Animal Protien

Vitamin E has been used as a preservative for animal fat in other feeds I have looked into. I'm not sure if it is used that way in chicken feed.
 
One of the requirements for “organic certified” chickens is that they cannot be fed animal slaughter byproducts. Some people read that as they have to be vegetarian, but that is not the case. It just can’t be animal slaughter byproducts. It can be other animal products and if they are pastured, they certainly will eat other animal products. My best link is slow to load this morning so I’ll use this so you can see what the organic requirements are. I really prefer going directly to the USDA site for this so it is more authentic but this reads the same.

http://www.extension.org/pages/69041/requirements-for-organic-poultry-production#.VP7vlRE5CUk

Some feeds, like the Dumors that I use, list animal proteins or animal products as the fourth item on ingredients. I’m sure that is animal slaughter byproducts. It’s a way to recycle those wastes and keep feed costs down. Many feeds offered do contain animal byproducts. You may need to extend your purchasing network to find one. That means shop in other places to get what you want if where you are shopping does not carry it.

I grew up on a farm where chickens free ranged. I saw what they eat when given a choice. Animal slaughter byproducts does not concern me a bit, though I know some people will give you all kinds of reasons why they are horrible. I understand they are coming from commercial slaughter operations but it still does not concern me.

If you look through that link above, you will see that the second thing on the list that is allowed is supplements necessary for their health. I can’t remember which it is off the top of my head but one thing they are talking about for chickens is a specific protein that comes from animal products. If you don’t feed animal products, then you have to supplement the feed with that protein, even if it is man-made. “Organic certified” chickens allows a man-made product because it is necessary for their health.

Why is an all-vegetarian feed marketed? Because many people want the very best for their chickens, money no object, and marketing has made some people think that vegetarian is the healthiest way to go, whether it is organic or not. If there is a marketing niche for vegetarian feeds someone will fill that niche. It’s called free enterprise. Hopefully it has the supplements to keep them healthy.

Ridge, I could not have said it any better. Past scientific enquiries prove or at least strongly suggest that milk and other animal products fed to chicks provide some protection for the most destructive poultry disease, Typhoid Pullorum Disease.

It is well that this disease has been long banished from commercial flocks because the USDA, FDA, and perhaps even your state Department of Agriculture could descend on your farm and destroy all of your fowl right before you and your family's eyes. All it would take is for a backyard flock to spread Typhoid Pullorum to a commercial flock, that by the way are all tested for Pullorum. Therefor there is no doubt about the source of the infection and all untested chickens must pay the ultimate price.

A vegetarian chicken ration is a foolish fad that has come about mostly because of charlatans like Dr. Oz or the 7 minute news cycle. I well remember when all the TV talking heads were up in arms over an ingredient in chicken feed called "Tankage" also known as slaughter house waste.

If you people want a real laugh read what these ill-informed chicken keepers (well at least most of them) had to say about the subject of tankage.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/510700/what-the-heck-is-tankage
If you will open and read the above link you can well understand how come so many of your chickens have health problems. This "MARKETING" ploy is used to sell inferior and even dangerous chicken feed to people who don't know any better, however all that aside, they "asked for it and they got it" but their poor chickens has to pay the price with his or her health.

So I suggest that we all return to those exciting days of yesteryear before there were any chemical compounds and produce all our own food. Since homemade sausage making is already used in one post in the above link and the usual suspects who attack tankage also attack the use of Sodium Nitrate to prevent the growth of the Botulism Bacterium in dry cured sausage like Baloney, I therefor wish to advised my chicken keeping friends that it is entirely possible to substitute Potassium Nitrate (salt peter) for Sodium Nitrate in the making of dry cured sausage.

Therefor I am including this long established recipe for making your very own natural, organic Potassium Nitrate. Bon Appetite Y'all, and please pass the Andouille and Crawdad gumbo.

PS: no bats or bat caves were harmed during the composition of this post!!!

"By the request of the Chief of the Department of the Military, under authority of the Executive Council, I have been induced to publish, for the instruction of planters and manufacturers, a very succinct account of the most approved methods of manufacturing saltpetre. In doing so, I shall aim only at brevity and clearness. The general conditions necessary to the formation of saltpetre are:
1st, the presence of decaying organic matter, animal or vegetable, especially the former;
2d, an alkaline or earthy base, as potash or lime;
3d, sufficient moisture;
4th, free exposure to the oxygen of the air; and...
5th, shelter from sun and rain.

These conditions are often found in nature, as in the soil of all caves, but particularly those in limestone countries; and still more frequently under a concurrence of circumstances which, though not strictly natural, is at least accidental, so far as the formation of nitre is concerned, as in cellars, stables, manure-heaps, &c. In crowded cities, with narrow, dirty streets and lanes, the decomposing organic matter with which the soil is impregnated becomes gradually nitrified, oozes through, and dries on the walls and floor of the cellars, as a whitish crust, easily detectible as saltpetre by the taste. The same salt may be found in the soil beneath stables of several years' standing, particularly if lime or ashes have been used to hasten the decomposition of the manure; also in the earth of sheep and cattle pens, if these have remained several years in the same position; also in the soil beneath manure-heaps, particularly if lime or ashes have been added to them, as is common among farmers in making compost. It is very important, then, that the soil of such caves, cellars, stables, pens and manure-heaps, as described above, should be tested for saltpetre. If the salt exists in considerable quantities, it may be detected by the taste; if not, a small quantity of the earth may be leached, and the ley boiled down to dryness, and then tested by the taste. If there be still any doubt, any chemist or educated physician may test it. If the earth contains saltpetre in sufficient quantities, it must be leached, and the salt crystallized, by methods which we have described below.

By these means, if diligently used in all parts of the State, it is hoped that an immediate and not inconsiderable amount of saltpetre may be obtained. It is not believed, however, that the supply thus obtained will be sufficient for the exigencies of the war. It is very important, therefore, that steps should be taken to insure a sufficient and permanent supply of this invaluable article. This can only be done by means of nitre-beds. I proceed, then, to give a very brief account of the method of making these.

The most important prerequisite in the construction of nitre-beds in such manner as to yield nitre in the shortest possible time, is a good supply of thoroughly rotted manure of the richest kind, in the condition usually called mould, or black earth. It is believed that in every vicinity a considerable supply of such manure may be found, either ready prepared by nature, or by the farmer and gardener for agricultural and horticultural purposes. To make the bed, a floor is prepared of clay, well rammed, so as to be impervious to water. An intimate mixture is then made of rotted manure, old mortar coarsely ground, or wood ashes (leached ashes will do), together with leaves, straw, small twigs, branches, &c. to give porosity to the mass, and a considerable quantity of common earth, if this has not been sufficiently added in the original manure-heap. The mixture is thrown somewhat lightly on the clay floor, so as to form a porous heap four or five feet high, six or seven wide, and fifteen feet long. The whole is then covered by a rough shed to protect from weather, and perhaps protected on the sides in some degree from winds. The heap is watered every week with the richest kinds of liquid manure, such as urine, dung-water, water of privies, cess-pools, drains, &c. The quantity of liquid should be such as to keep the heap always moist, but not wet. Drains, also, should be so constructed as to conduct any superfluous liquid to a tank, where it is preserved and used in watering the heaps. The materials are turned over to a depth of five or six inches every week, and the whole heap turned over every month. This is not always done, but it hastens very much the process of nitrification. During the last few months of the process, no more urine, nor liquid manure of any kind, must be used, but the heaps must be kept moist by water only. The reason of this is, that undecomposed organic matter interferes with the separation of the nitre from the ley. As the heap ripens, the nitre is brought to the surface by evaporation, and appears as a whitish efflorescence, detectible by the taste. When this efflorescence appears, the surface of the heap is removed, to the depth of two or three inches, and put aside under shelter, and kept moist with water. The nitre contained is thus considerably increased. When the whitish crust again appears, it is again removed until a quantity sufficient for leaching is obtained. The small mound which is thus left is usually used as the nucleus of a new heap. By this method it is believed that an abundant supply of nitrified earth, in a condition fit for leaching, may be obtained by autumn or early winter.

I have spoken thus far of the method of preparing a single heap, or nitre-bed, such as any farmer or gardener may prepare with little trouble. But where saltpetre is manufactured on a large scale, as in the saltpetre plantations, many such beds are made and symmetrically arranged, so as to economize space; all under the same roof, with regularly arranged drains, all leading to a large cistern. In such plantations everything may be carried on with more economy, and with correspondingly increased profits.

PREPARATION OF MOULD.

I have supposed that there is already a considerable supply of rotted manure, prepared for other purposes, in a condition fitted for making nitre-beds; but after the present year this precarious supply must not be relied on. Systematic preparation of mould or black earth must be undertaken. The process of preparation is so precisely similar to that of compost manure that little need be said, the chief difference being the greater richness in nitrogenous matter in the case of compost intended for nitre-beds. First prepare a floor of well-rammed clay; on this place a layer of common soil, mixed with broken old mortar or ashes, six or eight inches thick; then a layer of vegetable matter -- straw, leaves, rank weeds, &c. then a layer of animal matter, dung, flesh, skin, scrapings of drains, sinks, &c. then another layer of mixed earth and mortar or ashes, and so on until a heap six feet high is made. Brush and sticks are often introduced, also, to increase the porosity of the mass. The whole is protected from the weather, and watered every week or two with urine or dung-water, until the organic matter is entirely decomposed into a black mass. This will take place in about a year, or perhaps less, in our climate. The whole is thoroughly mixed, and is then fit for making nitre-beds, as already explained.
Thus it is hoped that the preparation of saltpetre may be set on foot at once in three different stages of advance, viz.: by the collection of already nitrified earth; by the making of nitre-beds from already formed black earth; and by the preparation of black earth. By leaching, the first would yield immediate results, the second in six or eight months, and the last in about eighteen months or two years.
The method I have given above is that of the French [method]. Other methods are precisely the same in principle, and differ only slightly in some of the details. The best of these is the

PRUSSIAN METHOD.

Five parts of black earth and one of spent ashes or broken mortar are mixed with barley straw, to make the mass porous. The mixture is then made into heaps six feet high and fifteen feet long with one side perpendicular (and hence called walls), and the opposite side sloping regularly by a series of terraces or steps. Straight sticks are generally introduced, and withdrawn when the mass is sufficiently firm. By this means air and water are introduced into the interior of the mass. The heap is lightly thatched with straw, to protect from sun and rain. The whole is frequently watered with urine and dung-water. The perpendicular side being turned in the direction of the prevailing winds, the evaporation is most rapid on that side. The liquid with which the heap is watered is drawn by capillarity and evaporation to this side, carrying the nitre with it, and the latter effloresces there as a whitish crust. The perpendicular wall is shaved off two or three inches deep as often as the whitish incrustation appears, and the material thus removed is kept for leaching. The leached earth, mixed with a little fresh mould, is thrown back on the sloping side of the heap, and distributed so as to retain the original form of the heap. Thus the heaps slowly change their position, but retain their forms. This method yields results in about a year-- probably in our climate in eight months."

http://docsouth.unc.edu/imls/lecontesalt/leconte.html
 
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I always give my chicks yogurt and liver (both from our own pastured cattle) and they always grow up stronger and healthier than the ones that are not fed these things.
 
Decreasing the use of animal protein and fats in any way is on the agenda of all animal rights activist groups. They understand that byproducts of the animal protein for human consumption is an important part of the profit picture for the industry. If the AR activists can in any way decrease the profitability of animals utilized by industrial food providers the more disinterested those providers will be in Continuing the practice. Animal.rights groups have contributed greatly to the merit less claims that animal byproducts are in some way bad.

Those who belive that animal products are "inappropriate food substances" for chickens are being herded.
 
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2436 Broilers
Vegetable protein diets are cheaper and safer than animal protein diets but do broiler chickens like them equally? And is their performance the same or better? Australian researchers came up with an answer at the World Poultry Congress in Brazil. Their 
conclusion, as they call it, is a setback for the industry.

002_boerderij-image-1233865.jpeg

By M.M. Bhuiyan, and P.A. Iji, School of Environmental & Rural Science, University of New England, Armidale, NSW, Australia and G. Clatworthy, Inghams Enterprise, Leppington NSW, Sydney, Australia
Cereal grains like wheat, barley, sorghum and maize are the main energy sources used by the Australian poultry industry. Protein and its constituent amino acids are mainly provided by vegetable sources such as soybean, canola, peas, sunflower, and also animal by-products, particularly meat meal. Vegetable protein (VP) sources are typically unbalanced in amino acids although there are significant differences in quality between these sources, soybean being generally regarded as the best of the lot.
The inclusion rate of VP sources may also be limited by the presence of anti-nutritive factors such as phytic acid, enzyme-inhibitors and other compounds that directly affect digestion or nutrient metabolism. Animal by-products like meat meal, meat-and-bone meal, blood meal, fish meal and 
feather meal are higher in protein content and their amino acids are more balanced than those of plant sources. These by-products are therefore 
included at up to a level of 10% in 
traditional poultry diets.
In recent years, the use of animal by-products has come under review and such materials have been banned in the European Union. Poultry tend to benefit the most from the use of animal by-products in the diet, and tend to suffer less directly from some of the zoonotic diseases, unlike cattle and other ruminant species, unless the 
animal by-product is poorly processed. There has been little research to 
compare VP diets to traditional diets and results of these are conflicting. There has been more research on the possibilities of replacing more 
expensive vegetable sources like 
soybean with alternatives like canola, peanut, sunflower and lupins.

Feeding different protein diets

The experiment was a 2×2×2 factorial design, with diets based on VP or AP; with or without microbial enzymes, and fed to male (initial weight, 44.9±0.9 g) or female (initial weight, 45±0.9 g) chicks. A total of 720 day-old 
Ross-308 broiler chicks were randomly allocated to eight treatments, each 
replicated six times with 15 birds in each replicate, on floor pens. Sixty other chicks (mixed-sex) were reared to 14 days, at which point, they were randomly allocated to VP or AP diets, both supplemented with microbial enzymes, each replicated six times. This sub-experiment was conducted to assess feed selection by the chicks. The latter were reared on grower diet and then on finisher diet at 14-21 and 21-28 days of age, respectively. The basal AP diets contained mainly wheat (≤36.0%), sorghum (≤36.5%), millrun (5.0%), meat meal (≤10.0%), soybean meal (≤27.0%), canola meal (4.0%) and cottonseed meal (4.0%) plus fixed minor ingredients. The VP diets 
contained no millrun and meat meal while mono-dicalcium phosphate was excluded from the AP diets. Both sets of diets were iso-caloric (12.45, 12.55, 12.70 and 12.70 MJ/kg at the starter, grower, finisher and withdrawal phases, respectively). During the same phases, the protein contents were 229.0, 210.0, 194.0 and 181.0 g/kg diet, respectively. The gross responses of the birds in terms of feed intake, growth and feed conversion efficiency were assessed every seven days.

A clear preference

Feed intake to 21 days was reduced by 6% on the VP diets (Table 1). This was increased by enzyme supplementation of the VP diets (1-3%) but reduced on the AP diets. Live weight at 21 days was reduced by 3-4% on the VP diets and increased by the enzyme supplements (4%). The VP diet resulted in a 1% improvement in feed conversion ratio and this was further improved (4%) by enzyme supplements. Flock uniformity at 14 days was better on the AP diets (around 2%) and was increased by enzyme supplementation of the VP diets (3%).
Over the entire feeding period (42 days), feed intake on the VP diets was about 10% lower than on the AP diet but was improved, by 5-6%, through enzyme supplementation (Table 2). Live weight was reduced by up to 6% on the VP diet, but improved (5%) by enzyme supplementation. Feed conversion ratio was better (by 1%) on the VP diets and further improved (2.5%) by enzyme supplements. Flock uniformity at 28 days was better (1%) on VP diets and increased (1%) by enzyme supplements.
Birds generally preferred the AP diet when given a choice (Figure 1). On 
the grower diet, birds ate 62% of AP and 38% of VP, while on the finisher diets; the selection was 82 and 18%, respectively. Preference was significant in the grower (P<0.01) and finisher (P<0.001) periods.

No sweeping conclusions

The feed intake and body weight gain of birds were lower while on VP based diets than on the AP diet. However, there is an inconsistency in results obtained by different researchers working with different feed formulations, which is a setback for the industry, as it makes it difficult to make sweeping conclusions on the nutritive value of VP diets. The quality of such diets would depend on the basal ingredients that are used in the formulation and also how close the nutrient profiles of the diets are to one another. Often, it is 
difficult to have such similarities in 
profiles due to the differences in concentrations of nutrients in the plant protein sources compared to AP sources. The former sources are known to be unbalanced in nutrients, particularly, amino acids. In the present study, the diets were similar in energy, protein, minerals and key amino acids. This is responsible for the similarity in response of the birds on the two sets of diets.
When offered a choice, the birds preferred AP diets to VP diets and no clear reason was established for this preference. The key minerals that would affect feed intake are Na, Cl and Zn. In the present study, there were no marked differences in concentrations of Na and Cl, but slight differences in Zn content. It is not certain if this difference in Zn is large enough to cause the amount of aversion for VP diets that were recorded. Based on the level of performance observed on the VP diets, it is possible that this performance can be further increased, to completely close the gap between VP and AP diets. Such a scenario would be dependent on biotechnical intervention, including some further processing of the plant protein sources, prior to inclusion in the diet or use of appropriate nutrient supplements in the diet.
The microbial enzymes, which were tested in the current study marginally improved performance, particularly on the VP diets but were not effective enough, as to completely close the gap between these diets and the AP diets. It may have been possible, for example to recommend a more appropriate microbial enzyme if the patterns of nutrient digestibility were determined. Litter quality was not different between the two diet groups.
The results of this study have strong implications for the Australian meat chicken industry to utilise broiler diets solely based on vegetable ingredients. The major hindrance to the use of such diets by the industry is feed cost. However, there is an opportunity to develop VP diet formulation and a niche market for broiler products that are labelled as completely raised on VP diet. This product is almost on the same pedestal as free range or organic farming. This could be a new direction to explore the chicken industry.
by Fabian Brockotter Sep 24, 2013
 
I am still trying to find a feed that contains animal protein. I live in an urban area and my choices are limited. After listening to people on this site, I picked up a big ole bag of Blue Seal Home Fresh Extra Egg-- after hearing about what a great animal-based feed they make. I looked on Blue Seal's website and found a vendor about 45 minutes away. I didn't even think of review the ingredient deck at the store, since BC's animal-by product lobby so heartily sold me on Blue Seal. BS. BS does not contain animal protein -- zero Blue Seal chicken feeds have animal protein. Others here will swear Nutrena or Dumor contains animal protein -- but these brands do not. Many people who post here don't even care to check, but just make up their own facts. After reading several animal feed posts here, I'm convinced 60 % of people have no idea what they are talking about and makes stuff up. Problem is... I don't know what 60 percent. I still can't find an animal protein-containing feed near me.
 
I am still trying to find a feed that contains animal protein. I live in an urban area and my choices are limited. After listening to people on this site, I picked up a big ole bag of Blue Seal Home Fresh Extra Egg-- after hearing about what a great animal-based feed they make. I looked on Blue Seal's website and found a vendor about 45 minutes away. I didn't even think of review the ingredient deck at the store, since BC's animal-by product lobby so heartily sold me on Blue Seal. BS. BS does not contain animal protein -- zero Blue Seal chicken feeds have animal protein. Others here will swear Nutrena or Dumor contains animal protein -- but these brands do not. Many people who post here don't even care to check, but just make up their own facts. After reading several animal feed posts here, I'm convinced 60 % of people have no idea what they are talking about and makes stuff up. Problem is... I don't know what 60 percent. I still can't find an animal protein-containing feed near me.

feel better now?
 
I know I plan to find feed with animal proteins in it.....and if I can't find it, I'll figure out how to make it myself. I've never been a fan of pushing trend diets onto animals. (vegetarian dog and cat food, anyone?)

Yes....vegetarian cat food....for an animal who only eats plants to induce vomiting and to get high (oh cat nip). An animal who is purely carnivorous has vegetarian diets being made for it. If that doesn't show the trend, I don't know what will.

The diet an animal is supposed to eat will be healthier for it. An omnivore should eat both plants and animals, a carnivore should eat animals, and herbivore should eat plants, an insectivore should eat bugs, etc. It's what their bodies are made to process and use. Those synthesized amino acids are clearly not working as well as animal proteins if the birds are tearing out feathers and cannibalizing.

Commercial birds (who I imagine the studies were done on, if not, what breed and where exactly were the birds from?) are often debeaked, so feather pulling and cannibalism wouldn't even really be possible for them.

I feel like it should be common sense to feed an animal at least the most basic of what it should eat ._.

Even if the food does come from slaughterhouse extras, I guess at least they aren't wasting it. And the animals can only get so sick, or the slaughterhouse, or even feedlot, refuses them (at least here where I'm at....which is good, because kansas produces insane amounts of meat and crop). So the animal protein won't likely be from sick animals.
 
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