Why Organic?

[seedcorn]

perchie.girl :

Very very interesting thread I must say. Learning bunches keeping my opinions to myself....LOL...

what fun is that?


Interesting thought that if an organic producer wants to be organic that it is his responsibility to do it where contamination is not a threat. Something commercial ag has had to do since the beginning. In hybrid corn, seed acres are no where near popcorn acres and if near commercial corn, there is a buffer zone to stop cross pollination. I've known in past where they used to pay the near by farmers for planting soybeans near their seed fields of corn.

Crops that are self pollinators--alfalfa, soybeans, cannola, wheat, have very little danger if a buffer strip is used or isn't used. In the case of soybeans, responsible growers don't even keep for seed the first 60' around the field.

I find interesting all the health claims on this thread, but yet none of the medical community/health community can support this. I'm not stating that some aren't helped, but if it was as clear cut as some say it is, it would be out there just like aspirin is for head aches.​

 

[AquaEyes]

If it's not possible to happen, then why ask?


Quote:
Commercial farming, in the form against which organic farming rebels, is less than a century old. "Centuries ago" there was only organic, because technology did not yet offer an alternative.



~Chris

 

[chickened]

Are you sure Organic by modern definition was practiced a century ago? If your plow animal crapped in the field after eating some feed that was treated with a mold inhibitor would your field be Organic? Most diseases that seeds are immune to nowadays would have a heyday back then. The folks farming then would jump at the chance to get the yields of today in commercial farming. And for arguments sake lets say 50 years ago and a farmer can sue Monsanto but they need to be prepared to pay the costs if they lose. People in certain groups use the courts to get their way when they fail at the legislative level. For instance,It would be stupid of me to buy property along a busy road and then petition the court to limit traffic especially when I cannot prove there is a problem except I don't approve of it. Case in point with the organic crowd all they offer is junk science and theories. Studies always favor the group funding it. I remember years ago the environmentalist claimed there were so many millions of acres of old growth forest before logging during a timber summit with President Clinton I did the math on the acreage and according to my calculations their claim was there was old growth forests from the west coast to the Mississippi river from Canada to Mexico, what happened to the great plains? You see why I don't believe any of their propaganda, I also have no problem with them doing it but they cross the line when they tell me what is good for me.
Quote:

Commercial farming, in the form against which organic farming rebels, is less than a century old. "Centuries ago" there was only organic, because technology did not yet offer an alternative.



~Chris

 

[chickened]

Good point, organic farming practices have issues with runoff and their farms could potentially effect the down hill/stream farms changing soil ph, manure residue and the like. I would not like an organic farm near my place I own machinery and do welding and other things and the organic farmers I know would complain and then the war would begin. What would the organic farmer do about air pollution? I shutter to think.
Quote:
what fun is that?


Interesting thought that if an organic producer wants to be organic that it is his responsibility to do it where contamination is not a threat. Something commercial ag has had to do since the beginning. In hybrid corn, seed acres are no where near popcorn acres and if near commercial corn, there is a buffer zone to stop cross pollination. I've known in past where they used to pay the near by farmers for planting soybeans near their seed fields of corn.

Crops that are self pollinators--alfalfa, soybeans, cannola, wheat, have very little danger if a buffer strip is used or isn't used. In the case of soybeans, responsible growers don't even keep for seed the first 60' around the field.

I find interesting all the health claims on this thread, but yet none of the medical community/health community can support this. I'm not stating that some aren't helped, but if it was as clear cut as some say it is, it would be out there just like aspirin is for head aches.

 

[BlackBart]

The term organic doesn't really mean organic anymore, not in the sense as it used to. Thanks to government wording and allowances.
'Green-washing" is a perfect example of how Government wording has allowed corporations to mislead the public.

At least according to this article regarding USDA's Certified Organic products. One again, something good ends up becoming corrupt because of money.

http://farmwars.info/?p=4913

 

[chickened]

I think you are right Bart when has the government taken over anything and it worked? U.S. Postal Service?

 

[GhostRider65]

Yes chickened we were sick alot, mostly my son and after years of meds, from the Dr.s allergy shots ect. I couldn't take it anymore, our insurance is garbage and we switched because it was more affordable than Dr.s,
Me and my husband got bronchitis every fall that seemed to hang on until spring, 3 different antibiotics later and several months of treatment it finally went away for a bit, we had colds and got just about everything we came in contact with, my husband works at Walmart the last 8 years. Hence the crap insurance change. so everything that went around came home with him. We also smoke our 1 bad habit we have not been able to break....... trying too, even though that is taking it's tole on our lungs we still do not get sick my Doctor can't figure out why?? is quite baffled, when I seen him last with my grandson at an appointment, he exclaimed why I thought you fell off the planet, did you quit smoking? I told you you wouldn't get sick so often if you quit!!!! LOL you should have seen the look on his face when I told him NO we still smoke just started eating better.and went mostly organic. He for years blamed every thing we got on smoking. even my sons allergies, but we never smoke in the house/car. Maybe I'm wrong it's some other reason, but common sense says it's the better diet and better quality food. Kim

 

[GhostRider65]

Quote:
what fun is that?


Interesting thought that if an organic producer wants to be organic that it is his responsibility to do it where contamination is not a threat. Something commercial ag has had to do since the beginning. In hybrid corn, seed acres are no where near popcorn acres and if near commercial corn, there is a buffer zone to stop cross pollination. I've known in past where they used to pay the near by farmers for planting soybeans near their seed fields of corn.

Crops that are self pollinators--alfalfa, soybeans, cannola, wheat, have very little danger if a buffer strip is used or isn't used. In the case of soybeans, responsible growers don't even keep for seed the first 60' around the field.

I find interesting all the health claims on this thread, but yet none of the medical community/health community can support this. I'm not stating that some aren't helped, but if it was as clear cut as some say it is, it would be out there just like aspirin is for head aches.

Its out there but you must look hard for it, the pharmaceutical companies and big AG have been covering things up for years, trying to bans things that have support like vitamin C and many others, I can't think of off hand but I have read just about everything I could find on this stuff, and there's lots. Besides that how canm ytou believe a government about anything that lies to you daily about just small things, let alone huge profits to keep the little guy down and the bigs guys lining their pockets.
This is a flyer I got who knows when, just scanned through it but it has some interesting idea's in it.
http://www.naturalnews.com/026434_vaccines_vaccination_vaccinations.html this site is also interesting
http://healthfreedoms.org/category/big-government/

 

[Katy]

Quote:
I find it rather odd that you can bad mouth "big AG" for trying to poison you with what we grow but you make the choice to still smoke and put those poisons into your body. Seems pretty hypocrital to me.

I'm a farmer who farms conventionly and grows some GMO crops. Plus I'm a former smoker who went from 2 packs a day to none cold turkey 37 years ago this week.

Until this past fall when I developed a detached and torn retina I hadn't been to a doctor for close to 20 years. I grow a lot of our own food, but I am not scared of using GMO crops. I wouldn't say I eat particularly either....I'm a junk food fan and start my day off with a pepsi every morning.

 

[perchie.girl]

Quote:
what fun is that?


Interesting thought that if an organic producer wants to be organic that it is his responsibility to do it where contamination is not a threat. Something commercial ag has had to do since the beginning. In hybrid corn, seed acres are no where near popcorn acres and if near commercial corn, there is a buffer zone to stop cross pollination. I've known in past where they used to pay the near by farmers for planting soybeans near their seed fields of corn.

Crops that are self pollinators--alfalfa, soybeans, cannola, wheat, have very little danger if a buffer strip is used or isn't used. In the case of soybeans, responsible growers don't even keep for seed the first 60' around the field.

I find interesting all the health claims on this thread, but yet none of the medical community/health community can support this. I'm not stating that some aren't helped, but if it was as clear cut as some say it is, it would be out there just like aspirin is for head aches.

LOL... I have a different point of view... maybe... I havent read the whole thread. I got about half way.

I am not a farmer but my grandfather was a sharecropper. The whole family farmed every thing from Cotton to Pigs, working their way from Florida to Southern California. Dad was a scientist, of sorts.... Because he hated farming. He invented things to help scientists achieve their goals....

So I grew up with very different perspective. Moldy food ? cut the mold off and eat it.... Or wash it. (surface mold not rotted through) I know how to get the ants out of the cereal so I can have breakfast. When I was a child (I am 56 now) Mom and I would regularly eat raw hamberger because it was considered safe. This was back when the Butcher was the one that actually made hamberger.

I worked briefly in the biomed industry as a tool designer back in the year that Jurassic Park was relased in theaters 1993. They hired me to reverse engineer tools for Gene splicing. I Loved the movie.... and spoke with the Geneticist who was on loan from an ivy league college and in charge of the Genetically technical end of the projects. I asked him if Jurassic park was possible. He had no hesitation whatsoever.... "absolutely". Even with the Old time Cray computers they were using in the movie. What scared me more than the thought of dinosaurs walking around and saying boo. Was the fact that this company sold its tools for Gene splicing to ANYONE who wanted them. This company was competing with the Japanese for market share in the tools for that industry. That gene genie is out of the bag. Thank goodness it was a job on contract and when it was done I was gone.

I have seen some wonderful things come from the Biomed industry and gene splicing. Human Insulin for one. So I am not for throwing the baby out with the bathwater. But Michael Chriton put it very succintly.... Just because we can do a thing doesnt mean we should.

Organic... I saw the beginnings of this from a teenagers point of view back in the sixties. I was too young to be a hippy by about four or five years. What came out from that end was popularizing recycling and repurposing.... But I saw my granmother use the same piece of Tinfoil several times before throwing it away.... And Create yeast for bread using a stone crock flower sugar and milk and time. Organic is not new just become popularized. And of course the money makers jumped on the bandwagon.

I personally have land that is a cornucopia of medicinals. eighteen acres.... with plants like Yucca, Yerba Santa, Sage, Ribbonwood or Red Shank, Mormon tea. I would never plow it under to plant a crop. 'Sides the dirt itself isnt organic.... its decomposed granite. I dont have the water anyway. Well is a very low producer. Being a desert person as I am I dont believe in growing things that dont belong here. But thats me I would never tell my neighbors that they should not do something. unless they are shooting their gun off and I hear bullets wizzing over head. I took care of that one really quick....LOL.

So I believe disucssion passionate or objective is a very good thing. Bringing up all the concerns and points of view opens peoples eyes to different perspectives. Concerns weather real or percieved cause people to dig deeper into the realities and hopefully brings the subject more into focus. I just am not able to join in a passionate conversation. Because I can see both sides and would rather take a balanced view if possible. I tend to offer up sources or technical papers if I can find them. My gift is research.