Ameraucana thread for posting pictures and discussing our birds

Example: If you breed Gold base colored black rooster with a Silver based blue hen. The resulting males will inherit both Gold and Silver genes, regardless if it comes out blue or black.

If a blue daughter is born she will be blue with a gold base foundation. And a black daughter will be just like her father.
This is the part I'm having trouble with.....it sounds like you are making the blue gene sex linked along with the gold or silver...in this example, the blue would have to come from the female, but it would not be true with all male/female combinations of blue and black. Going to have to plot this one out after I think it over....
 
I was told this by another breeder just now, and I agree from what Ive seen with leakage on blues and splashes.

"blues will have that reddish cast to their feathers is they carry gold. On the splash most cock birds will leak gold, I've never seen a leaky pullet from the splash."

Ha! Caught you! .... I saw a post on another forum and know who you are!! I recognized your new avatar... ...lol....yes, I posted the link on the 'e'locus to you a while back.....it is now open for viewing at a new site....
 
I was told this by another breeder just now, and I agree from what Ive seen with leakage on blues and splashes.

"blues will have that reddish cast to their feathers is they carry gold. On the splash most cock birds will leak gold, I've never seen a leaky pullet from the splash."
I'm pretty sure that this breeder breeds blue and black from silver based birds...
 
This is the part I'm having trouble with.....it sounds like you are making the blue gene sex linked along with the gold or silver...in this example, the blue would have to come from the female, but it would not be true with all male/female combinations of blue and black. Going to have to plot this one out after I think it over....

Its not my intent to make the blue gene sound sexlink lol, which is not. As we know, if you breed black to blue you can get 50/50 black or blue chicks.

What I'm trying to say, if a female chick turns out blue because she inherited the blue gene from a blue parent, it would only inherit either Silver (S) or Gold (s+) base gene from her father and none from her mother.

The example was meant to show what each possible colored chick of each sex would inherit from dad, if he was a black (s+) base rooster bred to a blue (S) base hen
- Black Cockerel would be (S,s+)
- Blue Cockerel would be (S,s+)
- Blue Pullet would be (s+)
- Black Pullet would be (s+) Just like her Black sire

Blue Rooster thats (S) base bred to Black Hen thats (s+) base would result in:
- Black Cockerel would be (S,s+)
- Blue Cockerel would be (S,s+)
- Black Pullet would be (S)
- Blue Pullet would be (S) = Just like her Blue sire
 
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Ha! Caught you! .... I saw a post on another forum and know who you are!! I recognized your new avatar... ...lol....yes, I posted the link on the 'e'locus to you a while back.....it is now open for viewing at a new site....

Small world haha..
 
Its not my intent to make the blue gene sound sexlink lol,  which is not. As we know, if you breed black to blue you can get 50/50 black or blue chicks.

What I'm trying to say, if a female chick turns out blue because she inherited the blue gene from a blue parent, it would only inherit either Silver (S) or Gold (s+) base gene from her father and none from her mother.

The example was meant to show what each possible colored chick of each sex would inherit from dad, if he was a black (s+) base rooster bred to a blue (S) base hen
 - Black Cockerel would be (S,s+)
 - Blue Cockerel would be   (S,s+)
 - Blue Pullet would be       (s+)
 - Black Pullet would be     (s+) Just like her Black sire

Blue Rooster thats (S) base bred to Black Hen thats (s+) base would result in:
 - Black Cockerel would be (S,s+)
 - Blue Cockerel would be   (S,s+)
 - Black Pullet would be     (S)
 - Blue Pullet would be       (S) = Just like her Blue sire


So, it's basically a toss up unless you somehow know 100% that your rooster is pure for either S or s+. Because there are no visiable clues on what your hen is carrying from my understanding. I've never seen a leaking female. If your male is leaking does that mean he's pure for the wrong base gene or can they leak if they are split? Can a split male not leak? Will a blue male pure for silver not leak? If he is split will he leak gold or silver? I am asking because I have seen a blue male with the reddish tint in hackles when in the sun, but I've also been told a blue male can leak silver, which I understand will be white. If that's the case, then leaking is tied to something other than whether the bird is carrying the wrong base color, right?
And here's a pic of a splash I once had and while I have heard that red is gold and white is silver, I've never really had a answer as to what this straw color is considered. Any opinion or answer on that?

700


And another interesting thing regarding leakage is that in his case this didn't show up until year two. In fact, I've seen this sort of thing happen on other occasions also, stuff popping up after their first year molt or later molts. That could explain why leaking is still happening because many use cockerals or even year old birds in mating.

Editing to add that I think I found some answers. Melanizers are what is needed to prevent or hide leakage of gold or silver. I knew that, I just forgot about that aspect of it.

Regarding the color of the leakage in the above splash, is it possible that the particular color he shows is a result of him being split for gold and silver? Obviously, he is not carrying enough melanizers to cover, but why is the leakage not red or white? Is it gold being diluted by silver or is it gold being influenced by something else?
 
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So, it's basically a toss up unless you somehow know 100% that your rooster is pure for either S or s+. Because there are no visiable clues on what your hen is carrying from my understanding. I've never seen a leaking female. If your male is leaking does that mean he's pure for the wrong base gene or can they leak if they are split? Can a split male not leak? Will a blue male pure for silver not leak? If he is split will he leak gold or silver? I am asking because I have seen a blue male with the reddish tint in hackles when in the sun, but I've also been told a blue male can leak silver, which I understand will be white. If that's the case, then leaking is tied to something other than whether the bird is carrying the wrong base color, right?
And here's a pic of a splash I once had and while I have heard that red is gold and white is silver, I've never really had a answer as to what this straw color is considered. Any opinion or answer on that?



And another interesting thing regarding leakage is that in his case this didn't show up until year two. In fact, I've seen this sort of thing happen on other occasions also, stuff popping up after their first year molt or later molts. That could explain why leaking is still happening because many use cockerals or even year old birds in mating.

Editing to add that I think I found some answers. Melanizers are what is needed to prevent or hide leakage of gold or silver. I knew that, I just forgot about that aspect of it.

Regarding the color of the leakage in the above splash, is it possible that the particular color he shows is a result of him being split for gold and silver? Obviously, he is not carrying enough melanizers to cover, but why is the leakage not red or white? Is it gold being diluted by silver or is it gold being influenced by something else?
These are just my thoughts and opinions :)
 
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What I know and come to understand is that you will just get the best blues possible, if you breed blue x blue. Why? because blues carry the Pg gene responsible for single lacing and blacks dont. And you will get the best black with the nice green sheen if you breed E black to E black.
Would you do some research on the Pg gene??? I have never seen an Ameraucana with true lacing...what we have is edging, and I believe it is because of the lack of the Pg gene.....is this gene recessive?? Is that how it gets lost??? I know that there are some people working to produce laced ams from Wyandotts and Andalusians, but they are still in the process of restoring type after the outcrosses...I'm thinking I would like to try this myself, but I just don't know if I can pull it off with my limited genetic knowledge...
Thanks for any help you can offer...
 
Edging or lacing ? Anyway best I have in laced blue .

edging....if you place a feather on a white piece of paper, you will see that the feather edge is almost clear...a feather with lacing will have the black laced edge that the SOP calls for, like a silver laced Wyandotte ...very few breeds have true lacing in blue... I found an old post on the ABC site about some folks working on it. Been A while and I don't know how it is progressing, but I do know of one breeder with Andalusian / Amercauana F1 cross birds...http://ameraucana.org/forum/index.php?topic=1797.45
 

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