Anybody watching the Civil War on PBS this week?

[foweler]

Quote:
We all have a dog in this fight.
Either you believe that the agreement the free states entered into in forming the Federation did not include the right of said Federation to prevent the disolution of that agreement when it became clear that conflicts were impossible to resolve or you believe that the Federation (and therefore the Constitution) DOES contain the right to block secession.

I can't find it in the Constitution myself and if so that Makes Lincoln an imperialist criminal regardless of anything at all to do with slavery.....and that is what modern day secessionists care about. The RIGHT TO SECEDE.
As one of the only possible checks to runaway Federal power that was so colesced by the actions of Lincoln.
You're not likely to find anyone in the modern 10th amendment movement who thinks anyone has any type of property rights in the person of another human, much less a will to return to slavery.
But the slavery card is invariably thrown out in response to any mention of secession, as though it is somehow inseperable from the concept, in a childish effort to shut down the dialogue.

 

[Q9]

Quote:
I used to think the North was the good guy in that fight. Then I read some of the stuff written by those who dissent from the bovine excrement we're typically fed - it's far more convincing. I DO read both sides, by the way. I personally own "Eye of the Storm," the diary of Union private Robert Knox Sneden. That's about as pro-Union as it's possible to get, and I've read plenty of PC material, though I do need to check out Harry Jaffa, as DiLorenzo makes many unfriendly references to him. I like to know exactly what they say, rather than just quotes. And of course there's no way to convince an Unreconstructed Rebel - there are few arguments on your side that hold water for 5 minutes.

 

[Q9]

Quote:
We all have a dog in this fight.
Either you believe that the agreement the free states entered into in forming the Federation did not include the right of said Federation to prevent the disolution of that agreement when it became clear that conflicts were impossible to resolve or you believe that the Federation (and therefore the Constitution) DOES contain the right to block secession.

I can't find it in the Constitution myself and if so that Makes Lincoln an imperialist criminal regardless of anything at all to do with slavery.....and that is what modern day secessionists care about. The RIGHT TO SECEDE.
As one of the only possible checks to runaway Federal power that was so colesced by the actions of Lincoln.
You're not likely to find anyone in the modern 10th amendment movement who thinks anyone has any type of property rights in the person of another human, much less a will to return to slavery.

If Lincoln's view was correct - that the South could not secede, and therefore was simply in rebellion - he committed treason by launching an invasion and blockading Southern ports. The Constitution makes it very clear.

 

[foweler]

Now let's talk about how Lincoln unleashed Sherman on the natives, once his well seasoned forces were through with the war, to make land grabs for the govt subsidized railroads, whom Lincoln just happened to be a lawyer for before being elected.

 

[Q9]

Quote:
Or how Lincoln hand-picked several Indian warriors to be hanged just to appease the voters, even though the warriors had committed no crime except defending their land.

Or how Lincoln threw 13,000 (low estimate) people into prison without a trial solely for openly disagreeing with the war.

Or how he put a judge under house arrest with no trial after said judge ruled the war unconstitutional.

Or how he censored telegrams and newspapers, and shut down quite a few opposition newspapers.

Or how he deported a vocal antiwar congressman after throwing him in prison - without a trial.

Or how he arrested most of the Maryland legislature with the ARMY because they might vote to secede.

 

[foweler]

In the same vein, hollering slavery or racism to silence dissenting discourse that is:
http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/85465.html

 

[woodmort]

Quote:
Reread the Bill of Rights again--"...life liberty and property" What do you suppose they were referring to? Also, after much reading about Jefferson, I'm not sure but what he was kind of a crackpot too who got too caught up in revolution for revolution sake rather than for the common good.
BTW, I have yet to find any opt out clause in the Constitution that allows States to secede , plus that was pretty much settled, for better or worse, by the Civil War.

 

[ChickenAlgebra]

Quote:
Or how Lincoln hand-picked several Indian warriors to be hanged just to appease the voters, even though the warriors had committed no crime except defending their land.

Or how Lincoln threw 13,000 (low estimate) people into prison without a trial solely for openly disagreeing with the war.

Or how he put a judge under house arrest with no trial after said judge ruled the war unconstitutional.

Or how he censored telegrams and newspapers, and shut down quite a few opposition newspapers.

Or how he deported a vocal antiwar congressman after throwing him in prison - without a trial.

Or how he arrested most of the Maryland legislature with the ARMY because they might vote to secede.

Very similar to what W. Bush did, but yet the groups that hate Lincoln seem to routinely support W. Bush.

 

[EweSheep]

Has anyone read the book "If the South had won"?

 

[foweler]

Quote:
Reread the Bill of Rights again--"...life liberty and property" What do you suppose they were referring to? Also, after much reading about Jefferson, I'm not sure but what he was kind of a crackpot too who got too caught up in revolution for revolution sake rather than for the common good.
BTW, I have yet to find any opt out clause in the Constitution that allows States to secede , plus that was pretty much settled, for better or worse, by the Civil War.

Once again, I said modern 10th amendment movement. Not one person currently supporting that movement would proclaim anyone has property rights in another person, self ownership is central to what these people believe.
But that doesn't stop people from automatically connecting them to racism and slavery at the mere mention of a belief in the right of states to secede.
And all the civil war did was prove what people have known all along...that power will kill and oppress to maintain itself and do so in the name of any good cause it can convince people to accept.