-step tutorial article for how to use this calculator?

I just spent 10 minutes fiddling with it trying to find out what would happen if my suspicious French Cuckoo Marans chick is a rooster and I bred him to my Blue Australorp hens and I couldn't figure out how to switch from the partridge picture to cuckoo.

I can deal with it not being in English, but the learning curve is pretty steep.

I find it’s easier to start from this page:
https://kippenjungle.nl/Overzicht.htm
Or use this:

The advanced side of the calculator is kinda geared towards ppl who have an understanding of the genotypes.

 

[3KillerBs]

I find it’s easier to start from this page:
https://kippenjungle.nl/Overzicht.htm
Or use this:View attachment 2726604
The advanced side of the calculator is kinda geared towards ppl who have an understanding of the genotypes.

It doesn't look like that on my desktop. There is no "explain locus" or "About Buff" button showing.

I was trying to use the breeds because I have only the vaguest idea of what genes my chickens have. I know that there's a barred gene in the French Cuckoo Marans but not if there is a difference between regular barred and cuckoo. I kinda-sorta get blue/black/splash for the Blue Australorps -- maybe.

 

[NatJ]

I always use the calculator from a desktop computer.
My screen usually looks similar to what Amer showed.

I usually go to https://kippenjungle.nl/kruising.html
I think it's an older version, but it just has fewer options than some of the others.
Almost everything on that page is in English when I see it (if there's a way to set language, I haven't found it.)

I don't usually calculate actual crosses, but I use it to play with what genes do what (change the box, see the picture change.) It has helped me figure out what genes do what, and what symbols go with them.

For actually trying crosses, I do Punnett Squares for each trait, either in my head or manually. (But that requires knowing what traits are involved.)

I know that there's a barred gene in the French Cuckoo Marans but not if there is a difference between regular barred and cuckoo.

They should have the same barring gene either way. Other genes make the difference in whether the barring is nice and clear and tidy ("Barred") or not ("Cuckoo"). The calculator doesn't model any of the other genes that affect it. I have read that slow feathering leads to crisper barring, but I'm pretty sure there are other modifiers involved as well, and I haven't found any information on what they are or how to breed for them. (Of course people have managed for a long time by just breeding the best together and hoping for an even better one.)

Has anyone ever written a step-by-step tutorial article for how to use this calculator?

Not that I've found.

I just spent 10 minutes fiddling with it trying to find out what would happen if my suspicious French Cuckoo Marans chick is a rooster and I bred him to my Blue Australorp hens and I couldn't figure out how to switch from the partridge picture to cuckoo.

For the rooster, change the E locus to E/E, and the barring locus to B/B, and you should get a Barred or Cuckoo rooster. (Unless your rooster has the darker barring that comes with only one copy of the barring gene, in which case use B/b+)

For the Blue Australorp, change the E locus to E/E and the blue locus to Bl/bl+.

For this cross, none of the other genes should have any noticeable effect.

The chicks should all be pure for Extended Black (E/E) with one copy of the barring gene (B/b+ for males, B/_ for females because they only have one Z chromosome.) Half of them should be blue (Bl/bl+) while the other half have actual black (bl+/bl+). Putting all that together, it would be a mix of Cuckoo and Blue Cuckoo chicks, with both colors distributed evenly among both genders.

If your rooster only has one copy of the barring gene (B/b+), then it's the same as above except that only half of his offspring get barring. So you would have an even mix of all-black, all-blue, Cuckoo and Blue Cuckoo, again with all colors present in both genders.

 

[3KillerBs]

I usually go to https://kippenjungle.nl/kruising.html
I think it's an older version, but it just has fewer options than some of the others.
Almost everything on that page is in English when I see it (if there's a way to set language, I haven't found it.)

That does have the buttons, though in different places.

Not being able to start with the breed pre-filled still gives a pretty steep learning curve when you have no idea what genes a given breed is supposed to have.

Not that I've found.

Someone needs to write one.

The chicks should all be pure for Extended Black (E/E) with one copy of the barring gene (B/b+ for males, B/_ for females because they only have one Z chromosome.) Half of them should be blue (Bl/bl+) while the other half have actual black (bl+/bl+). Putting all that together, it would be a mix of Cuckoo and Blue Cuckoo chicks, with both colors distributed evenly among both genders.

If your rooster only has one copy of the barring gene (B/b+), then it's the same as above except that only half of his offspring get barring. So you would have an even mix of all-black, all-blue, Cuckoo and Blue Cuckoo, again with all colors present in both genders.

Thank you.

I don't *know* that I have a cockerel among my Marans, but I'm suspicious of the one with the purple band, who was the chick we called "Big Spot" because his white head spot was larger than the others. https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/introducing-the-ideal-dozen.1469451/post-24604745