white bread for chicken

[Red-Stars-in-RI]

This is getting pretty far off topic. I'm not single in any case.

Agreed! I present “chickens, bread, and compost” in an attempt to redirect!

 

[NatJ]

The only requirement that poultry eats to meet is calories.

Not supported by the research I can find.

Here's a quote from one paper that cites a bunch of other researchers:

"The ability of chickens to select a balanced diet if offered a choice of various feed ingredients has been demonstrated by a number of workers (Graham 1934; Holcombe et al 1975; Emmans 1977; Summers and Leeson 1978). The principle underlying choice feeding of poultry is that individual birds reared in a flock are able to select between various feed ingredients according to individual needs and production capacities. This is not possible when a single conventional food is given. Cumming (1992a) and Ciszuk et al (1998) reported that choice feeding (of whole grains plus a protein concentrate and calcium) of layers has financial advantages for rural small-scale poultry production."
http://www.lrrd.org/lrrd17/4/pous17045.htm

 

[PepsiCatt]

this reminds me of the saying The Whiter the Bread the sooner Your Dead.

 

[Chris2018]

Not supported by the research I can find.

Here's a quote from one paper that cites a bunch of other researchers:

"The ability of chickens to select a balanced diet if offered a choice of various feed ingredients has been demonstrated by a number of workers (Graham 1934; Holcombe et al 1975; Emmans 1977; Summers and Leeson 1978). The principle underlying choice feeding of poultry is that individual birds reared in a flock are able to select between various feed ingredients according to individual needs and production capacities. This is not possible when a single conventional food is given. Cumming (1992a) and Ciszuk et al (1998) reported that choice feeding (of whole grains plus a protein concentrate and calcium) of layers has financial advantages for rural small-scale poultry production."
http://www.lrrd.org/lrrd17/4/pous17045.htm

Merck Manual
Veterinary Manual
Nutritional Requirements of Poultry

"Poultry can adjust their feed intake over a considerable range of feed energy levels to meet their daily energy needs. Energy needs and, consequently, feed intake also vary considerably with environmental temperature and amount of physical activity. A bird’s daily need for amino acids, vitamins, and minerals are mostly independent of these factors. The nutrient requirement values in the following tables are based on typical rates of intake of birds in a thermoneutral environment consuming a diet that contains a specific energy content (eg, 3,200 kcal/kg for broilers). If a bird consumes a diet that has a higher energy content, it will decrease its feed intake; consequently, that diet must contain a proportionally higher amount of amino acids, vitamins, and minerals. Thus, nutrient density in the ration should be adjusted to provide appropriate nutrient intake based on requirements and the actual feed intake."

 

[NatJ]

Merck Manual
Veterinary Manual
Nutritional Requirements of Poultry

"Poultry can adjust their feed intake over a considerable range of feed energy levels to meet their daily energy needs. Energy needs and, consequently, feed intake also vary considerably with environmental temperature and amount of physical activity. A bird’s daily need for amino acids, vitamins, and minerals are mostly independent of these factors. The nutrient requirement values in the following tables are based on typical rates of intake of birds in a thermoneutral environment consuming a diet that contains a specific energy content (eg, 3,200 kcal/kg for broilers). If a bird consumes a diet that has a higher energy content, it will decrease its feed intake; consequently, that diet must contain a proportionally higher amount of amino acids, vitamins, and minerals. Thus, nutrient density in the ration should be adjusted to provide appropriate nutrient intake based on requirements and the actual feed intake."

But that one refers to chickens fed ONE diet, and the only thing the chicken can control is how much they eat.

The one I cited refers to chickens given CHOICES among several foods. The chickens ate more of one food and less of another to balance their diet.

So I don't think you and I are talking about quite the same things here.

I think the free-range chickens (access to feed, bugs, grass) are more similar to the chickens who were offered a choice of feedstuffs.

 

[chicknmania]

The feed is made of ingredients that the birds would naturally ear. When grandma fed chickens bread, grandma really didn't care how healthy they were or how long they lived. You can feed table scrapsand they can free range to supplement but if you can't afford or be bothered with feed...why bother with chickens at all?

 

[Chris2018]

But that one refers to chickens fed ONE diet, and the only thing the chicken can control is how much they eat.

The one I cited refers to chickens given CHOICES among several foods. The chickens ate more of one food and less of another to balance their diet.

So I don't think you and I are talking about quite the same things here.

I think the free-range chickens (access to feed, bugs, grass) are more similar to the chickens who were offered a choice of feedstuffs.

There going to fill there caloric need ether way that you feed them.
Note the one you cited was to a point inconclusive.

"Laying birds seem less able to choose wisely than broilers, and individual amino acids do not seem to be well chosen. In most of the experiments reported there is considerable variation in diet selection between individuals that might simply be a reflection of different requirements of protein and energy. However, there is little evidence on which to base such a supposition and further work is required to explain this variation. Perhaps the use of operant conditioning or other methods of quantifying the strength of birds' choices will yield better understanding in this area"

The reason the birds didn't "choose wisely" is because the birds were filling there caloric needs.

 

[Maryot]

We've always fed bread to our ducks and chickens with zero problems at all so yeah if you wanna feed em bread go for it. Alot of this information people get now comes from feed companies saying that without their products all animals will die. Theres been thousands of chickens raised off grandmas old scrap bowl before Purina came around.

I think a diet has to be balanced no matter who you’re feeding.

 

[Suzz]

this reminds me of the saying The Whiter the Bread the sooner Your Dead.

My sister says white bread till your dead!

 

[Tilhana]

I believe your misunderstanding my post.
If a hen eat a 17% protein feed then she is left out and lets say eats some grass, lettuce and some feed corn. All three of these things are lower in protein than the feed so they all deplete/lower the 17% protein in the feed...

Example ---
17% protein poultry feed ÷ 100 = .17% protein per lb of feed
8% protein corn ÷ 100 = .08% protein per lb of corn
If you mix 10 lbs of corn with 90 lbs of 17% protein poultry feed your over all mix would be 16.10% protein.

The only requirement that poultry eats to meet is calories.

I understand your logic, but in real life, a chicken doesn't need 20% of its diet to be protein, it just needs to eat a certain amount of protein per day (or more accurately, per x calories expended during a day). The use of percentages in commercial chicken feed is only useful insofaras one assumes that a chicken is being fed y units of calories per day by the farmer, and the farmer is calculating y based on the assumption that s/he is providing the chicken's entire calorie count for the day. So, for example, if you're feeding 1/3 lb of feed per chicken per day, that's based on an assumption about how many calories and how many weight units of every macro- and micro-nutrient a chicken needs per day, times the relative percentages of each of those nutrients/calories per unit of commercial feed you are using. It's very convenient if you assume that chickens are eating a homogenous diet of commercial feed and nothing else, and since, what, 95% of chickens raised in this country are in the industrial system where that feed IS all they get, this has become the standard easy way to ensure that their nutritional needs are met.

But if you look at nutritional recommendations for humans, we do it completely differently. We aren't told that 20% of our daily calorie intake should be protein; we're told to eat a certain number of grams of protein (or calories, or iron, or vitamin C, etc) per day, depending on a statistically average weight, caloric needs and/or metabolic rate for women, men, or children. A nutritionist won't ever warn you not to eat too much of one type of healthy food because it will throw off your percentages. As long as you're meeting that daily total for each nutrient, you're good, and you're free to indulge in extra citrus fruit if you want without worrying that now your Vitamin C count has gone up and thrown all your other nutrient percentages off.

The reason it's different for humans is because we eat a more complex and varied diet than farmed chickens traditionally have, and humans don't just stop eating once they've met all their nurtitional needs for the day. Commercial chicken feed is marketed with the expectation that that is all you're feeding them, and once their morning rations are gone, they won't eat again until tomorrow. But in reality, an animal that is free to forage for part of its daily food, provided the foraging area is abundant in a variety of food sources, will instinctively try to compensate for any nutrient deficiencies. This is why you can offer free choice minerals to farm animals to help supplement for pasture that may be depleted in certain micronutrients.

Moreover, chickens generally prefer meat and carbs over greens, and it's rare to find a bird who will munch all day on grass and leaves when there are lots of bugs around, especially if they're getting less than their daily needs for protein from their grain feed.