About (food grade) Diatomaceous Earth

[Papaye]

@BDutch :

Hi!
We are almost neighbours...!!

I do wonder why some people don't think food grade Diatomaceous Earth does not work... but I am more curious by the fact some of these people would preconize toxic products renowned more harmful than DE could be to replace it...
That's so not logical...
What are they thinking...?

...Thank you for sharing your experience with DE!

The fact food grade Diatomaceous Earth would not work against worms because it would need to be dry to kill them would... be a myth.
Indeed : Diatomateous Earth is told to need to be dry to kill lice and mites... because lices and mites have an exoskeleton to protect them!
But worms do not have exoskeleton... So, Diatomaceous Earth would not need to be dry to kill them...!

To kill the eggs... I don't have any experience for that.
I am actually very lucky, because all the eggs on my chickens never did take long to hatch. So, by applying food grade Diatomaceous Earth 10 days after the first application to kill the ones on my chickens, I was always able to kill all lices and mites they had...!
But just in case, before rubbing DE on my chickens for the second time : I always remove by hand most of the eggs I find... and next, I put a particurlaly big layer of DE on the ones I can't remove.
I always had success!

Also, I only own coops from Omlet. So I can NOT have infestations, thanksfully!
Never would I want to have wooden coops because of red mites especially... they are monsters, ah, ah!

But your method with DE paint in new to me... did you came with it yourself?!

In my country, some people protect their wooden coops by applying motor oil on them.
I remember one who was telling he only needed to re-applying motor oil on his coop every two years, and he had not had red mites problem anymore since he was doing that!

Thank you again!

 

[BDutch]

Also, I only own coops from Omlet. So I can NOT have infestations, thanksfully!

Red mites exist in plastic coops too.
Big advantage is that you can take ot all apart, clean and reassemble.

But your method with DE paint in new to me... did you came with it yourself?!

The sell a spray with DE here. And the powder came with a manual where they told to make a spray. But the nozzle of the spray bottle became clogged almost instantly and I could tell fix it. I thought why not make a thick solution and use a brush to apply the DE.

In my country, some people protect their wooden coops by applying motor oil on them.

All oils that stick and greases seem to work. Motor oil is not healthy and I don’t like a greasy coop. I rather use the DE paint. I can see when the DE vanishes. So I know where to reapply.
I dont bother much in winter red mites need warmth to live and the mite-eggs dont hatch till spring when its getting warmer. If I remember correctly the mites die under 4 Celcius. Mite-eggs don’t. They only die from heat (steam or fire).

We are almost neighbours...!!

There are a few active members from France too. @ManueB and maybe @PouleChick
Do you live in the North of France?.

 

[Papaye]

@dawg53 :

Hi again.

I saw you removed some of your comments, notably the one where you answered to me having severe allergies by precising the fact that DE was doing that to my/our "innards"...

So... since you removed your comments AND did not respond to me (yet?) about your source... do I have to understand you were mistaken in what you was assuring me...?
You could have just told me so, you know...? (Mistakes are humans...) Would have saved me from having to spend hours doing research that led to nothing...

Thus, I guess you won't have any problem with the fact I am just going to assume you had actually no source, and that no : food grade Diatomaceous Earth does not cause the kind of severe allergies that I have developed.

Thank you for your interventions so far.
But please, remember that you don't have to like food grade Diatomaceous Earth, but you don't have to exagerate its dangerousness either...

Also, you could want to do some serious research about Permethrin, and reconsider using this product to treat your chickens.
I know I love my animals too much to even consider the use of Permethrin on them or near them!!

(Thank you again for your interventions.)

@BDutch :

Never had lice or mites in these coops... but I love cleanliness, so I wash them regularly. Really easy to do so...!!

On the other hand, I did have some wasps, but only on the Eglu Go : indeed, wasps can easily go between the panels, so they got into the habit to make their nests there...
But since next year, I will use my Eglu Go (I own 3 of them) exclusively for the broody hens... I am in no great danger of wasp stings!

While I have no wasps problem with my Eglu Cube and my Eglu Classic!

...You did have a good idea with Diatomaceous Earth!
I did not even know they sold it with a spray... certainly not in my country, or I think I would have found it already...?
(I buy mine in food grade barrels, so I can re-use the barrels after emptying them. I think it is better, because more there is DE, cheaper it is on the long term!)

...If I had a wooden coop, I would use Cade Oil from La Distillerie des Cévennes to treat it. No other products or oils.
I actually don't think there exists a better product than Cade Oil to treat wood, especially if we want to get rid of red mites...!

And no : I live in the center. In Auvergne.
In an very windy area, where the weather is cold and humid...
Still beautiful for now. Not like Paris! Ah, ha!

 

[BDutch]

And no : I live in the center. In Auvergne.

That’s the region of Clermont-Ferrand! Nice people there. I was there for a vacation about 7 years ago. For approx. 5 days and walked down from the Puy de domes. Also saw the most beautiful trompe-l'oeil In CF.

 

[Debbie292d]

DE will not treat scaly leg mites since they feed on tissue.
Scaly leg mites should be smothered with vaseline or other products. I prefer Nu-Stock.
View attachment 3702975

Same here about DE not preventing scaly leg mites. We have tons of mites/lice here living next to a forest and squirrels, chipmunks, and wild birds share eating under bird feeders. 7 years of FG DE in the coop and dust baths and they've gotten no mites/lice albeit repeatedly scaly leg mites.

When I had 6 silkies, we did vaseline every other night for 3 times and that did the trick. As of late, we have 14 and chose to use ivermectin instead. (The sheep pour on for our size chicken is one drop on their skin on their back, repeat in 10 days.) That worked, and I will not go back to greasing 28 feathery feet.

I have never wormed my chickens albeit perhaps the ivermectin might have, and though I'm a huge proponent of preventing mites/lice via DE, I do not feed it to them, although many chicken feeds like Kalmbach's HHR has some in it.

We've used it for 20 years in our macaw parrot cages as well which keeps the fruit flies and pantry moths down.

In my experience, as a preventative, FG DE is great, but when it isn't, then stronger products are needed.

 

[BDutch]

DE will not treat scaly leg mites since they feed on tissue.

Maybe you are right that DE doesn’t work with SLM. DE does not work like most killers.

DE is a contact killer for organisms with a very weak skin. It works like sandpaper on a weak skin. It kills the larvae that come out of the egg. Not the adult mites, not the eggs.

Therefore is needs time to work. And has to be reapplied often.
A dustbath with DE kills all the larvea that come in contact with dry DE. Taking out one stadia of the life cycle does the trick.
But if some eggs stay put underneath the scales it can take forever to eliminate all mites.

This was the reason I used a little permethrin too the last time I had red mites in my coop. After cleaning/treating I checked every day and often found 1-3 tiny mites in the control rolls.
MDH and me were going on a vacation and I didn’t want to bother my neighbour too much. in case it got worse. She took care of the chickens, And I was relieved she didn’t see any new tiny mites.
I only sprayed permethrin in the corners, on the roosts joints and in the deep cracks I didn't spray on my chickens except for one broody hen who didn’t lay.

Here the permethrin has a warning sign its not to be used on chickens/poultry. And can only be used on show birds and pets.
I did use herbal powder and a herbal liquid too to make the blood of my chickens disgusting for mites. (Finecto+).

 

[Papaye]

Hi.

Concerning food grade Diatomaceous Earth again, I was observing my chickens and my ducks for some months...
Just to see if they might feel DE is good for them, and would thus prefer to eat their food mixed with it...?

And for now, I can confirm my birds do prefer their food to be mixed with food grade Diatomaceous Earth.

...To explain myself...

My ducks and my chickens have access to 3 relatively big metal feeders, and have also had smaller 5 plastic feeders since some months ago...

In one run, I put :
- 1 metal feeder : wheat + duck pellets
- 2 plastic feeders : wheat + duck pellets + food grade Diatomecaous Earth.

In another run, I put :
- 1 metal feeder : cracked corn + layer pellets
- 1 metal feeder : premium quality layer and ornemental mix
- 3 plastic feeders : premium quality layer and ornemental mix + food grade Diatomaceous Earth.

And since I have put the plastic feeders with Diatomateous Earth... my chickens and my ducks have ALWAYS eaten in these feeders first!

They pratically don't eat in the metal feeders anymore - they do only when the plastic ones are empty.
Knowing apart for DE, the food is the SAME in the metal and the plastic feeders...!

When I put food in their (empty) plastic feeders again (mixing with DE of course), the chickens are begging for the food... while their metal feeder have yet food in them...!

...I can not think Diatomateous Earth tastes good... ever for birds.
So, I can only conclude the birds feel like DE is good for them...? Because otherwise : WHY would my chickens and my ducks prefer to eat their food mixed with Diatomaceous Earth?

...Some thoughts?

 

[BDutch]

Some thoughts?

No thoughts, but interesting. Thanks the test and for sharing.

 

[SGills]

For years I was always under the impression that Food Grade Diatomaceous Earth was good for all kinds of pets and even humans to eat. I've also read many articles on using it for your chickens to dust bathe in etc. Now with that said, I had just came across another article that says quite the opposite. The article I read said absolutely do not use Food Grade DE on chickens, that it is toxic to them and that it is also a carcinogen to pets and people!!!! What the heck are you supposed to believe???

 

[BDutch]

For years I was always under the impression that Food Grade Diatomaceous Earth was good for all kinds of pets and even humans to eat. I've also read many articles on using it for your chickens to dust bathe in etc. Now with that said, I had just came across another article that says quite the opposite. The article I read said absolutely do not use Food Grade DE on chickens, that it is toxic to them and that it is also a carcinogen to pets and people!!!! What the heck are you supposed to believe???

The first opinion is right if you use the fgDE cautiously and follow instructions. It surely helps but perhaps it’s not as good as claimed.
The food grade DE is not toxic. It helps against things the pharma sells expensive medicines and poisons too. So obviously there is a risk the commercial pharma (and pharma believers) write articles to undermine a cheaper non toxic alternative.
I use fgDE for 8 years now. Started with it as red mite prevention. It seems to help for other parasites too. It never caused problems and my oldest chickens are really healthy senior chickens. I believe the non-toxic organic feed and the free ranges hours contributes to that too.