Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[Chris09]

I was told by Peter at First State that Frontline is NOT absorbed through the skin, but Ivermectin is. Just fwiw.

Although it my be true that Fipronil (Frontline) isn't absorbed through the skin BUT when fipronil is exposed to light it can break down into a molecule that are called fipronil-desulfinyl.25 and fipronil-desulfinyl is also more easily absorbed through the skin than is fipronil.

Toxicity of Fipronil’s
Breakdown Products When fipronil is exposed to light it can break down into a molecule called MB4651324 or fipronil-desulfinyl.25 According to EPA, this breakdown product is about 10 times more toxic than fipronil itself. EPA bases this estimate on tests of acute toxicity, longerterm exposures, and a test of its ability to disrupt normal development. Fipronil-desulfinyl is also more easily absorbed through the skin than is fipronil.24 (See Figures 6 and 7.) All of these tests were sponsored by a fipronil manufacturer.

Also found this.
Fipronil is toxic to birds, lizards, fish, crawfish, shrimp, bees, and other animals. Minute concentrations (as low as
five parts per trillion) have caused adverse effects.

JOURNAL OF PESTICIDE REFORM/ SPRING 2005 • VOL. 25, NO. 1
Insecticide Fact Sheet
FIPRONIL
http://www.pesticide.org/get-the-facts/pesticide-factsheets/factsheets/fipronil

Chris​

 

[kathyinmo]

Quote:
I totally clear out my pens and spray with Permethrin concentrate. I use clean bedding (pine shavings) and spray that, too. I also use DE in bedding.

I use Ivermectin pour on. As a nurse, I know that oral absorption is variable, whereas parenteral (given by injection) administration assures high drug levels. Injectable drugs are “stronger” than oral drugs, and have more rapid onset of action. I don't understand how giving an injectable drug orally can even work. This is my understanding of medication routes:

The basic difference is that drugs intended to be administered orally must get through the stomach or in the case of birds, through the crop or proventriculus, where it is dosed with acid in order to render it digestible. In order to do that the drug is manufactured with an acid salt, such as hydrochloride salt, which allows it to get through into the intestine where it can be absorbed. Otherwise the drug is simply destroyed in the digestive process.

Drugs in the injectable form usually are made with an adjuvant, that is a substance which will provoke an immune reaction. The reaction of the immune system speeds up the assimilation of the drug and usually requires less. Common adjuvants are olive oil, etc. If you give an injectable form of drug orally, it would not likely survive the passage through the crop.

 

[vmdanielsen]

Material Safety Data Sheet states that fipronil is absorbed by the skin(say that fast 3 times!)


www.cdms.net/LDat/mpA7N001.pdf

 

[Chris09]

Quote:
I have always used Ivomec injectable orally on all my livestock and dogs. If you check around on line and with some of the livestock breeders you find they do the same.

For poultry -
5 to 7 drops orally for adult size birds.
3 to 5 drops orally for bantam size birds
Repeated every 2 to 3 months also worms them at the same time.

Since the mite will go through a generation in 7 days, it is necessary to re-treat the birds in 4-7 days to insure effective control. Some pesticides cannot be applied more often than once every 4 weeks or pesticide tolerances in the eggs will be exceeded.

Chris

 

[Robert Blosl]

Quote:
Crikey! I just checked First State Vet and they don't have it listed. Will give Peter a call later today and find out what the story is.

You can still order it from Canada. Here's a link.

http://www.blueskydrugs.com/Product/Frontline

Type Product Dosage Qty Price($USD)

Frontline 250 ml 1 $38.00
Subtotal: $38.00
Shipping: $10.00
Total: $48.00


Thanks Bill I just talked to the lady at the Canada Vet Pharmacy the product is coming out of Germany and will take about two weeks to get to me. If everything else goes good with this order I may order some more. I have used Adams for many years, but a very good friend of mine and my former Secretary with the Rhode Island Red Club tells me this is all he uses and it keeps the bugs off the chicken’s hind ends.
Thanks for your help everybody. Where there is a will there is a way. Seek and you shall find.

Well I am going outside and clean chicken pens in 95 degree heat. Will last about an hour then call it a day. Getting all my little bantams in their summer quarters so I can see who I will keep and who will go.

Put 8 bantams in a 8x8 pen then sit down in a chair and watch them and look at their leg bands and take notes. Seems to work for me.
Going Saturday to a friend’s house to look at Barred Rocks from Jeremy, New Hampshire Germany and half German and Half American birds from Doug from Indiana as well as his 20 Buff Orpington youngsters. A addend surprise will be two Cock birds and to Hens from my old Mohawk line of Rhode Island Reds that I sent a fellow 14 years ago. I saw the pictures of the birds the color is almost black and the male’s beaks are 99 percent dark horn. That is a indicator of strength in color of your standard breed reds. Wing color looks like it did years ago. This is the first time I have handled a large fowl Red in about ten years. This is the old Mohawk line I am talking about. I have them in the bantams. Will take pictures and post on my picture trail account for you all to see. bob

 

[Stevenson]

Just started reading this thread....loving it!

 

[NYREDS]

Quote:
I was told by Peter at First State that Frontline is NOT absorbed through the skin, but Ivermectin is. Just fwiw.

Here's what the Frontline website says:
"When you apply FRONTLINE, fipronil, the active ingredient, is stored in the oil glands under your pet's skin. It is then distributed continuously to the skin and hair of your pet through the hair follicles."

 

[catdaddyfro]

Quote:
Chris,
I have found Ivermectin simply does not work on Northern Fowl Mites. When I googled the topic, I found others said the same thing. Does Sevin work on them? Recently I dipped all my birds in Permethrin (easier than dusting with a large amount of birds, in my opinion). I repeated it 10 days later. That was a week ago, so I am hoping this works. I have sprayed every square inch of my coops, changed bedding (several times) and sprayed that, too. Honestly, I only noticed mites on one pen, but I am trying to be proactive and hoping to prevent any more and to get rid of those.

I found this article I thought was interesting.......
http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/poulsci/conference_proceedings/broiler_breeder/2003/stringham_2003.pdf
It says:
A relative handful of effective active ingredients are available for direct treatment of fowl mites in birds. These include carbaryl, permethrin, dichlorvos, malathion and tetrachlorvinphos.

The active ingredients in Frontline plus are fipronil and S-methoprene.
I have never tried Frontline myself, but I someone else said this:
Walmart now sells Pet Armour with the same active ingredient as Frontline but at a much cheaper price. Frontline (fipronil) is "the bomb" when you have a bad mite infestation.

The active ingredient in Sevin is carbaryl,

it's what I use for mite infestations has worked well for me, permethrin works well also. I just have Sevin on hand more than I do permethrin because I use it in my garden sometimes.


Jeff

PS You can get permethrin in dust form too if you'd rather use it than Sevin in the nest boxes which is where the majority of mites usually are found.

 

[Yard full o' rocks]

Here is some technical data on fipronil (active ingredient in Frontline)

The efficacy of Fipronil (Frontline (R)) against ectoparasites: control of lice, mites and mallophages in diverse small animals
Fri, 2007-02-02 15:01 — Vince Smith
Title The efficacy of Fipronil (Frontline (R)) against ectoparasites: control of lice, mites and mallophages in diverse small animals
Publication Type Journal Article
Year of Publication 2000
Authors Beck, CW
Journal Tier
Volume 55
Pages 244-250
Accession Number 37869
Keywords Fipronil; Otodectes ; Sarcoptes scabiei ; Cheyletiella ; Neotrombicula ; autumnalis ; Lynxacarus ; Trichodectes ; Felicola ; subrostratus ; Linognathus ; setosus ; Dog Diseases ; cat ; Trixacarus ; caviae ; Polyplax ; small ; mammal ; Mallophaga ; bird ;
Abstract Nineteen clinical reports on the efficacy of fipronil (Frontline(R) Spray and Spot On) against a number of external parasites in different species of small animals are reviewed. In addition to dogs and cats the preparation was successfully administered to guinea pigs, hamsters, rats, mice, budgerigars, pigeons and reptiles for the elimination of pest arthropods. Effective parasite was observed for Etodectes cynotis, Sarcoptes scabei, Cheyletiella yasguri, Neotrombicula autumnalis, Lynxacarus radovsky, Trichodectis canis, Felicola subrostraties, Lignognathus setosus, Trixacarus caviae Polyplax spinulosa, Polyplax serrata, Liperuus spp., Columbicula columbae and Campanulotes bidentus compar. Fipronil kills these parasites rapidly and with a durable effect, allowing lesions of skin and feathers to improve and reducing severe pruritis. Possible contraindications in animals species such as the rabbit, squirrel, hedgehog and Galliformes are discussed. Frontline(R) spray is also effective as an environmental decontaminant.

 

[Stevenson]

Wow...I have a lot of reading to do still! I've made it through the first 50 pages so far...