Why would I want or NOT want to feed animal fats/animal protein?

[bibliophile birds]

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we've been discussing this over on this thread if you are interested. there is a LOT of info from both sides, so it's a pretty imformative argument (with a couple of helpful sidetracks).

it is particularly hard to make these kinds of feed choices. when your options are potentially hazardous (and, at the very least, gross) animal by-products OR soy... well, i don't know what i would choose. however, the one with animal protein probably still has soy, so in that case, it'd have to be the lesser of 2 evils.

search around and you might be able to find one that doesn't have either. in that case, you will need to personally monitor the health of your birds since you may need to feed some animal protein yourself.

good luck!

 

[Organics North]

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Me too..I agree with the above post.
Here is my personal opinion/experience:
I recall when growing up on the farm we would sell our sick and dying animals to a company that would make animal protein for feed. Not sure if they still do that or not but...yuck.. Fine a guess for a feeding a animal you do not intend eating their eggs or their meat... I personally also want to avoid soy when possible in my families food, and if they use pork as one of the animal proteins then most likely they were fed soy.

Chickens being omnivorous and all, I do supplement my purchased premixed organic feed (which does have soy and corn...grrrr..) with animal protein such as fish meal, fish scraps, bugs, worms, or leftovers.

Just my opinion and what I am doing personally...
ON

 

[Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay]

Vegetarian Feeding is a Marketing Ploy, pure and simple!

Animal proteins provide an amino acid profile that more close match the amino acid needs of the bird. You also gain the advantage of fats that add to the energy content of the feed.

Plant proteins are typically cheaper than animal proteins, but they don't have amino acid profiles that meet the needs of birds. This requires the use of synthetic amino acids or animal proteins to provide the necessary amino acid profile.

Virtually all commercial poultry feeds that contains animal proteins will also contain plant protein and probably some synthetic amino acids.. This allows the nutritionist to provide a diet that meets the amino acid needs of the bird as economically as possible.

Birds can perform equally with either type of feed provided that the amino acid profiles meet the requirements of the bird.

Jim

 

[Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay]

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Could you provide some insight into your "potentially hazardous" comment regarding animal protein products?

Research from Iowa State University using Pseudorabies Virus as a model showed that the modern rendering process inactivated the virus. In addition contnued monitoring and testing of rendered animal products shows that Salmonella is not present.

Jim

 

[Mac in Wisco]

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Lions and tigers and bears, Oh my.

Both types of feeds are safe, balanced rations. As I said before, her birds will do fine on either. The birds are not going to keel over dead or grow three heads because she picked one type of feed over another.

 

[Organics North]

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Wiki has some "interesting" info on methionine.

Go down to the dietary and restrictions section.
Though I personally agree with the above post that chicken or eggs marketed as "vegetarian" is mostly a marketing ploy, and does not make for a "healthier" chicken. (If we had a rendering plant that processed only organically raised meats then I would consider it as a decent option personally.) SO back to methionine it seems it can be had in many plant based proteins and according to some studies too much is not necessarily a good thing.
Here is the link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methionine
ON

 

[bibliophile birds]

Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay :

Could you provide some insight into your "potentially hazardous" comment regarding animal protein products?

Research from Iowa State University using Pseudorabies Virus as a model showed that the modern rendering process inactivated the virus. In addition contnued monitoring and testing of rendered animal products shows that Salmonella is not present.

Jim

you only need look as far as the problems surrounding dog and cat foods to see that there are "potentially hazardous" problems with animal by-products in feed. (note the use of the word "potentially")

Potential Contaminants

Given the types of things manufacturers put in pet food, it is not surprising that bad things sometimes happen. Ingredients used in pet food are often highly contaminated with a wide variety of toxic substances. Some of these are destroyed by processing, but others are not.

* Bacteria. Slaughtered animals, as well as those that have died because of disease, injury, or natural causes, are sources of meat, by-products, and rendered meals. An animal that died on the farm might not reach a rendering plant until days after its death. Therefore the carcass is often contaminated with bacteria such as Salmonella and E. coli. Dangerous E. Coli bacteria are estimated to contaminate more than 50% of meat meals. While the cooking process may kill bacteria, it does not eliminate the endotoxins some bacteria produce during their growth. These toxins can survive processing, and can cause sickness and disease. Pet food manufacturers do not test their products for bacterial endotoxins. Because sick or dead animals can be processed as pet foods, the drugs that were used to treat or euthanize them may still be present in the end product. Penicillin and pentobarbital are just two examples of drugs that can pass through processing unchanged. Antibiotics used in livestock production are also thought to contribute to antibiotic resistance in humans.

Pet Food Recalls

When things go really wrong and serious problems are discovered in pet food, the company usually works with the FDA to coordinate a recall of the affected products. While many recalls have been widely publicized, quite a few have not.

* In 2005, 123,000 pounds of cat and dog treats were recalled due to Salmonella contamination.
* In March 2007, the most lethal pet food in history was the subject of the largest recall ever. Menu Foods recalled more than 100 brands including Iams, Eukanuba, Hill’s Science Diet, Purina Mighty Dog, and many store brands including Wal-Mart’s. Thousands of pets were sickened (the FDA received more than 17,000 reports) and an estimated 20% died from acute renal failure caused by the food. The toxin was initially believed to be a pesticide, the rat poison “aminopterin” in one of the ingredients. In April, scientists discovered high levels of melamine, a chemical used in plastics and fertilizers, in wheat gluten and rice protein concentrate imported from China. The melamine had been purposefully added to the ingredients to falsely boost their protein content. Subsequent tests revealed that the melamine-tainted ingredients had also been used in feed for cows, pigs, and chickens and thousands of animals were quarantined and destroyed. In early May, scientists identified the cause of the rapid onset kidney disease that had appeared in dogs and cats as a reaction caused by the combination of melamine and cyanuric acid, both unauthorized chemicals.

like i said, it's particularly worrying thinking about what was fed to the animals that end up as animal by-product. not to mention the prevalence of antibiotic resistance that is being found even in animals who aren't given antibiotics. where is is coming from? from animal by-products in feed.

the chance of contamination might not be high, but i'm not willing to purchase feed with animal by-products in it when i am so easily supplying animal protein myself.​