It is not any different than learning Greek mythology that we learned in English Lit. classes. It pays to be a well rounded individual!
Anyone non-religious here? Please be nice!
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It would be nice if schools could have not Religion class, but Religions class. There's no doubt that religion is a huge part of people's lives and of society. Total ignorance of other people's religions is part (not all, of course) of what causes problems.
I remember my Catholic religion class...each person took a turn reading a paragraph from the religion book. One paragraph per person, up and down the rows. Turning what was supposed to be the basic underpinning of our whole lives into a snoozefest. And not incidentally, turning some of the students away from religion as uncool, boring, irrelevant stuff.
I read that link on learning about tolerance toward other religions but it seemed more like an "touchy-feely" approach. It's good, but I'd like to see a basic knowledge approach. It's a subject. Study it like any other. X amount of proportional time for X percentage of people in that religion in the world.
I know this can't happen...but I can wish, can't I?
Oh, and let me just share here the best thing that a nun ever said to me since there have been some posts mentioning religion & science. This was an older nun. She was probably not the best teacher, and she often had trouble controlling our rowdy fifth grade class. Anyway, we were allowed to go up to the desk to ask questions once the lecture was over and we were working on whatever we were supposed to work on.
Well, up I went during science class, and I asked her how God could have created the world in seven days with people on the sixth day, but we were learning science about the different eras like Paleozoic and so forth and how they took millions of years before people even showed up. I wasn't being obnoxious. I just wanted to know. She looked straight at me with those peaceful old nun eyes, and she said, "Don't you ever worry about that. God's days are longer than we can imagine."
Very simple and straight. Perfect for a fifth grader. The idea that God is back there somewhere...behind & beyond all of what we can find out as humans. I never worried again about science as somehow inconsistent with the idea of God(dess)(s). So here's to Sister Virginia, who didn't always do the best job of teaching but managed to grab on to a pretty important moment and get her point across. I hope she is somewhere having very, very long days with God, even if heaven might or might not be exactly what she believed.
I remember my Catholic religion class...each person took a turn reading a paragraph from the religion book. One paragraph per person, up and down the rows. Turning what was supposed to be the basic underpinning of our whole lives into a snoozefest. And not incidentally, turning some of the students away from religion as uncool, boring, irrelevant stuff.
I read that link on learning about tolerance toward other religions but it seemed more like an "touchy-feely" approach. It's good, but I'd like to see a basic knowledge approach. It's a subject. Study it like any other. X amount of proportional time for X percentage of people in that religion in the world.
I know this can't happen...but I can wish, can't I?
Oh, and let me just share here the best thing that a nun ever said to me since there have been some posts mentioning religion & science. This was an older nun. She was probably not the best teacher, and she often had trouble controlling our rowdy fifth grade class. Anyway, we were allowed to go up to the desk to ask questions once the lecture was over and we were working on whatever we were supposed to work on.
Well, up I went during science class, and I asked her how God could have created the world in seven days with people on the sixth day, but we were learning science about the different eras like Paleozoic and so forth and how they took millions of years before people even showed up. I wasn't being obnoxious. I just wanted to know. She looked straight at me with those peaceful old nun eyes, and she said, "Don't you ever worry about that. God's days are longer than we can imagine."
Very simple and straight. Perfect for a fifth grader. The idea that God is back there somewhere...behind & beyond all of what we can find out as humans. I never worried again about science as somehow inconsistent with the idea of God(dess)(s). So here's to Sister Virginia, who didn't always do the best job of teaching but managed to grab on to a pretty important moment and get her point across. I hope she is somewhere having very, very long days with God, even if heaven might or might not be exactly what she believed.
Here's a book for you all, written by Jennifer Michael Hecht. The title of the book: Doubt: A History: The Great Doubters and Their Legacy of Innovation from Socrates and Jesus to Thomas Jefferson and Emily Dickinson.
Here are a few of the customer reviews:
"There are millions of books out there offering to seduce you or browbeat you toward a particular belief system, but for the thoughtful philosophers, the nervous doubters, the nonbelievers (both lost and found), and evangelical athiests, there are very few well-written, even-handed, inspiring texts. Jennifer Hecht deserves a wreath of laurels for creating an exciting, readable, joyous work that belongs in the home of every open-minded, rational, seeker of enlightenment. This book should have its own section in bookstores.
I've been waiting for a guide like this for a long time. My religious friends have their bible; but this is mine. Mine. My source of wisdom from the ancients. My source of morality tales and life stories of my martyrs.
Errors? It's funny: the bible is supposed to be the word of a divine being, but it still has mistakes in it. Doubt: A History is the work of a human, for humans, for you. If I were offered a canteen of water after a week in the desert, I wouldn't complain if the canteen were the wrong color. Let's get a little perspective here. There are people who can't sleep at night for want of what is in this book. Solace. Warmth. Information. Camaraderie. Validation. And ultimately, hope. Hope that our species can save itself by tempering faith with reason."
Another reader's review:
How on earth Jennifer Michael Hecht ever wrote this book I'll never know. Her comprehension of history and philosophy is staggering. I've noticed this book before at the book store and for two years have been tempted to get it. I finally did. I should have gotten it two years ago. Doubt is a mind-expanding piece of insight which could and should be recommended to anyone. The doubt she speaks of is the history of the doubting of God and gods in human thought and society. She goes from the ancient Greeks like Epicurus to Job to Lucretius to Thomas Jefferson to George Carlin and everyone else in between. Her wit and wisdom are evident on every page. I have sat with a hi-liter in my hand through the whole reading of the book, and I "doubt" that there are more than ten pages which do not have something in yellow. Because of her, Amazon now has an order from me for books by Lucretius, Pliny the Elder, and Montaigne. Besides having a hi-liter with you are you read Doubt, I have one other suggestion: Although it is generally frowned upon, I suggest that you skip to the end of the book and read the last two paragraphs. They constitute a love song to Doubt -- as does the whole book. If you are a believer, read it. It will challenge and shake you. If you are a disbeliever, read it. You will learn that you are not alone, and that many wise men and women -- brave and honest -- have preceded you.
Another reader's review:
Amazing... in one book, the wealth of history to confirm the doubter's faith. I started to dog-ear the important pages, but it became difficult to close the book (which was hard enough with the continual revelations.) The style is very user friendly, and the content breathtaking. All the brilliant thinkers you meant to read, plus some outstanding regular folks, are represented. This is the most important book I've ever read. Get it, read it, share it.
Here are a few of the customer reviews:
"There are millions of books out there offering to seduce you or browbeat you toward a particular belief system, but for the thoughtful philosophers, the nervous doubters, the nonbelievers (both lost and found), and evangelical athiests, there are very few well-written, even-handed, inspiring texts. Jennifer Hecht deserves a wreath of laurels for creating an exciting, readable, joyous work that belongs in the home of every open-minded, rational, seeker of enlightenment. This book should have its own section in bookstores.
I've been waiting for a guide like this for a long time. My religious friends have their bible; but this is mine. Mine. My source of wisdom from the ancients. My source of morality tales and life stories of my martyrs.
Errors? It's funny: the bible is supposed to be the word of a divine being, but it still has mistakes in it. Doubt: A History is the work of a human, for humans, for you. If I were offered a canteen of water after a week in the desert, I wouldn't complain if the canteen were the wrong color. Let's get a little perspective here. There are people who can't sleep at night for want of what is in this book. Solace. Warmth. Information. Camaraderie. Validation. And ultimately, hope. Hope that our species can save itself by tempering faith with reason."
Another reader's review:
How on earth Jennifer Michael Hecht ever wrote this book I'll never know. Her comprehension of history and philosophy is staggering. I've noticed this book before at the book store and for two years have been tempted to get it. I finally did. I should have gotten it two years ago. Doubt is a mind-expanding piece of insight which could and should be recommended to anyone. The doubt she speaks of is the history of the doubting of God and gods in human thought and society. She goes from the ancient Greeks like Epicurus to Job to Lucretius to Thomas Jefferson to George Carlin and everyone else in between. Her wit and wisdom are evident on every page. I have sat with a hi-liter in my hand through the whole reading of the book, and I "doubt" that there are more than ten pages which do not have something in yellow. Because of her, Amazon now has an order from me for books by Lucretius, Pliny the Elder, and Montaigne. Besides having a hi-liter with you are you read Doubt, I have one other suggestion: Although it is generally frowned upon, I suggest that you skip to the end of the book and read the last two paragraphs. They constitute a love song to Doubt -- as does the whole book. If you are a believer, read it. It will challenge and shake you. If you are a disbeliever, read it. You will learn that you are not alone, and that many wise men and women -- brave and honest -- have preceded you.
Another reader's review:
Amazing... in one book, the wealth of history to confirm the doubter's faith. I started to dog-ear the important pages, but it became difficult to close the book (which was hard enough with the continual revelations.) The style is very user friendly, and the content breathtaking. All the brilliant thinkers you meant to read, plus some outstanding regular folks, are represented. This is the most important book I've ever read. Get it, read it, share it.
Moabite, I agree. The difference between just gardening and enjoying a spiritual experience is just a matter of how much time you spend enjoying it! You can see it as an ordeal to get through or you can revel in the miracle of nature. In all honesty I probably do both when spending time in my garden. Luckily I don't feel the pressure from a church group to feel perfectly spiritual at all times anymore.
As long as I can still remember to set some time aside to slow down and enjoy my blessings I'm happy.
Carolyn252 I'm looking forward to reading this, it sounds very interesting!
Writer of Words thanks for the link. It's nice to know some folks are aware there is a problem with this kind of discrimination!
Damselfish they do teach religion (and tolerance for different religions) in college but you're right it would be nice if they covered this by high school anyway. They still fall short when it comes to teaching tolerance for non-religion though...
Carolyn252 I'm looking forward to reading this, it sounds very interesting!
Writer of Words thanks for the link. It's nice to know some folks are aware there is a problem with this kind of discrimination!
Damselfish they do teach religion (and tolerance for different religions) in college but you're right it would be nice if they covered this by high school anyway. They still fall short when it comes to teaching tolerance for non-religion though...
Hey all,
Traveling today, I drove by a church with a billboard proclaiming:
"Even Satan is not an Atheist"
Interesting? I suppose the statement is "factual"... But some how I found it offensive, and I am not even an atheist, though I do not "believe" in Satan per say..
Is the statement a jab at Atheists? Or am I reading to much into this silly billboard proclamation?
ON
Traveling today, I drove by a church with a billboard proclaiming:
"Even Satan is not an Atheist"
Interesting? I suppose the statement is "factual"... But some how I found it offensive, and I am not even an atheist, though I do not "believe" in Satan per say..
Is the statement a jab at Atheists? Or am I reading to much into this silly billboard proclamation?
ON
- Dec 21, 2009
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