Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[Runawaylobster]

It does not happen 100% of the time and most breeders of white work with it some how. I have a few white breeds and I don't see it either.

i see this in my lavender orps... the whites are very pretty but not very useful in my orp flock..

 

[One Chick Two]

Which BCM roos has the best show roo qualities, please advise which one and why. All opinions welcome!
Thanks


Oh yea they are about 10 months old!

I'm pretty new at this, so take my evaluation with a grain of salt- but got to start somewhere, so I'll al least attempt to give this a whirl... The additional photos that Ihilani Coffee suggested will give the males shown the fairest evaluation.

I think these males are handsome, and look overall, pretty good.

Most BCM have issues of some sort.

Male 1:
Eye color looks just right. Ear muff is a bit dark, as it should be copper, but there appears to be some copper in there, so that is okay I believe- just as long as there is some copper. Nice, smooth, hairless, wrinkle free face. Don't believe there is any thumbprints in comb- at least from this side and angle. I think comb tines are correct if I count the tiny point correctly. Lower hackle has straw in halo. Is there black ticking edges at the bottom edge of hackle tips? (Don't know if that is actually there- and, it would be pretty minimal if it is.) Nice chest roundness, extending past beak. Nice front end width. He looks good sized to me. Bottom fluff hue looks nice and black- no brown fluff. Wing carriage points toward vent. Nice.

Mahogany on wing bow feathers still growing in, as are saddle feathers- which appear to be a very nice copper color. Is there any feather-edge black ticking on saddle feathers edges? This saddle should look nicely balanced when fully filled out. Is there some purple sheen on tail feathers? (Photos can produce artifacts and oddities that don't really exist in reality.)

Would need a side shot taken at chicken eye level to fairly evaluate his type/ back conformation, back length, rear view width- and tail angle and tail size. It's easiest when you can place the chicken close to your eye level and photograph them. (On a rock, step, etc.)

He does appear to have sparsely/ spotty feathered shanks- but maybe he might grow some more in, in time? (Not sure if leg feathers work that way.) As I understand it, the shank feathering should extend down in a straight line, down far outside toe only. Feathers should look a bit more like this male's foot feathers. (Sorry, he was pretty dirty, he had been grubbing in mud and muck with the hens.) Not as much as a Cochin feathering though.



Male 2:

Depending on what his back, rear end and tail angle really looks like from other angles, I may possibly like this male just a bit more... JMO.

His ear muff is slightly dark- like grey, but not black. The neck hackle looks much more even and balanced. Is his face clean? (Am I seeing shadows?) Again, I might be seeing a bit of black edge hackle ticking- on low feather tips, but only a bit. Chest looks wide, but with his angle chest thrust forward, toward us, and his rear away from us, we can't see his bottom line- looks a bit weak there from this angle. (The head-to-chest-to-abdomen line.) Mahogany red wing bows still growing in. Saddle coming in. Are there the black ticking on saddle edges again? (Again, could be lighting, and it would be very slight anyway.) Fluff is dark, and tail feathers have a nice beetle green sheen. Tail feathers appears to still be coming in.

With a good side angle shot, it would be easier to determine truer back conformation, tail angle and rear end, under line, tail length and width.
His main issue I obviously see is his lack of side shank and far toe feathers. Are his shanks/ feet a bit light, or is that a trick of the light?

I couldn't give any thoughts to who would be better shown without other angle shots.

Hopefully I haven't mucked this up... lol. Others with more experience can chime in and tell you details more accurately, and emphasis on leg/ foot feathers for showing. If I were going to breed either of them, I would definitely make sure the hen has decent leg feathering for balancing.

 

[Wynette]

They really aren't great pics to be able to provide much accurate feedback...One Chick Two has made some good points. To me, both male appear to be very short-backed. That, the halo, and the lack of shank feathering would be things, to me, that would deem both unuseable. There's just too much that needs to be worked on here. Sorry, just my opinion.

 

[Localheronow]

I'm pretty new at this, so take my evaluation with a grain of salt- but got to start somewhere, so I'll al least attempt to give this a whirl... The additional photos that Ihilani Coffee suggested will give the males shown the fairest evaluation.

I think these males are handsome, and look overall, pretty good.

Most BCM have issues of some sort.

Male 1:
Eye color looks just right. Ear muff is a bit dark, as it should be copper, but there appears to be some copper in there, so that is okay I believe- just as long as there is some copper. Nice, smooth, hairless, wrinkle free face. Don't believe there is any thumbprints in comb- at least from this side and angle. I think comb tines are correct if I count the tiny point correctly. Lower hackle has straw in halo. Is there black ticking edges at the bottom edge of hackle tips? (Don't know if that is actually there- and, it would be pretty minimal if it is.) Nice chest roundness, extending past beak. Nice front end width. He looks good sized to me. Bottom fluff hue looks nice and black- no brown fluff. Wing carriage points toward vent. Nice.

Mahogany on wing bow feathers still growing in, as are saddle feathers- which appear to be a very nice copper color. Is there any feather-edge black ticking on saddle feathers edges? This saddle should look nicely balanced when fully filled out. Is there some purple sheen on tail feathers? (Photos can produce artifacts and oddities that don't really exist in reality.)

Would need a side shot taken at chicken eye level to fairly evaluate his type/ back conformation, back length, rear view width- and tail angle and tail size. It's easiest when you can place the chicken close to your eye level and photograph them. (On a rock, step, etc.)

He does appear to have sparsely/ spotty feathered shanks- but maybe he might grow some more in, in time? (Not sure if leg feathers work that way.) As I understand it, the shank feathering should extend down in a straight line, down far outside toe only. Feathers should look a bit more like this male's foot feathers. (Sorry, he was pretty dirty, he had been grubbing in mud and muck with the hens.) Not as much as a Cochin feathering though.



Male 2:

Depending on what his back, rear end and tail angle really looks like from other angles, I may possibly like this male just a bit more... JMO.

His ear muff is slightly dark- like grey, but not black. The neck hackle looks much more even and balanced. Is his face clean? (Am I seeing shadows?) Again, I might be seeing a bit of black edge hackle ticking- on low feather tips, but only a bit. Chest looks wide, but with his angle chest thrust forward, toward us, and his rear away from us, we can't see his bottom line- looks a bit weak there from this angle. (The head-to-chest-to-abdomen line.) Mahogany red wing bows still growing in. Saddle coming in. Are there the black ticking on saddle edges again? (Again, could be lighting, and it would be very slight anyway.) Fluff is dark, and tail feathers have a nice beetle green sheen. Tail feathers appears to still be coming in.

With a good side angle shot, it would be easier to determine truer back conformation, tail angle and rear end, under line, tail length and width.
His main issue I obviously see is his lack of side shank and far toe feathers. Are his shanks/ feet a bit light, or is that a trick of the light?

I couldn't give any thoughts to who would be better shown without other angle shots.

Hopefully I haven't mucked this up... lol. Others with more experience can chime in and tell you details more accurately, and emphasis on leg/ foot feathers for showing. If I were going to breed either of them, I would definitely make sure the hen has decent leg feathering for balancing.

this cockerel is almost six months old what do you thing on this one 6.8 lbs.

 

[Ihilani Coffee]

this cockerel is almost six months old what do you thing on this one 6.8 lbs.

Nice green sheen, almost clear black chest. I'd like to see some hindquarter and a lower tail angle on this bird...there is no fore/aft balance as he is all front end. Personally I prefer the coppering to be a consistent color throughout and closer to the color on his wing than the yellow/gold hackle/saddle coloring shown here. We can't see his shank/toe feathering in these photos but I would not use him primarily for lack of balance.

 

[doubleleft]

Straight side-on, top, straight front and straight rear photos are more helpful to evaluate type from pics. None of that will help evaluate pelvic structure, etc. but photo evaluations are good when it's all you can get. Both of these look to have "No AssAtAll" disease but it could just be the camera angle appearing this way. The straight side-on photos will show balance or lack of it.

i could not help but to laugh out loud at your statement "No AssAtAll" disease ............ you broke me up !!!
I just had to go back and look and yes they were short ..... i'm thinking they were young birds 'maybe'(?) /////
Nothing like an eye opener ... i loved it .
Thanks

 

[Ihilani Coffee]

i could not help but to laugh out loud at your statement "No AssAtAll" disease ............ you broke me up !!!
I just had to go back and look and yes they were short ..... i'm thinking they were young birds 'maybe'(?) /////
Nothing like an eye opener ... i loved it .
Thanks

I have one myself...purchased with high hopes as a backup cockerel but he's headed for processing Wednesday.

 

[Sue1954]

Thanks for all the comments and replies. The tint on Delco is from the light angle, in real life it is copper. I will try to get some better angles shots from the rear, side and front and repost soon! Thanks again!

 

[Wynette]

this cockerel is almost six months old what do you thing on this one 6.8 lbs.

Hi, Local - this is odd, in the first picture, this K appears to have hackle that is too light; however, in the 2nd picture, it appears to be a bit darker. If his true-to-life coloring in the hackle is more like the first picture, I would definitely not use him. Also, his tail angle is much too high, almost "squirrel" per the first picture. However, he could have been on alert or upset in the first pic. He definite lacks good balance, and that will not improve with age. In addition, his wing carriage is too high; that's unusual, as well - most wing carriage issues that I see are much too low.

 

[Localheronow]

Hi, Local - this is odd, in the first picture, this K appears to have hackle that is too light; however, in the 2nd picture, it appears to be a bit darker. If his true-to-life coloring in the hackle is more like the first picture, I would definitely not use him. Also, his tail angle is much too high, almost "squirrel" per the first picture. However, he could have been on alert or upset in the first pic. He definite lacks good balance, and that will not improve with age. In addition, his wing carriage is too high; that's unusual, as well - most wing carriage issues that I see are much too low.

Thanks for the comments you are right this is my first bcm I have cull five or six others to keep this one still have work to do to find a good one I have one more in waiting still to young to tell.