Wry neck in newly hatched chick... thoughts on putting down.

[California Ducken]

Yes, sammi has the right formula for the Poly Vi Sol.

NO IRON

You can kill (overdose) a chick/bird if it has Iron.
The amount of Iron that the infant drops have in them is Toxic to chicks!
You should do just fine. Just keep vigilant and on schedule for the next few days, and you should see much improvement.
Good Luck!

 

[California Ducken]

Ok let me see if you can counteract Iron. (I reread your post a bit more carefully) I will make call. I know you need to get it out of their system.
I will be right back.

 

[sammi]

if you see improvement with the Poly-vi-sol and electrolytes, etc as California Ducken suggests...try it..


Enfamil brand baby vitamins has 2 formulas..one with iron and one without...it's on the box.

DCT gives good advice and tips on orthopedic problems..

 

[California Ducken]

Ok, I was told (human Dr.) that once the iron in ingested there is nothing you can do but wait and see if you gave it too much. If it pulls through the night, it is a good start.
How much did you give the chickie?
Iron is a mineral that is absorbed once it starts the process through the body.

 

[astylishgirl]

I gave him a drop yesterday and a drop today. If he makes it through the night, then maybe there is hope. I don't know why I am calling him a he!


Thank y'all so much for your help. This is from my first hatch and all this is so new.

 

[sammi]

also..Vitamin E is very helpful in treating any neuro problems along with the B's..
Glenda Heywood has threads suggesting Vit, E use.

 

[California Ducken]

Yes, Yes, Yes.....sammi. Glenda has gave me a lot of helpful advise.
Good call!
Oh, it seems that we don't like calling things "it". Because it makes things so impersonal like we don't care. But in fact we care a lot! We just REALLY don't know the sex of our chicks yet!
Make sure you keep us updated please!

 

[dlhunicorn]

Many things can cause this symptom (crookneck) ... a few most common you can read about here:
http://dlhunicorn.conforums.com/index.cgi?board=emergencies&action=display&num=1160928615
(I have combined articles on both "crookneck" and "limberneck" symptom in this thread (limberneck is where the head hangs DOWN) as many do not distinguish between the two).

When people first started asking about the Polyvisol (if it was ok to use the "with extra iron" formulation) I posted that it was best to avoid the extra iron tho I did so without an explanation of why: > not because of toxicity (some bird species are very intolerant to iron (called "Iron Storage Disease") > levels which are "normal"for other bird species such as poultry which can tolerate a level up to 1000 mg before it it is considered "toxic" according to the literature) but because of possible (negative) interactions which reduce the uptake of the vitamin E (which is advised for all neurological symptoms in general irregardless of the specific cause). See this article (a portion of which I have excerpted , but please do read the entire article as it also describes in fairly easy to understand terminology the issue ):
http://www.avianmedicine.net/articles/McDonald-ISD-vit A-Zoo-Anim-Nut-version 2.doc
(excerpt)
"....
f) Vitamin E
One factor that is often overlooked when formulating dietary rations is that of vitamin E content. Vitamin E is a potent antioxidant and any compound that induces oxidative stress is considered to have a potential negative effect on vitamin E concentration in both plasma and tissues (Surai, 2002). While a minimum of 10 mg kg-1 is generally recommended for poultry (Whitehead and Portsmouth, 1989) more recent studies suggest up to 100 mg kg-1 may be required (Surai, 2002) and it is possible that dietary requirements of birds susceptible to ISD are as high as 200-300 IU kg-1, although many commercial products fall well below these recommendations (Tables 7 and 8). These requirements increase with the addition of polyunsaturated fats to the diet (Bassler, 1991), common in some nuts and sunflower seeds (Figure 1), as well as environmental factors such as atmospheric pollutants, toxins, infectious agents and other stressors (Herdt and Stowe, 1991).

Iron and vitamin E are involved in electron transfer in redox-cycles, and a dietary surplus of iron decreases á-tocopherol concentrations (Lucesoli and Fraga, 1995; van Jaarsveld and Schulenberg, 1997; Pool and van Jaarsveld, 1998). It is possible that vitamin E is a useful antidote for iron toxicosis and that iron induced depletion of vitamin E plays a role in the pathogenesis of iron toxicity (Surai 2002). Therefore, any impact on vitamin E levels may reduce the protection of biological membranes against oxidation. ...."

If I have understood the original poster correctly, this bird was HATCHED with this problem? The bird has always had it? If so this would to my mind in all likelyhood indicate a severe nutritional deficiency of the breeder bird... is the bird in question a silkie?
Please note that the reference to prednisone is specifically to address the brain inflammation that occurs when silkies (or other crested breeds such as polish) have had an injury... do not use when this is not the case .

 

[California Ducken]

Wow dlhunicorn!

Glad your here! I am glad you are a BYCer.
To my understanding all depending on the weight of the bird as to the "toxic levels of iron, correct? That is why I asked how much iron was given. So we may understand how to better go about helping with treatment.
Are you a vet?
Because you seem to have a wonderful assortment of knowledge.....hence, I wish I had your brain! LOL
I however did not say or imply that the crookneck was caused by iron.
And I did read that the chick was hatched like this.
I was giving advise on curled toes and feet. All the information was given to me and I did just what I explained to my own chicks with exception of the bracing information. All of which have worked beautifully.
I have given the same advise to a few others that have had a great outcome (on curled toes).
To the layperson such as myself, I do not have the "exact" reasoning for not using iron. All I know is that in high doses it is toxic to a chick or baby human. But, I am glad you cleared that up for me!

Hey dlhunicorn where were you on my posts! I wish I'd have gotten you right off the bat!!
Thanks for the info. dlhunicorn
Now we can wait for an update on
The Hoof and Hen Ranch

 

[astylishgirl]

I bought the eggs, so I don't know anything about the parents. I had a few birds with deformed feet from this hatch too.

Thank you so much for the information! My husband put the chick down this morning because it was suffering. He was having a hard time eating and drinking and had rubbed his back raw because he would spastically scoot around on his back. His little eyes wouldn't even open. So we thought it was best.