Anyone ordered from Sandhill Preservation before?

[Professional]

Frankly, I'm surprised, but grateful for the support. He has his desciples who worship every move he makes. Mention the magic words "heritage breed preservation", and they fanatically follow, without question.

To be fair, remember, he doesn't claim to be producing anything that should resemble a show bird. Still, I see the point that some of his birds start to stray enough in certain characteristics, to question their background and purity. Is that really breed preservation? I find it somewhat hypocritical though, to see that he has no hesitation to list his breeds under the APA classifications, while still claiming not to be selling show birds. The APA is purely and simply a sponsor of poultry exhibitions. IMO, you can't have it both ways. Either you want to associate with the exhibition poultry world or you don't. You can't use the classifications as a way to sell more chicks, and then throw your hands up and cry that you're innocent, falling back on the disclaimer that you don't sell show stock, when someone complains that what they received doesn't resemble the description in the show standards.

I see your point too, Arklady, except that in his case, just look at the backlog he has of the rarer breeds. In some, it would seem that he'd have plenty to sell to fill the obvious demand, if he'd concentrate on filling his pens with them instead of African and Embden geese, Guineas, or so many other breeds.

 

[herechickchick]

Quote:
I am going to get mine from Gordie, but here is my problem with the whole thing. I was talking to Cynthia the other day and I was griping how SOOOOOO many breeders will not even speak to you, let alone sell you eggs or God forbid a bird. I can not tell you how many breeders I have contacted about getting hatching eggs from only to never hear from them, and some are on THIS board. I do not understand the unwillingness to work with people interested in the breed and helping to advance the breed itself. This just BLOWS my mind. I mean come on guys a simple sorry "I can not help you "would be fine.

For example:
I joined the American Brahma Club in order to make a connection to obtain hatching eggs from a breeder and not only was my post to buy eggs unanswered my initial "Hello my name is..." post was ignored as well. I mean come on its the freaking Brahma club for God's sake! Someone should have some ding dang Brahma eggs!

It is just so disheartening when you are ignored for no reason. Am I the only one who has had this problem? If not please post you experiences.

 

[deeszoo]

I think that many of us who are interested in the rare breeds have had similar experiences. I joined a Dorking group and of course no one says hi. Then a few days later an officer of the club wrote a long post about how new comers should not "expect" to buy eggs. He had to wait ten years for his "chance" to own Dorkings and he was not going to share any eggs with anyone unless they have done their "dues" and spent a lot of time waiting.

It is crazy. So what if a new breeder doesn't last 30 years? How will you know unless you give them a start? Every time a rare breed is shared with a new person, that breed has a better chance of surviving. Sometimes new breeders don't last because of the cold shoulder they get from "old" breeders.

My experience with a Langshan group has been very different. People there have been nothing but nice. And the breeders seems willing to share their eggs for the most part. My experience with Oriental breeders has been mixed. So, my thought is to keep trying to find people willing to work with you.

I don't have a breeding stock of any of these, I am just looking to start. (just in case anyone wanted some eggs - I just don't have any!)

DeAnna

 

[mountaintopchicken]

SOOOOOO many breeders will not even speak to you, let alone sell you eggs or God forbid a bird.

This has been my experience too. I rarely get anyone to call me or e-mail me back. I called one man who had been recommended to me, to ask about his birds. He answered with curt, one word answers and I felt very embarrassed for having called at all.

I e-mailed another breeder about his stock, and he promptly wrote back that he sells only chicks, for over $150/dozen. I don't mind paying for really good quality, but I wanted further information and wrote asking a few questions about the breed and his stock, and never heard from him again. I don't understand - if you want to charge so much (and the birds would be worth it if well bred!), shouldn't you be willing to answer questions about your birds?

I feel like this is a very hard hobby to get in to, because it's very hard to find and talk to good breeders. I've been tempted to order some birds from Sand Hill, but then I decide that I really want to know exactly what I'm getting, from a passionate breeder. It's hard for me to believe that someone working with that many breeds could be breeding very good quality.​

 

[Katy]

I guess I'm lucky... the breeders that I've contacted about eggs have been friendly and answered emails.

 

[EweSheep]

Been there and done that with some of the Faverolles club. Either they ignore you or you are not worth their time with your so-call trivial questions that are not worth bothered to answer. Yes it ticked me off and it was sort of cliche to certain people. One breeder warned me about it and I decided to join and I was certainly disappointed. However only Rose Isgrigg and Dick Boulanger were the only people ever so nice to me no matter how busy they were. You can not go wrong with Mothergoose, Jimjay and other honest BYCers for their faverolles.

There were a few breeders that turned me off really quick and I wont buy birds from them again. So that was the end of it and a learning chapter for me.

I never had any problems with any of the BYCer breeders, all of them have been very nice and some dont respond back in a timely manner but they do respond when they do get a chance.

Gordie is one of the breeders you will have to be patient with him since he is a small breeder and tries to please everyone the best he can. Some of us bought some of his birds and chicks and eggs were pleased with it and repeated customers are the best thing for any breeder or the word of mouth too!

 

[tiki244]

This is a very informative thread and I am enjoying reading it greatly

 

[Professional]

Adam and DeAna, what you need to understand, is the concept behind breeding show birds. The standards were designed to describe the perfect bird. It is almost an unattainable goal, but that's what we strive for. They were intentionally designed to be difficult to attain. If they were not, many breeders would have perfected their birds, and there would basically be no reason to compete agianst each other any longer. The process is first and foremost, a numbers game. Yes, it takes a breeder's skill, his knowledge of genetics and proper line breeding, inbreeding and outcrossing, as well as just some luck and a lot of hard work. Even the best, most consistent strains still require a fair number of young to be hatched, from which to produce good show winners. That's just a fact of nature, that there are more culls produced than keepers.

Now the serious breeder understands this. He knows that he must start off with the best stock which he can find, and the only way to tell what this stock looks like, is obviously to see it as adults. That way he can get what he wants, and he knows where to go from there. When he begins to hatch from these birds, he wants to hatch as many as possible, grow them up to see how they mature, and pick the best from them to continually improve his stock. This serious breeder is not going to want to sell off eggs or chicks, before he has a chance to see what they'll mature into, and risk letting go some potential birds that he would want for himself. T'here are plenty of people who do, but they're not serious breeders, they're amatures. By that I don't mean that they're always novices. The serious breeder knows that you will have very little chance at hatching out enough chicks from purchased eggs, especially if you get them shipped, to give you a respectable number of birds from which to choose top quality breeders. The serious breeder knows that some of what he holds back as potential keepers, will eventually mature with some minor faults that he will not want to keep, but he knows that these will still be good stock for someone to breed from. The serious breeder knows that other serious breeders, even novices, will have this fundamental understanding of how to go about breeding to lessen the chances of wasting their time. He'll let these mature birds go to someone who is serious, but he often won't waste his time with someone who is not, and the big tip off there is someone who is requesting eggs or chicks.

I don't mean to sound harsh, but that's the way it is. I am one of those who never responds to requests for eggs or chicks, from those who are looking to get a start in show birds, but I've given away more than a few good pairs to get serious novices started. I do give away a dozen or two here and there, after I've hatched out the numbers that I want in each variety, to schools, or someone who is looking to hatch out just a few birds for fun, layers, or whatever. The difference is, these people have realistic expectations, while the egg- to-showbird hopefuls do not. They are also more likely than not, the types who will buy a dozen eggs, have them shipped through the mail, hatch only two or three, not a single one a show winner, and they'll turn around and somehow blame ME for it, whining to whomever will listen, that I'm not reputable. No thanks. I'd rather have you griping that I didn't return your email, than give you even more excuses to run me down, all because I tried to do you a favor by getting you started the cheap and easy way.

 

[speckledhen]

I am a professional myself and I never ignore people's emails. I didn't as a real estate pro and I don't as a breeder, albeit a small-time one. A simple canned email stating, "Sorry, I do not sell eggs or chicks. Thank you for your interest" would suffice. I understand not wanting to just basically give away years of work to people who are not serious (well, hard to guage their seriousness from an email all the time), but to just not reply is rude, IMO. Just say no, but say something. JMHO. Not worth much to some, I'm sure.

 

[Professional]

I see your point, and in a perfect world, it would be nice if it worked that way, but there is a big difference. You're looking to sell something, so it benefits you to return even the most foolish email, even with a "Sorry, I can't help you." The serious breeder does so for his own benefit and enjoyment, not for profit, and certainly not for the benefit of other people. You may obtain a future customer who remembers your kindly acknowledgement of his foolish question. For my part, I don't care if they ever come to their senses and realize what is involved in breeding show birds. Either they will, and eventually ask me for breeding quality adults, or they will not, and continue to bark up the wrong tree by asking others for eggs or chicks, in which case they'll never be successful in breeding quality show birds, and I'll never see them again. Of course they'll get discouraged somewhere along the way, because of their own unreasonable expectations. They won't see that, but instead will blame me and others like me for excluding them.

The guy who wanted $150 for a dozen, doesn't really expect to get it. That's his way of discouraging the buyer from going about it the wrong way, but if he insists, then the breeder's going to make it worth his while. Of course, there's the fact that he did respond. The egg or chick buyers want a response. When they get it, but it's not what they want to hear, that's no good either. It's really just a whole mentality that's hard to change. Most breeders like myself have seen it dozens of times. We don't have the time or the energy to waste, we'd rather be working with our birds, or with people who want to try to do it the right way.