So crossing a blue and lavender bird would leave you with a black? I'm trying to understand the relation of a self blue to a true blue gene?
What would the offspring carry?
What would the offspring carry?
Lavender and Blue genes - cross outcome?
- Thread starter vfem
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You would get 50% blue and 50% black. All would carry 1 copy of lavender (lavender split).
Breeding those back to lavender will give you black split to lavender, blue split to lavender, lavender and blue lavender (both diluters can be present in the same bird). Often it is difficult to differentiate between blue, lavender, and blue lavender so if you want to breed lavenders you may want to leave blues out.
Breeding those back to lavender will give you black split to lavender, blue split to lavender, lavender and blue lavender (both diluters can be present in the same bird). Often it is difficult to differentiate between blue, lavender, and blue lavender so if you want to breed lavenders you may want to leave blues out.
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I was wondering because my lavender female looks to be a rooster. Was wonder if i could need back with blues or black to get the lavender genes back in the flock. Thanks.
I am also interested in this cross. I asked the question on a snobby, name dropping, no it all, facebook group consisting of 20 members, shoulda known better, and got attacked to the question that was "not genuine". All these pecking hens, yes pun intended, could say was, "its a mess, don't do it". Does anyone have experience with crossing blue birds with lavender birds. I do understand genetics basics and understand how the self blue works, but when people say not to do this, its like people are only repeating what they have been told instead of actually seeing the crosses. If I have a pen of splash hens to a black roo, and make lots of blue babies and save only the lightest, why wouldn't this be the perfect color to cross back to the self blue? Lets say, for the sake of a coronation project or even the blue creams (porcelain)? I read where there is a question about whether or not the porcelains should have mottling or not. Some say no, some say yes. The A. blues would give that, right? Seems blue to lav in that sense would be ideal.
I would love to see what a blue lavender would look like. I imagine it would be very light light blue. "Blue" looks entirely different from lavender, with darker feathers around the head.
For those of you not familiar with blue and lavender - Lavender "self blue" is recessive meaning you need 2 genes present to express Lav so breeding a Lavender x Lavender gives you 100% lavender. Breeding Black to lavender gives you 0% lavender.
Blue on the other hand is the result of a single diluting gene present. Breeding Blue x Blue yield 25% splash, 25% black, 50% blue.
Breeding a Lavender x Splash then breeding the F1 back to each other should produce some blue lavender birds in the 3rd generation.
For those of you not familiar with blue and lavender - Lavender "self blue" is recessive meaning you need 2 genes present to express Lav so breeding a Lavender x Lavender gives you 100% lavender. Breeding Black to lavender gives you 0% lavender.
Blue on the other hand is the result of a single diluting gene present. Breeding Blue x Blue yield 25% splash, 25% black, 50% blue.
Breeding a Lavender x Splash then breeding the F1 back to each other should produce some blue lavender birds in the 3rd generation.
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Birds that are lavender and blue/splash look more like the blue/splash than like lavenders. Very difficult to distinguish between blue/splash without and with lavender. About the only thing on depth of colour is that you won't get dark blues, but they wont be particularly light, either.
ok, so ive been reading all the color genetics threads that I can find. Its not rocket science so fairly easy to understand. I am fascinated by all of this and the more I read, the more I wanna know. Most of my questions about e v e r y t h i n g chickens do get answered, so I don't usually have or need to post the question. But this is one that is unanswered for me. It has to make sense and the reasons im getting "do not compute" lol. I think mixing the andalusian blue, a very light one, sounds ideal. It also sounds like, to me, people feel may be a moral (maybe wrong word) issue...like silkie people don't want it because its confusing, wrong in labeling, might trick others who don't know better....these kinds of things...
what is the "mess"? It cant be that big of a mess where others wont stand in in line to get them because they are so beautiful and "typey"? What's the worst that could happen? Lavender Splash? oh no! Lavender Partridge? Dred! Coronation? oooo the horror! Are those the colors of the mess that people keep mentioning?
That is what happens when you mix lavender to buff to eventually get your beloved "porcelain". In route to "porcelain"(blue cream) those are the possible side colors. It happens. But there will be solids too (meaning light anda. blues) and those are what i mean use to strengthen the lavender with. Unless someone can tell me a solid "why". Look what happened when someone announced a color that said should never be mixed, the self blue and the buff (crossed crossed and recrossed back). There aren't enough eggs to go around of these colors. All I want to do is help out the self blues. They are like albinos and weak and need help. They are sensitive to the light and need that fluff in their eyes for protection, genetically wonky. When enough of us do it and do it right, they will get stronger. If we want the most beautiful color possible we need to use the black birds, agreed, and an andalusian blue is a black bird of the same color as the lavender...PERFECT. What am I missing? I do realize both birds are diluters but in porcelain, Isabel, buff lav split language we want maximum dilution. Ive asked for help from my PhD scientist boyfriend too, not bragging just saying I can understand this language, and we talk about this all the time. I do get it...except why NOT the lightest blue birds for our self blue silkies. I don't mean all the time, I just mean in our self blue projects when its time to put a black bird in the mix to improve, make it be an a light andalusian instead.
what is the "mess"? It cant be that big of a mess where others wont stand in in line to get them because they are so beautiful and "typey"? What's the worst that could happen? Lavender Splash? oh no! Lavender Partridge? Dred! Coronation? oooo the horror! Are those the colors of the mess that people keep mentioning?
That is what happens when you mix lavender to buff to eventually get your beloved "porcelain". In route to "porcelain"(blue cream) those are the possible side colors. It happens. But there will be solids too (meaning light anda. blues) and those are what i mean use to strengthen the lavender with. Unless someone can tell me a solid "why". Look what happened when someone announced a color that said should never be mixed, the self blue and the buff (crossed crossed and recrossed back). There aren't enough eggs to go around of these colors. All I want to do is help out the self blues. They are like albinos and weak and need help. They are sensitive to the light and need that fluff in their eyes for protection, genetically wonky. When enough of us do it and do it right, they will get stronger. If we want the most beautiful color possible we need to use the black birds, agreed, and an andalusian blue is a black bird of the same color as the lavender...PERFECT. What am I missing? I do realize both birds are diluters but in porcelain, Isabel, buff lav split language we want maximum dilution. Ive asked for help from my PhD scientist boyfriend too, not bragging just saying I can understand this language, and we talk about this all the time. I do get it...except why NOT the lightest blue birds for our self blue silkies. I don't mean all the time, I just mean in our self blue projects when its time to put a black bird in the mix to improve, make it be an a light andalusian instead.
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I guess since no one seems to be doing THAT cross lol, that will be my project. The andalusian lavender. You heard it here first. 
jk of course but not really I am going to get a few generations of the lightest buffs, lavenders, and andalusians I can breed and get this party started.
jk of course but not really I am going to get a few generations of the lightest buffs, lavenders, and andalusians I can breed and get this party started.
Spongegirl. you will not be able to tell the difference between you Bl/bl+ lav/lav and your Bl/bl+ lav/Lav+. These dilutions are NOT cumulative. All you will be doing is adding the negative issues that lavenders often have. Better to work on the lavenders and breed to remove those issues.
I guess that's what im not understanding is what those negative issues are. I do see that the colors will look the same though. I don't understand why that would not be desirable. Thanks for taking the time to write back. I have asked google this question and yahoo lol, and this is the only answer that the whole world has never been able to answer for me.
I do understand working on the lav to work out issues and problems...so don't people do this by crossing the lav to blacks on occasion? I know the answer is yes. Leaking colors, bad toes, eyes whatever the problem may be...I understand breeding for character traits, I do it in plants as well. I understand color combinations and possibilities. Why is this one still so vague and unanswered? Does anyone else agree and see my point? I am new to chicken breeding but not to understanding breeding programs and genetics. This is a new hobby for me. I'm three years into it and this is the first year I have seen results of all my hard work. I should have been reading all 3 of those years but I didn't. Im just realizing the potentials in what im doing. I don't mean to be short or seem flip with response or intend to beat a dead horse but the overall information online about this is stuff is so limited. So thank you to this forum for teaching me all I know. lol
I think all this is coming from my intrigue with Isabel colors...uniform tone and very mute, creamy and pastel, but still glowing. And I know what to do to get it and I do have a breeding plan, (hope im not hijacking a thread here, but I wanted to ask the same question as the OP did) I've read the color genetics threads for the porcelains, lavenders, isabels, buffs, all of it. I think the blue cream when done right is just as striking so I wanna see what I can do with those as well but people disagree on if they should have a pattern or not. Well, that andalusian blue has the pattern we need for that, so there again, is my question about using this blue instead of the blacks. I am starting to think the only way I learn is to experience it. My wacky ideas are usually ridiculous anyways and I realize then 'I shoulda listened' lol
I do understand working on the lav to work out issues and problems...so don't people do this by crossing the lav to blacks on occasion? I know the answer is yes. Leaking colors, bad toes, eyes whatever the problem may be...I understand breeding for character traits, I do it in plants as well. I understand color combinations and possibilities. Why is this one still so vague and unanswered? Does anyone else agree and see my point? I am new to chicken breeding but not to understanding breeding programs and genetics. This is a new hobby for me. I'm three years into it and this is the first year I have seen results of all my hard work. I should have been reading all 3 of those years but I didn't. Im just realizing the potentials in what im doing. I don't mean to be short or seem flip with response or intend to beat a dead horse but the overall information online about this is stuff is so limited. So thank you to this forum for teaching me all I know. lol
I think all this is coming from my intrigue with Isabel colors...uniform tone and very mute, creamy and pastel, but still glowing. And I know what to do to get it and I do have a breeding plan, (hope im not hijacking a thread here, but I wanted to ask the same question as the OP did) I've read the color genetics threads for the porcelains, lavenders, isabels, buffs, all of it. I think the blue cream when done right is just as striking so I wanna see what I can do with those as well but people disagree on if they should have a pattern or not. Well, that andalusian blue has the pattern we need for that, so there again, is my question about using this blue instead of the blacks. I am starting to think the only way I learn is to experience it. My wacky ideas are usually ridiculous anyways and I realize then 'I shoulda listened' lol
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