Who disbuds their kids?

[kstaven]

I'm an exception to the group here, as I never disbudd goats anymore. Have never had a goat hurt or a person here hurt due to horns. Most people bring issues on themselves by using the horns as grab handles and thus teach a goat that they are part of the goat to human play routine.

 

[helmstead]

As it's obviously already known, I don't disbud my goats. IMHO, it's inhumane and potentially dangerous when done by untrained or undertrained people. Even vets can botch the process. I know of one breeder who has already lost three kids this year to disbuddings gone awry.

You can find polled Nigerians. I have a small breeding program for polled, too, which I hope to add to in order to satisfy people who prefer hornless goats without having to venture into burning little kids heads off.

Yes, horned goats get their head stuck in field fencing - so we used smaller fencing! They don't tear anything up with their horns at our place other than sapling trees. Even our buck, Henry, who ruts on things, hasn't broken anything with his massive rack.

It's personal preference. I don't knock people for doing it, I just choose not to participate in the act.

 

[Southern28Chick]

Here's a quote from a book I'm reading:

Breeding for Hornlessness

Some goats are naturally hornless, or polled. So many people ask, Why not breed goats for hornlessness?

One of the main reasons has been the genetic link between hornlessness and hermaphroditism. Many goats born of hornless-to-hornless matings are hermaphrodites, or both sexes, which from a practical standpoint means they are sexless.

So basically if you breed a naturally hornless goat to another hornless goat you will get hermaphrodite kids. The book also says that hermaphrodite goats are often overly aggressive or unusually withdrawn.

The hermaphrodite looks like a doe externally, but it actually has male organs internally. Not all have external abnormalities. Carefully examine the vulvas of newborn kids. A growth about the size of a pea at the bottom of the vagina is abnormal.

I'd be afraid to buy a naturally hornless goat for fear that I would get a hermaphrodite and couldn't breed it.

My girls are already disbudded.​

 

[Wolf-Kim]

My friend Karen has never lost one to disbudding, but she does know a lady who lost one kid. Karen says she doesn't let anyone but herself do the disbudding because of it. She believes many vets in our area won't/don't deal with goats. Anyway, her friend asked the vet to come out and disbud an older kid. The vet showed up and disbudded that poor little goat with a CATTLE disbudder! Little thing ended up dead.

It truly is a preference. I know next time I have goats they'll be disbudded just because of the whole fencing issue. I cannot tell you how annoyed I was at the little idiots(sorry still annoyed about it) that they would reach through the fence and without fail get stuck. Then they would cry, and cry, and cry because everything behind them(other goats and miniature horses) would take advantage of the make-shift breeding hobbles.

These goats weren't even mine and I was ready to eat them! LOL I was babysitting them, so I wasn't even there all the time. It took two people to release them and not a single minute would go by until it would stick his head right back in the fence. Ugh.. talk about frustration.. there wasn't anything but sand on the other side of the fence anyway.. there wasn't even a reason for them to stick their heads through.. Silly, aggravating things...

Adam said he didn't want his bucks disbudded, I told him fine but you better get a buck with such a large horn-spread that he cannot get stuck. LOL. I also told him when it does get stuck, he will be the one untangling it.

I have never had an issue with horns as weapons but I have had issues with horns and getting stuck. To me, it seems so much better to hear the kids cry for the couple of minutes of getting disbudded than hear them cry ALL day long because they're stuck. I would almost cry trying to "untangle" them, because the struggle harder because you're trying to help them and they actually begin choking themselves. So it seemed everytime they would get stuck the goat would almost suffocate and deemed us as the evil monsters trying to kill them and I would end up physically and emotionally exhausted.(They are much stronger than they look, especially when panicked!)

-Kim

 

[Wolf-Kim]

Quote:
So basically if you breed a naturally hornless goat to another hornless goat you will get hermaphrodite kids. The book also says that hermaphrodite goats are often overly aggressive or unusually withdrawn.

The hermaphrodite looks like a doe externally, but it actually has male organs internally. Not all have external abnormalities. Carefully examine the vulvas of newborn kids. A growth about the size of a pea at the bottom of the vagina is abnormal.

I'd be afraid to buy a naturally hornless goat for fear that I would get a hermaphrodite and couldn't breed it.

My girls are already disbudded.​

Adam had a hermaphrodite with horns! LOL. It would run around and attack his Black Angus cattle. They named it "Sally".

-Kim

 

[Southern28Chick]

Quote:
So basically if you breed a naturally hornless goat to another hornless goat you will get hermaphrodite kids. The book also says that hermaphrodite goats are often overly aggressive or unusually withdrawn.

The hermaphrodite looks like a doe externally, but it actually has male organs internally. Not all have external abnormalities. Carefully examine the vulvas of newborn kids. A growth about the size of a pea at the bottom of the vagina is abnormal.

I'd be afraid to buy a naturally hornless goat for fear that I would get a hermaphrodite and couldn't breed it.

My girls are already disbudded.​

Adam had a hermaphrodite with horns! LOL. It would run around and attack his Black Angus cattle. They named it "Sally".

-Kim

So 2 naturally hornless goats made a hermaphrodite kid with horns?

 

[Broke Down Ranch]

I plan on disbudding any kids so was wondering whe I can buy a disbudder?

 

[Wolf-Kim]

Quote:
I don't know if it's parent's were polled. I just know Adam had a horned hermaphrodite growing up. I think hermaphrodites can occur in goats whose parents are horned, but I think what that book is stated it that there is a much higher possibility of a hermaphrodite when breeded naturally polled.

-Kim

 

[helmstead]

Here is the problem with 'book experts'....no one book is correct in every aspect and interpretation is not always correct, either.

No - you don't ALWAYS get a hermaphrodite. It's somewhere in the 1 in 5 area, many times it's less than that in well bred herds. Do some more research.

Talk to breeders who have primarily polled herds and breeding programs.

Southern28Chick, I highly suggest you hit the road and go meet breeders, take a pot of coffee and sit down to talk goats. Altho I applaud you for researching before you buy - which MOST goat owners do not do - you have to get some real life input from producers. This Storey's book you're putting so much stock into is giving you a false sense of experience and knowledge. Think of it like a newspaper...you can't believe everything you read no matter who published it.

 

[Southern28Chick]

Quote:
http://www.hoeggergoatsupply.com/xcart/home.php?cat=32&js=y
I heard you should buy the priciest one you can afford to insure you get a good quality HOT iron.