bear

[Mom2Cool]

Quote:
I'd like to mention that the "animal activists" are part of a diverse group of people, with different views from each other on many things. Some, like myself, have major problems with the meat industry but no problem with hunting when carried out in a smart, sustainable way. Also, our nation has a long history of slashing and trashing wildlife as well as habitat, and some activists are responding to that history in a knee jerk way and not always taking into account current situations with livestock. Let's face it, habitat destruction and just plain human BS is causing major losses to many many species of our native wildlife, and many "animal activists" have been pivotal in protecting some of our natural treasures. I totally agree that there are some activists that are unreasonable and single-minded (like in ANY group). I would consider myself an environmentalist and animal lover but I think panner has every right to shoot a problem animal on his property if he has taken good precautions to guard against attacks from predators (which he has) . Please don't lump us all into one group, it's extremely offensive.

It wasn't "some activists" that were out harrassing the hunters but MANY & it's many that have protested to the govenor and anyone who'll listen to stop the bear hunts. It isn't "some activists" that harrassed that drive by harrassing families that have had to call in for help but *many*. It wasn't the "activists who put an end to the bear hunt when their numbers were dwindling it was the Department of Wildlife, fish & game that did that back in the early 1970's they are a group of *hunters*. They help keep a balance in a population of animals that have *no predators* in our area... It's a hunter or nothing. And frankly the idea of them being hunted is a lot closer to a natural end for them than "birth control???"

There are as I type 11 bears cubs that come & go in *just my neighborhood* & across on the south east wide of town another 5 *at least* & this is just within a 15 mile ratio of town heaven knows how many are all over town never mind the next 2 counties that are a loit more rural than us! again I hope they're practicing the rythym method because they are free to come & go in our homes & if we do *anything* the *animal rights GROUPS will be on call to punish us..... I find THAT offensive...

 

[Mom2Cool]

Quote:
I agree here & you know from what I've read it's the Grizzly that will kill the cub of a black bear & so in areas with Grizzlies I imagine that to be "natures way" but here in NJ or the north east there is no Grizzly. And when one sees the sites of the "activists" and they're advertizing for people to come take a crash course in "sabotoching a bear hunt" & SO many show up. well that's all telling you know?


I'm an animal lover from the word go & brought up with a healthy respect for wildlife & animals, but when we've got bears busting through kitchen doors, front doors or even the basement windows & there's like several calls of these throughout the town in the same day I think it's time to cut back on some you know?

 

[AngieChick]

I think my post was misunderstood. I have no disagreement that you have every right to be angry with a group of people that have pushed for some misguided policies that are impacting your family's ability to live in safety with your animals. I seriously doubt that I meet the definition for "animal rights activist", however it's not useful or fair to lump everyone in that group together in one large lump as "the problem". I am not saying the policies you are dealing with are right, they sound pretty wrong-headed to me. But, I can tell you that in the Pacific NW we have been having much better success now that more "environmentalists" and commercial fishermen/loggers/farmers are actually talking to one another and working together to reach some policies that are sustainable and liveable. I am sure that there are many people in the "animal rights" groups that are reasonable and able to see that there is a problem with your current situation, as there are a great many "environmentalists" that understand that fishermen/loggers/farmers need to feed their families.

 

[Mom2Cool]

Quote:
I'm sorry butt I haven't meet any in the "animal rights groups" that are reasonable. If you say bear hunt to any of them or "I shot it in self defense" you will be harrassed & not just by a few.... They call out others etc. If you show concern for *humans* & fear that you cannot live a normal life i.e. it's like living in the city or a PRISON you are told to "move back to the suburbs". This would be by *anyone* who has taken up the cause for the bears. to anyof them there is *no reason* to shot or kill a bear. A man here shot a bear & injured it, but didn't get a good enough shot to kill it. The bear had been *coming through his kitchen door* because it could smell food cooking but because he had shot it in the butt not only was he put *ON TRIAL* but he was harrassed so bad he had to move.... this was not just by 1 or 2 of them.... there were car loads of people driving by & they were calling out more to do the same! They wanted to "drive him out" & they did! it isn't a few it is the "groups".

here's a little article on *ONE* of the most recent issues here in town.

http://njbearhunt.wordpress.com/


That is the story of the woman who's about to be prosecuted for her dog having killed a black bear cub. Next it's going to be my Golden for killing a bunny? It's a "wild animal" that's destructive to boot & has killed MANY dogs here that would be rationalized away by this very same person who is insisting charges be brought against this woman. He would say "well the bear felt challenged" & "You should be clearing the house of garbage" or some such non-sense thing. The fact is there is an over abundance of bears & cubs...... & so this dog who's owner is now trying to comply with orders she was given prior to this for an earlier offense of hers has he dog in a pen but when it sees a 50 lb. bear cub come in the yard (as most dogs are territorial) he breaks out of his pen & he kills it. And now they want this woman jailed for it???? THAT is the "animal Rights" NJSPCA spokes person Matt Stanton....... not the B.E.A.R. group or the labled "animal rights" group but the spca..... & PETA I believe it was their female spokes person who said (& I quote) "if it took the lives of 1000 rats in research to save the life of 1 human boy the cost would be too much." Not reasonable.... I've not met a reasonable "animal rights" person. I'd be the first one to be against an animal injustice, but I do think we need to keep some things in perspective & keep a balance of nature. On the day of the last real hunt the protestors were made to stand behind the roped off area & they were po'd anyway 1 guy was wearing a tee-shirt that read "mother nature is crying today" & so she wasn't crying the day my chickens were killed? & they don't think that putting *wild bears* on *birth control* is screwing with nature?? REasonable? not any of them & they are in great numbers.

 

[Zookeeper9000]

Ok I just want to point out one thing here

Angiechick you are talking about environmentalists and Mom2cool you are talking about activists

Those are 2 very different groups of people. An enviromentalist is someone who is for the good of all and can be reasoned with to achieve a balanced plan that is for the good of all. An activist is an out of control individual that run in a rabid pack that only has one way of looking at things and that way is usally extreme and in most cases dangerous to humans

Just wanted to point out that they are 2 very different groups of people

 

[thewarriorchild]

"The new collars contain new GPS technology that sends out a signal that is received by satellites which then pinpoint, on any computer map, the bear's location each hour.

Using that technology, it could be possible to track an individual bear that broke into a house, if the bear were wearing such a collar.

All this information is part of a bigger study of black bears in New Jersey."

OOOOOHHHHHHHHHh so THAT is why taxes are over 11,000 on an acre property!!! I guess they can pay for that but not the damage the bear did??

 

[wilds of pa]

Just wanted to add, Male black bear will kill cubs any chance they get. When mating season comes those male bear would kill there own offspring as they have no part in raising the cubs and mating really is there drive of life..

When i took my one female Black bear, it had a cub with it, this was back in 1999. Gary Alt was at the weigh station, he pulled a tooth from my bear and i ask him what becomes of the cubs after the female is killed, he told me that when the mother is taken in most cases a male bear will get the cub...However with that said the cub was taken by another hunter that came in shortly after me.

Gary is leading authorities on Black bears
http://www.garyaltconsulting.com/

Heres a good video with Gary..i couldnt figure out how to put it on here. but you will enjoy it.(THIS IS A MUST WATCH VIDEO)
http://ondemand.psu.edu/viewer.php?id=06292007130508

Charlie

 

[Mom2Cool]

Quote:
Hey Deb, I hope your situation is a little better. We're still dealing with Mama and the "gang" and hubby's still working on the electric fence. Talk about a "crash course" in building something.

I think that technology is a good thing actually because there are SO many who have issues with the bears that don't actually call in the complaint. For example like *me* I know I'm just going to be told to "wash my garbage cans" & clap my hands at them. Because until they're ripping the door off there isn't anything anyone can do. So this way if they've got the collars on them they can track where they go, what they're doing & how they're increasing in numbers!!! The Rights people don't want numbers because it goes against their arguments that the "real problem is people & their garbage" 7 points to the rapidly increasing numbers of black bears.... That's why they go on thos sabotoge missions to "spring the traps" the Wildlife, Fish & Game sets to ctch them to tranquilize to put the collars on......

Did you know that our tax dollar goes for programs designed by PETA to "educate people"?

The interesting part is that you'll have the hunter giving accurate information even when it isn't in favor of their position of hunting. Like me being corrected on there being no predators of black bears in the area. The hunters the ones who originally ended hunting black bears because the numbers were so low & the ones looking for factual information to educate the public....

 

[Mom2Cool]

Quote:
Hi Zookeeper. I do understand what you're saying, but I think the thing is that the "activists" will go to the media & their web sites and call on the people who are "reasonable" & they'll call on them to "step up and let your voice be heard that you do NOT WANT the hunt" & they'll use all kinds of propaganda to get these people to act on information that is *incorrect* & without even checking these people WILL react...... When I hear "enviornmentalist" I think of a person who has nature in mind as in keeping the "open space" in the area. I don't really think "animal rights". And there is a huge difference between the 2 groups though I'll add that the "enviornmentalists" have had their own issues that are "fanatical". I believe it was just a couple of years ago that the group came along & used emenant domain to put out a Family Farm that had been in that family from the early 1800's! This was because they were afraid the family who owned the farm was going to sell to a builder & they had a LOT of acreage. Mean while the family didn't get near the price of the property & their GENERATIONAL farm is just gone....... And these are the people who are up in arms over the builders building...? They just took someone's Family farm. Their "homestead for generations" & because it's for "their good of all" it's ok?

This was not a group that was being called "activists" but a group that was "acting through the government". And so we'll all hear about the builder who's doing nothing more than trying to make a living that they are "money hungry" & there's hardly any farmland left in NJ & how "horrible these builders are" but it's ok to destroy ANOTHER farm for the "good of us all"???? This is *EXACTLY* the same thing that's happened with the "animal rights groups". It was the head of the EPA here in NJ (who took over the decision process of deciding if there is a beart hunt needed so it wasn't a 'hunting group looking for a trophy hunt') that said last time that you "cannot have a bear hunt on a handfull of complaint calls when you don't even have an accurate count of the bears themselves". And so for her the count of complaints (more than a handfull I am sure) that didn't matter but she had to have the actual count of bears? And that would be a lot easier if the "activists" would stop springing the traps set to put the counting collars on the bears!

I knew at the start I was talking about animal rights people & Angiechick was speaking of "enviornmentalist" but I think you'll find from animal rights to enviornmentalist they are often mixed in & both groups have their "activists" or extremists. Like the enviornmentalists who go around setting new buildings *peoples HOMES* on fire. that to me is an activist/terroist. Oddly enough the last large & *expensive* home they did that to was a "green house". It was expensive because of yes it's size but really because of the special systems put in to make it "green". They don't care about human life & I guess don't take into consideration that humans are actually part of the "natural world"? We all have to live & deserve some compassion.

 

[panner123]

I know each neighborhood is different
but here if a bear is shot, you can skin and butcher it and no one cares. In those areas that have a problem with shooting them, I would dig a hole first, them shot the bear and have it covered up before anyone was the wiser. In most places back east you wouldn't wasnt to use anything but a shotgun with mag triple 0 buckshot. This at ten yards or less will put the bear down if hit right. A bow will work only you have to be good with it. A rifle is out of the question as there are to many houses. S S S The second S in this case means the use of a backhoe.