Black Copper Marans discussion thread

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by geebs, Jan 26, 2011.

  1. Roosterfry

    Roosterfry Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I'm not new to understanding about biology and animal breeding and education about breed standards. But I am new to Black Cooper Marans. I got my first ones from a high ranking member of the MOAC last fall. And I have not seen one bird from my flock that has it all perfect... But I'm saying that with the perfect standard in mind and I'm just being honest. In my opinion I have good material to work with and I feel confident mine are good enough to be called BCM's... When my second generation matures this spring it's going to tell me alot about what my best rooster and two hens that survived my culling will produce. I've got 5 pullets and 3 cockerals I'm raising from my best three adult BCM's. But speaking of where I'm at now with what my expectation in my flock compared to what it was when I first started this past spring I was about 5 on a scale of 1-10. but recently knowing what I know now I would have to say I'm about a 7 on my expectation scale because I'm seeing prominent well respected breeders having similar egg colors and feather colors as mine and quirks... When I am able produce healthy off spring that are correct 95 percent of the time I'll be happy. What I mean by correct is by proper feather and eye color by SOP and eggs that start off at least solid 8's and lightens to around a 5 then I'll be happy. I know that egg color is possible because my best two hens lay approximately that. Egg color and quantity to me is the number one concern. I have read that in order for a chicken to be called a Maran it has to a "lay at least a 4 on the french egg color scale at some point in the lay." If I read that correctly a maran could lay a 4 for awhile then lighten to 2.... I don't feel that way for this breed. I think we can do better.

    I'm confused how this breed got APA accepted with so many quirks still so prevalent. I wish all the breeders would get on the exact same page and do line breeding within their own flocks until they get their get their flock up to standard and if can not be done cull and start over. After a breeder gets standard birds for several generations THEN find someone who has done the very same thing with their bloodlines. Then and only then should you out cross for genetic diversity. But you should not do out crosses until you've got it dang close to perfect and find someone else who's done the same [​IMG]

    If everyone who's breeding Black Copper Marans keeps out crossing with the person who they believe has the best marans they we will continue to have the same problems.
     
  2. snowbird

    snowbird Overrun With Chickens

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    Sue, Do you ever get any of the spherical shaped eggs out of the hens laying the Dark eggs ? Would be nice to see a group of these Dark eggs that had the spherical shape. I have seen a few eggs on here that were dark and spherical also. Being spherical should help with the egg color also since it would take a little longer to lay. None of the Marans I had layed the spherical egg.
     
  3. bigshawn

    bigshawn Chillin' With My Peeps

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    ^^^^^^Great points Roosterfry.................
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
  4. marquisella

    marquisella Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Quote:Well thanks Don, but I have to say that I have seen darker than mine. I was lucky last spring to find myself with a couple of hens that must have liked me a lot because they decided to give me some nice eggs....

    Here is my opinion...for what its worth.

    No one selling eggs, is going to have such wonderful birds, that selling a dozen to someone will guarantee that each chick hatched, if they hatch, will turn out to be the perfect Marans nor that they will lay, if hens, a dark enough egg.

    What I have learned is that out of 100 chicks, you are lucky, if one turns out to be a keeper.

    Trying to balance, type with dark egg color is very, very hard. Chicken genes will drive you crazy....! One year you will have nice dark eggs, and then the next.....barely a 4.

    There doesn't seem to be a formula to guarantee dark eggs except, breed from your darkest and cross you fingers & hope to heaven the chick matures to even look like a Marans...LOL

    And then, that the resulting chick also lays an egg as dark.

    I, naively, thought that breeding for type was all important, but soon learned that without that dark egg, it isn't a Marans.

    Understand, that it will take you years to finally get to the place you want.. It won't happen with your first dozen eggs or chicks. I'm at year 5, and I'm going for the egg color and from those pullets I hatched out last spring, I will only keep those that are the "least" offensive in type. I raised up over 15 cockerels. I had some help culling from a thief...they took a couple of birds from each of 3 black copper pens. I think they thought I wouldn't notice them missing....ha! I did. But, I'm down to 3 now, and I'm using them, even though each one has something I would like to improve on, but I have them with girls that need the good things they have.

    Good advice here, talk to breeders, ask them questions like: Have your black coppers ever produced wheatens? How much copper do your roosters have on their breasts? Do they have white anywhere on their bodies? Leg color. size. egg color or course. Hen's hackle color. These are just the ones I can think of now...there are probably more. How long have you been breeding Marans? How are the combs? etc.

    Good Luck,
    Sue

    Thank you make alot of since to me put this way, I will keep looking, reading and asking ? when I make the jump I see I have alot of work ahead of me but thats cool I'm not trying to get into this to make monies anyway, for me there is know bad to this as any birds that don't work out will be used in one way or the other(food, eggs ect.) so it a win win as far as I see it...........

    I guess I was just trying to say that it is not an easy jump from type to egg color. So people know that its a lot of work and years of hatching. I've seen people post here on byc, that they were going to work on type, creating varieties, etc. and then think about egg color.....big mistake, but that is how everyone learns! School of hard knocks and all that... LOL
     
  5. math ace

    math ace Overrun With Chickens

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    Quote:[​IMG] Sorry Geebs [​IMG]
    I can only imagine how bad it is to lose a favorite roo ! [​IMG]

    Do you have any sons on the property to remind you of Charlie ? ? ? [​IMG] Sorry again [​IMG]
     
  6. math ace

    math ace Overrun With Chickens

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    Quote:What is GLWT ? ? [​IMG]
     
  7. flgardengirl

    flgardengirl Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Sunny side up :)
    good luck with that [​IMG]
     
  8. DMRippy

    DMRippy Pallet Queen Premium Member

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    Quote:Is Don a Judge? [​IMG]
     
  9. snowbird

    snowbird Overrun With Chickens

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    Quote:Is Don a Judge? [​IMG]

    I think she is thinking about Walt Fowlman01 . I have judged several Fair shows and have enough trouble judging my own fowl. I believe she has me mixed up with someone else since no one around here thinks I have enough sense to get out of the rain.
     
  10. math ace

    math ace Overrun With Chickens

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    [​IMG] Hey Snowbird! [​IMG]

    flgardengirl... GLWT - - Thanks for the education! [​IMG]
     

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