Alternatives to Bullets

[Catnip5]

Common sense is far from commonly available. Most is developed more through experience which will apply to you as you work out how your available resources provide benefits.

For starters I have more than one perimeter. Most outer is simply an abrupt break in the vegetation where I have very short cut grass forming a lane. The breaks slow most predators down as they are also vulnerable in transition zones. With in the outer transition zone I have three strands of hot-wire placed for entertainment of fox, coyotes and bobcat. Within that I have dense cover patches that hens can cover chicks at night and where flocks can loaf to avoid detection and elements. The cover patches help keep birds within protected perimeters. For juvenile birds I have paddocks of poultry netting and not just one. More than one makes so not all eggs in one basket. I have roosters in key locations, sometimes free-range, that protect chicks and small juveniles from hawks that target smaller chickens. Roosters stop loss hawks very well if you provide proper cover. Roost are elevated where practical. More than one pen with birds dispersed between pens. With pens, especially during winter, I have a single strand of hot-wire 6" off ground and 6" away from pens that entertain critters challenging pen walls. I have dogs (very expensive part of approach) allowing defense of several acres and even omission of other protective measures around house serving as core for dog activities. Chicken breed selecting also important for me but not applicable for those into production and most ornamental breed.

I spend considerable effort trying reduce attractants for predators that also eat chicken feed or rodents eating chicken feed.

Cover patches also.

I do employ live traps and occasionally bullets (genuine common sense applications) but much less than you might suspect.

The degrees to which you have layered in protection indicates to me that you have a great many chickens to oversee over a wide and expansive property, yes? For small flocks such as mine I think I'm on the right track with two layers of electric netting surrounding the coop(s), loads of vegetation, bushes, trees which can provide sanctuary and a secure coop that has no easy method of entry and within it will have a hardware cloth framed wall with a locked door, multiple level roosts as well and the predator lights will move from the small transitional coop to the "adult" coop. Ultrasonic predator lights with alarms are installed but proved useless to the fox. I'll still have them outside the fence perimeter - perhaps they may yet help. Compost is set apart and outside the fencing. I believe, as a new chicken mom, that I've addressed as many layers as is predictable at this stage but I am sure new challenges and/or problems will present themselves. There is no substitute for experience for certain and your suggestions are both valuable and insightful. It's a shame the video that is posted doesn't elaborate after the slaughter on what could have helped those poor chickens. IMO the video just isn't doing those chickens any justice and isn't providing any concrete helpful information "when the fox eventually breaches the coop".

 

[Catnip5]

While the first video, shows the fox learning about electric shock therapy ... the owners should have made a second fence surrounding both the chicken tractors, they already had a charger ... that would be another layer of protection ...

The second video, seems to not to have any electric protection, just a camera to record the carnage ... even a couple of runs of "hot wire" around the existing fence would have prevented the fox from getting in, even though it climbed a tree/bush, it would have met the top rung of the electric, bird netting obviously does not stop or support the weight of a fox! The one chicken it did get. seems to have been left out at night ... coop up the chicken, it has a better chance to see morning.

The third shows that "poultry netting" does not stop a fox (or most ANYTHING) from getting in, just contains the chickens ... the problem with the tiny coops are they have no where to get away from the fox! A 6' high roost would have probably saved them, even after being attacked a few times the chickens still had enough life left to get away!

What people need to think about is an onion, layers of protection, if you run a electric fence, make sure your "FT KNOX" type coop is TOTALLY inside of this, not just at the edge abutting up to the fence, that is why a good gate is essential! Since you have the charger anyways get some insulators (or make them out of a piece of pipe ...) and bare wire, put that directly on the coop, around doors and windows/vents ... I have also used plastic pipe (can't find a picture of it now) that I cut half away of the diameter of the pipe, about 3/4" on each end of a 3" piece of pipe, then fed my wire through it, and then screwed the pipe to trees or posts/building ...

Adding electric to existing fence ...





Of course ... having another set of eyes and ears around that wont eat your chickens is also handy ... not my dog ... but I like it!



Having a baby monitor in the coop, can also alert you if you hear a ruckus, and then you can deal with the problem ...


OK, I found my old pictures from my house in VT 10 years ago ... here you can see that I'm using webwire, for my fencing, it has three little strands of wire weaved into the webbing, horse and deer can see it better!

The post on the left, has the two bottom strands held on with the yellow pipe insulators that I made myself ... actually is old propane underground gas line, but any plastic pipe will do! the top two are the factory insulators ...



Sorry I don't have a more close up picture of it ... We moved to AZ 8 years ago

Ha, great pic with the dog! I have a dropcam that is on the yard at all times - though it hasn't helped and makes me nervous to look at it when I'm not home to intervene. The girls are in solitary confinement until fencing arrives - the coop is completely secure thankfully - just too small. The new 10x12 shed will be finished by Tuesday hopefully and the dropcam will be mounted inside that so I'll have 24/7 monitoring with night vision as well. Layering continues...

 

[LeafBlade12345]

Okay I have some good ways to keep foxes and raccoons away from chicken coops. Set up a sprinkler that is either motion activated, or is set up to only work at night. We have this in our garden for coons and it works amazingly well! We tried the red eye lights, but they don't work well. The sprinkler was the best for us. Much less expensive than an electric fence.

 

[centrarchid]

I have operated with only a couple of pet chickens just like you are doing. Therefore you can expect relevant experience to your current challenges. The experience did not start yesterday.

The video may not have been intended to provide you with insight. But nor does is deny the possibility to you. Your mind appears closed and a bit intolerant to views not your own.

 

[Catnip5]

Okay I have some good ways to keep foxes and raccoons away from chicken coops. Set up a sprinkler that is either motion activated, or is set up to only work at night. We have this in our garden for coons and it works amazingly well! We tried the red eye lights, but they don't work well. The sprinkler was the best for us. Much less expensive than an electric fence.

I looked into those - fine for night time if your coop is at risk I suppose but they don't do much during the day once they figure out the water is harmless...my sister purchased several to keep deer and raccoons away from her garden - really useless as per her. I found the red eye lights work great in terms of keeping the skunks, raccoons and fox away from the coop - or they've figured out it can't be breached, who knows...but personally they've worked great for me. Useless during the day mind you. I am curious if others have had luck with motion activated sprinklers, especially during the daytime. Knowing what I know now I wouldn't risk free-ranging with those over an electric fence - at least not with this particular predator fox - he/she is very intent on scoring a meal.

 

[Catnip5]

I have operated with only a couple of pet chickens just like you are doing. Therefore you can expect relevant experience to your current challenges. The experience did not start yesterday.

The video may not have been intended to provide you with insight. But nor does is deny the possibility to you. Your mind appears closed and a bit intolerant to views not your own.

Not at all, I consider myself very tolerant- I just find the video to be an aftermath with little helpful concrete information FOR ME. That said others may find it useful, insightful, informative etc. I found it disturbing on it's own merit. It could have been modified with text or diagrams or something to include information that might help a new chicken owner. It didn't. 'nuff said.

 

[LeafBlade12345]

The sprinkler idea is that the raccoons know that it's harmless, they just hate it. We have not had any problems with raccoons after we installed the sprinkler. You can also set the sprinkler to a higher water stream to deter bigger animals. Ours makes a loud and startling noise wich also scared off raccoons, squirrels, and big crows.

 

[alibabba]

Ok, for the sake of argument - let's just say I eliminated the offending fox - another will surely take it's place anyway so is there no one who free-ranges chickens or do they just kill everything that ventures onto their property that is deemed a threat to their chickens? Either they do or they lock-up ... there seems to be no happy medium. Even if I could kill the fox, which I couldn't, another would surely take it's place in time it seems to me. I was pretty excited about my chickens...now not so much since keeping them happy and free-ranging seems to be an impossibility unless I decide to slaughter everything looking to make a meal of them. Makes sense I guess. Would love to see some examples of beautifully landscaped runs... The coop forum was pretty barren but perhaps it requires more searching. Thanks for the feedback all, much appreciated!

This is true. More will always come and they belong too. (Sorry if I am redundant) Keep your things from being eaten. Super simple, not very expensive or even that labor intensive. Electric fence (expensive poultry netting, which seems cumbersome to me) or polywire. You can with your big human brain electrify anything and everything for well under $100. Then you don't have to worry at all. The wildlife is trained very quickly. Once and done, they don't come nosing anymore. Your chickens BITE! ouch.

Mine are night creepers... to much activity during the day...but dang if at 4am in the pouring rain they didn't take out a ton of pullets 10 yards from the house. 2 strands of electric went up same day and has not been breached, I even baited the pen with cat food. Now I figure that they have learned that my chickens cause pain and probably won't come check em out in the daytime. They will pass my yard...

 

[alibabba]

Shoot - shovel - shut up

What about the losses when the new preds come into the territory? Doesn't make sense to me to find 10 dead and missing and then shoot a fox and trap 3 coons...and in 8 months find another bunch missing and shoot another fox and trap another coon.

Plus, we need these to keep real pests at bay.

Predator proof one way or another and eliminate any predator losses. Chickens aren't "nature" here in the U.S.

 

[alibabba]

I assume that the poster is referring to creosote. Creosote is a high acid coal tar product that was once commonly used to preserve wood.

very carcinogenic