A Bielefelder Thread !

[bluejean55girl]

I have a Q for @Bine and discussion from any others here.

I have 'gotten' my stock from 5 different states, in an effort to add more diverse bloodlines in, as to not inbreed anymore than possible.

The question is, how much difference I have seen in the males coloration.

White their type looks great, Some have a barred black breast, while some have barred black with blotches of gold, and some have more red than others.

I would love to see a Standard (from Germany) of the males and their coloration, if you could please post ?

I'd love to print out both the hens & Cocks type & coloration for further breeding since we do not have a standard on this breed....yet.

Please ????

 

[bluejean55girl]

Actually, since we know 'how' to make the pattern, we could use a bigger flock, instead of using this 1 bird.
The hardest part of 'making' more Busters, is that he was a sport, a freak...he had completely normal parents & siblings (as shown) as did (apparently) the Black javas that created a "sport" Auburn java.
They just happened.
Because I do not know what happened to make him, I cannot recreat it.
But, I can start from scratch & breed a barred bird (like a Barred Plymouth Rock, yellow legs, standard comb) to a Partridge Chantecler (yellow legs, cushion comb) and get what we see in Buster.
Actually you'd have to hatch alot of eggs from the mating & save the ones with the correct color & breed those F-1s back, and so on.
The cushion comb would be lost as a pea comb is dominant...so that would be probably the hardest challenge to get back on the final "Crele Chantecler"

but if I understand correctly, a true "sport" will breed true... as that is what has happened in lots of breeds. but working the pattern in addition to using him to back cross stacks your odds? you would think that the genetics should be there to repeat again for another "sport" to jump up..

depends on how fickle mother nature is in dealing out her cards to you. but with birds I would think that the odds could/should/may be stacked in your favor using the pattern approach with your flock.

I'm a total newbie to chicken genetics, so am "guessing here" but the old timers would have a much better handle on the chances of another sport jumping up again in a relatively short time period.

oops, starting to ramble... which means I'm showing my ignorance..

 

[Chickielady]

The idea of a characteristic color
To breed chicken, in which one of the plumage coloration the chicks can immediately notice
What's cock or hen, had already in the thirties of the last century, the English
Professor Punett. The characteristic color
is from many racial poultry farmers,
due to the homozygosity and different
Drawing image of tap and Henne, admired. From the commercial poultry breeding
is known, that there are other racial crossings be made to identify color
To get chicks, but in the Fowl Breeding no meaning have.
The idea of breeding characteristic colorfulness was after the Second World War by breeders and Jobs Regenstein revived as they created the Italians in characteristic colored.
Origin of the breed
Following this pattern of inheritance
then were also the Bielefeld Chickens came to its own characteristics. You are a the recent German breeds and excited after the first Presentation 1976 a stir in the Breeders world under the name German characteristic chicken. This Breed name in 1980 with the recognition renamed in Bielefeld Characteristic chicken. They were initially Although referred to as a characteristic color, but look completely different as if the already known characteristic colored Italians – particularly the rooster feathers. The Faucet should, as the Lower Rhine in crele, a tricolor chest drawing show. Why was even with the Bielefeldern the Changed colors blow designation, because it is unfortunately occurred, that some judges the Color always identify with the colored Have compared Italians. Many Breeders feel this color game as particularly beautiful, especially the transition of colors always fluent appear. The Bielefeld have in three decades very well distributed, so that when the federal Look generally between 60 and 100 animals are presented. The Not only is the characteristic color attributable but also the enormous egg production and the this breed its own large, brown egg owe. The Standard are as egg-minimum weight 60 g on, but it is known that not particularly Althennen Laying rarely 70g heavy eggs. If you look to the used Output breeds Welsumer, Mechlin and Amrocks look, are already significant Leis obligations Predictably. Above all, you in this Erzüchtung on a fairly schnellwüchsiges and fast befiederndes chicken selects what pays today.
Distinguishing shaping attributes
Overall, Bielefeld are a
quite large framed with a chicken
roller-shaped and particularly
elongated body. For this, a lot
Value on a long, straight
and horizontally supported Rue -
bridges down. The obtuse angle
worn tail, with broad, but only medium long feathers, should be pretty good by the hackles be covered. Breeding difficulties there are still quite often with the blunt tail angle, but the looks of the standard Now just before and as we can not ignore. Far too often the tail is fluent from the back with light Swing. The top and bottom line should almost parallel what particularly by the depth, width, nice arched chest underscored becomes. This should include the slightly less harmoniously as medium-high runs fit. The legs should be to most of the side feathers be covered, especially in the Henne. However, too krüperhafter Stand not welcome, but still too often in hens an issue that especially the right loose leg springs faked. When animals with short or even shown hollow round back, is to see this as a big mistake, which also applies to triangular types, since the deep, expansive chest missing. But also to high position and bring steep tail posture, besides not sufficiently distinctive Lege belly in Henne, Point deduction. Head points This breed is only with single comb bred, and generally today the Kopfbehänge at shown top size limit will. The comb is ideally four to six wide scheduled Pip, with only up to about half the comb blade reaching cuts. This should especially Crest flag the neckline follow, but by no means rest. At the laying hen allows you a slightly surrounding crest flag. Harmonious to comb size should be the wattles, being carried out at such a large Chicken also slightly larger Kopfbehänge should allow. Equally Should the red ear lobes in Insert the big picture. Under no circumstances White storage is permitted here. Overall, the head acts quite large pores in the tissue Face is primarily unbefiedert and bright red. These acts, the orange-red, some great eye pretty good. The beak and Legs should be absolutely yellow. If the hen is allowed that the yellow pigment with good egg production some may subside, what but does not imply that the hen so-called flesh-colored legs may have. ? 6 chicken poultry newspaper 18 | 2008 Bielefeld characteristic chicken Attractive through performance and characteristic colors
1.0 Bielefeld characteristic chicken, crele,
Nat. Dortmund 1997 v SB (Norbert Nagel Raesfeld-Erle) Photo: Wolters Chicks of Bielefeld characteristic chicken right of Hahn, left a Henne Photo: Beautiful
The subtleties the drawing Bielefeld characteristic chickens are now in crele and silver crele recognized what two quite attractive colors. In both Color strokes can also the chicks on the first day be distinguished. The stopcock see generally ocher ckenstreifen out, with light brown Rü and a white spot on the Sperber Head. The chick is Henn Tan with a small, well-defined Sperber spot on the head. The chicks of silver crele the chicken colored mousy, to slightly ocher in Sound, and have a fingernail-sized, white or slightly yellowish Head spot. The Henn chicks are gray brown with dark brown Back strips. The head spot is more like a tip of a pencil Lined gray dot. That's the way it is easy even for a layman, the gender to separate. Consider plumage colouration the crele more closely, so we need to tap and Henne treat separately, since they fundamentally different in plumage are. The Faucet should in the neck and Saturated same slope and upper back his reddish yellow, shoulders and Elytra show the same Color, but somewhat richer in color consistently reddish. This pleasant Hue is a whole by light gray Sperberung interrupted so that a drawing available is, but on the shoulders and elytra covered far becomes. A slight gray tint in the back and especially in the binding area is permitted. But in no case is a sooty, black neck finish, as he often will be shown, permitted. The Secondaries are gray-white tawny cuckoo desired. The lower neck, chest, flanks and Belly should consistently yellow to be slightly red and by a interrupted brighter Sperberung will. Here is the entire lower body, a slight gray tinge in the color allowed. The control springs and at least the upper hackles should his cuckoo gray, so the entire tail actually cuckoo appears gray and Mantle plumage contrasts. The start small hackles then already with yellow retention. slightly brownish tinge the tail is permitted, it should but not out of hand. The hen is uniform and plain in color match. She should a lightened, rust-colored partridge Jacket with fluffy feathers Show Sperber drawing. This Sperber drawing often occurs on the Elytra as a bright Tupfung on. The gold-colored neck hackle has a darker, almost black stem stroke with light gray Sperber retention, so cuckoo the entire neck hackle appears. The chest should his reddish-yellow in the female, generally one speaks of a Salmon breast. Again one sees often, especially at the edge of that noticeable in the spring Sperber factor makes. Also makes the Standard nor concessions, by a slight yellowish Flitter permitted in the mantle feathers - I would rather than Federsaum look. The tail feathers of Henne are quite dark, often slightly trickled. Exhibit valuable animals here even a little light Sperber factor especially in the coverts. In conclusion of this different color match is to say that you only with clearly marked Should breed roosters. Only in this way is always the recognizability the chicks guaranteed. Silver crele is an entirely new color swatch in the Fowl Breeding and the most recent Color of Bielefeld. The color originated from the crosses, the one for Erzüchtung Bielefeld used. The silver has this the yellowish red in the plumage of Replaced cock, because the head, neck and saturated same slope are here silver white having an embedded, like Sperber Drawing infielder of the springs. The back and shoulders and elytra should silver white with more or less concealed, gray hawk drawing be. Rue cken- and wing deck - springs are in the lower range spring cuckoo more, on the Fe - end but mainly silver white, so this area almost entirely silver white appears. Also the Primaries and the inner webs Show the secondaries more or less often somewhat unclear, gross Sperberung. The Outer webs of secondaries are silver-white and form thus the white wing triangle. The larger Wing coverts in the binding area should cuckoo dark gray be. Breast, leg, Belly and tail should in Alternation of light and dark gray slightly arched, without sharp boundaries, be cuckoo. Also Poultry newspaper 18 | 2008 Chickens 7? ? The covered tail feathers should an indicated Sperber drawing show. Because the hens a more or less bright, more own bread yellow salmon breast, it comes naturally very often, that the valves in the jewelery feathers show little yellow tinge. However, the applicable standard as loud blunder, so you actually allow only a light cream can. The hen should at the head Neck hackle with a silver white dark gray hawk drawing his featherweight infield. The neck shaft line is this drawing interrupted. Under no circumstances should the Kopfbefiederung with black or brown feathers start. This is a gross error, even when the standard allows that the neck area slightly darker is permitted. The breast is indeed salmon to reddish yellow desired, but here are white feather games permitted. The entire Mantle plumage is covered by bright to dark gray, slightly bogiger Sperberung which nevertheless possible
show sharp differences should. The intermediate parts in the Spring show a slight gray giant Lung. Especially in shoulder and Back is a light tinsel allowed the animals without Flitter act racy. Rust on the elytra is frowned upon and counts as a big mistake. The Swing and tail feathers of Hen are much darker and unclear in the somewhat crude Sperberung, Never should the feathers but completely black be. In addition to the beautiful form and Colors have the Bielefeld also a significant economic Value by a particular tasty and meaty Carcass yield. After all If the tap 3 to 4 kg and the Henne from 2.5 to 3.25 kg Weight control and laut Standard 230 eggs per year, but what reaches only sporadically and is not generalized can be. Fritz Beautiful
they first talk about the histroy of auto-sexed chickens, the auto-sexing Italians (Leghorns) of Mr. Jobs and Mr. Regenstein..., fast forwart to the Bielefelder body
type:
Overall, Bielefeld are a quite large framed with a chicken cylindrical and particularly elongated body.
It is very importend that back is long, straight and horizontally carried by the chicken.
The tail should be worn in a obtuse angle, with broad,but only medium long feathers and should be pretty good coverd by the hackles.
The obtuse angle of the tail is often difficult to achieve, but the standard is clear that is has to be a obtuse angle.
Far too often birds with a tail that is flowing from the back in a light arc are shown.
The top and bottom line should almost be parallel with an nice arched deep chest that underscores the body lines.
The leggs should be a little bit less than medium-high and fit harmoniously.
The thighs should be coverd by the side feathers. This is especially importen for hens.
but it should not look like a Krüpper....a Krüpper or a Scotish Dumpy
Birds with short or hollow round backs or a triangular body - missing broad chest- should not be shown.
BIrds will lose points for to high position and steep tail posture,
and a not sufficiently distinctive layer-belly in hens.
Head points
This breed is bred only with single comb. Being now generally shown with big head marks. The comb has ideally four to six sprongs withe a wide base. The comb blade should only be cut in half by the prongs. Comb flag should follow the topline of the head/neck, but never lie to the side. for a laying hen a slightly leaning comb is allowed. The wattles should be harmonious to comb size , a big chicken can also have slightly larger headgear. Similarly, the red earlobes should fit in the overall picture. white earlobes are not allowed. Overall, the head appears quite large pores in the tissue, the face is mainly featherless and vivid red underscoured by orange-red, big eyes. The beak and legs should be deep yellow. If a hen is a very good layer, she is allowed to have a paler yellow pigment, but that does not means that the hen can have flesh-colored legs.

The coloration.
the first paragraph is about the chicks, darker strips for the girls and the point and the lighter color for the boys.
ff to the rooster:
The neck, the upper back and the saddle should be reddish yellow, the shoulder and the wing cover should be reddish yellow but deeper in color and more reddish. This pleasant tone is interrupted by light gray cuckoo-strips so that a drawing is present, but is in the backround on the shoulder and the wings. A slight gray shadowing on the back is permitted, especially in the binding area. But the neck should not show black-sooty hem. That is often shown but should not be bred.
The secondaries are desired gray-white-tawny cuckoo.
The lower neck, chest, flanks and belly should be yellow to slightly reddish and are interrupted by a brighter cuckoo.
A light gray shadow is allowed on the entire lower body.
the control feathers(?) and at least the upper hackles should be gray cuckoo, so that the entire tail appears actually gray cuckoo and contrast the body color.
The small hackles begin then already with yellow retention. A slightly brownish tinge in the tail is permitted, but he should not get out of hand.

The hen is more uniform and more plain colors. You should show a lightened, rust and partridge colored coat feathers with fluffy cuckoo drawing. This cuckoo drawing often occurs on the elytra as bright spots. The gold colored neck has a darker, almost black stem stroke with light- gray cuckoo dots, so that the entire neck hackle appears cuckoo colored. The chest should be reddish-yellow in the female, generally it is called a salmon breast. especially at the edge the cuckoo dots are noticeably again.

Than they go on and talk about the silver-crele color you can see in the pics, too.
This is the german standard translated by someone.(I don't remember who)

Thanks JB

 

[Chickielady]

Neat Old Picture !

 

[Chickielady]

but if I understand correctly, a true "sport" will breed true... as that is what has happened in lots of breeds. but working the pattern in addition to using him to back cross stacks your odds? you would think that the genetics should be there to repeat again for another "sport" to jump up..

depends on how fickle mother nature is in dealing out her cards to you. but with birds I would think that the odds could/should/may be stacked in your favor using the pattern approach with your flock.

I'm a total newbie to chicken genetics, so am "guessing here" but the old timers would have a much better handle on the chances of another sport jumping up again in a relatively short time period.

oops, starting to ramble... which means I'm showing my ignorance..

Maybe we should start a Ramble club...I can (at times) be the Queen of the Ramble Club!
Specially after a few glasses of wine, LOL

Ok, here is my question in photos, where I wonder which section of the males have which color of barring...so I took some pics of a few of my males, all these came from diferent breeders in various parts of the country:
7 mo old, I am not fond of the various mix of barring on his chest, for example, I think it should be white & 1 colored barring, not brown, red, and black mixed with white bars...do you understand ?
The confirmation has always been excellent in this breed, for both sexes.
I just think the various parts of the male should be 1 color barring with white, like red & white shoulders, and black & white breast....
Cockerel 'A':


Cockerel 'A':


His back seems ok , maybe....

Same boy below, has cleaner 'parts'
He does not have the black bars in the breast as much...

Cockerel 'A':

Mid crow (below) 6 mo old, and has alot of black bars on the breast

Cockerel 'B':


A better pic of 6 mo old...(below) Notice how his barring is mixed up colors ?
Cockerel 'B':


Cockerel 'A' again:


Big Daddy...cannot find a photo of his breast, but he is much "cleaner' with very little 'mudding' of his barring colors.


Cockerel 'B' again:


I have a mess more but cannot find them in my files right now.
But this is my question...and I think my answer is that there should not be alot of "mudding" of the bar colors in individual sections of the bird.
Do you guys understand what I am rambling on about ?

 

[Chickielady]

but if I understand correctly, a true "sport" will breed true... as that is what has happened in lots of breeds. but working the pattern in addition to using him to back cross stacks your odds? you would think that the genetics should be there to repeat again for another "sport" to jump up..

depends on how fickle mother nature is in dealing out her cards to you. but with birds I would think that the odds could/should/may be stacked in your favor using the pattern approach with your flock.

I'm a total newbie to chicken genetics, so am "guessing here" but the old timers would have a much better handle on the chances of another sport jumping up again in a relatively short time period.

oops, starting to ramble... which means I'm showing my ignorance..

Well, no, a true sport just means it truly is a sport, not that it breeds true.
A true sport just pops up when & where you least expect it, and can drive you nuts trying to isolate the gens....nuts !
You can actually breed it out trying to breed it in...especially because you really do not know what made it happen in the first place, it is difficult or impossible to get "it" to happen again.

 

[bluejean55girl]

Well, no, a true sport just means it truly is a sport, not that it breeds true.
A true sport just pops up when & where you least expect it, and can drive you nuts trying to isolate the gens....nuts !
You can actually breed it out trying to breed it in...especially because you really do not know what made it happen in the first place, it is difficult or impossible to get "it" to happen again.

I had a wondered if what the old books said would hold up. Nice to find out that people here have run across this before and are willing to share that it's not always so cut and dried as to what someone says in the old books. Grins

 

[Bine]

It is always hard to see the colors in photos, but look at the roo with the Z on the point sheet, Z means that the chicken won a trophy for something, so it can't be that wrong in coloring.

I don't know if we had this photo posted already..




Give your younsters a little more time to develop the full rooster feathering and see how the neck and saddle grows out.

 

[opossum04]

Anyone out there interested in some egg swapping? My Biel flock are on their 3 rd season and I am raising next year's pullets from them but would like to use separate roos. My birds were bought directly from GFF 2013 line.

 

[TNBielefelder]

It is always hard to see the colors in photos, but look at the roo with the Z on the point sheet, Z means that the chicken won a trophy for something, so it can't be that wrong in coloring.

I don't know if we had this photo posted already..




Give your younsters a little more time to develop the full rooster feathering and see how the neck and saddle grows out.

I don't know anyone in the USA that is producing Bielefelders of this quality. The Rooster on the bottom is so perfect in type he looks like he was cut out using a pattern. When you look at him don't concentrate on the color first but take some time to admire his comb, and see the combs height fullness and shape, look at his beak it nice an short, yellow, and comes to a point with NO downwards turn and Look at those wattles. Now look at his back nice and flat and long and his tail does not appear as and extension of the back like a lot of our birds do but comes out of the end at the obtuse angle the Germans call for. His legs are short and he has full thigh's he does not appear to be long legged but balanced with the rest of his body and built to carry the weight of a dual purpose chicken. He has a very nice deep breast and his wings set well. As far as color what stands out is the color pattern. Each color is present where it should be. I have this picture at home and there is some color bleeding in some places but this is one of my favorite pictures for type. Just think about what this guy would look like about 2 1\2 years old when he is fully filled out. But at the end of the day I love to sit on my deck and watch my imperfect Bielefelder in all his glory strut across my yard and tend to his hens the way a rooster should. I know this may sound crazy but a husband and father can learn a lot from these Rooster's when it comes to taking care of his "flock" family at home. I still say these are the best Roosters out there. Don't you just love their color and their disposition. Its what got me started with this breed.