Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[NotAFarm]

Bob, Walt, Chris, and Kathy, could y'all please refrain from using your 100+ years of combined real life experiences, unless you are prepared to back it up with hardcore written evidence.

I think this number needs to be increased by at least another 50 years........Walt has about a 100 all by himself doesn't he?

 

[buffalogal]

Trust me, with the mice it is genetic. We have several strains all with the same environment and some have issues and some do not. There is lots of enrichment added to the cage so they are comfortable and can play. I am impressed with the answers about chicken genetics. Had no idea chickens were so complex. Still learning on that front though. Mice are used in research because they are not that complex. They breed quickly and are easier to ID certain traits on.

I'm aware of why mice are used in experiments, I was thinking about what effect life in a cage would have on how the animals reacts to stimulus. One could point to a McDonald's "playland" as an enriching and stimulating area for human children, and it's true that when they first arrive they clamber and climb and slide and have a wonderful time. However, if they had to *live* there, I think you'd see some pretty obvious boredom related behavior. Same question could be asked about poultry, though with a few notable exceptions even fewer people would spend five minutes considering it. Anyway, the point was that one man's "enrichment" could very well be another species tedium.

 

[Kiniska]

I'm aware of why mice are used in experiments, I was thinking about what effect life in a cage would have on how the animals reacts to stimulus. One could point to a McDonald's "playland" as an enriching and stimulating area for human children, and it's true that when they first arrive they clamber and climb and slide and have a wonderful time. However, if they had to *live* there, I think you'd see some pretty obvious boredom related behavior. Same question could be asked about poultry, though with a few notable exceptions even fewer people would spend five minutes considering it. Anyway, the point was that one man's "enrichment" could very well be another species tedium.

I see where you are going with that, but the worst problems we have are related to epilepsy and other obviously genetic issues that would not be caused directly by environment.

 

[punk-a-doodle]

I'd wonder if the behavioral problems are genetic or environmental; I can't think of anything that would be more maddening to an intelligent animal than the sterile environment of a cage.

The ones I mentioned are due to genetics (though genes of course can react with environmental factors). Generalized stress signs in mice tend to be things like barbering, patterned behaviors, fighting, etc. These too though can be more prevalent and/or occur regardless of environment in certain strains. In some strains things like over barbering are bred for to act as models for certain human conditions, so I tried to specify that the things mentioned previously were not intentionally bred in to the strain.

There are actually different branches of research, and the guidelines and general culture can differ quite a bit. At most universities, the shift has been towards greater enrichment and greater choice. This includes training animals to, say, offer a leg for blood tests in return for a treat versus using something like a squeeze chute. This too includes better environments for rats and mice, with a focus on removing signs of stress behaviors. At my place of work, the rodents are cared for better than most people's pets, so it is easier to see the differences in strains, and they can be quite stark indeed.

Fowlman, mammals can have structural and behavioral changes based on things like color and pattern as well. The fascinating study on domesticating foxes covered that a bit, and there was an interesting talk I recently attended about dogs that was on a similar topic that I will see if there is any online presence for.

And Kiniska, you totally got the transgenics right. Oh man, did you ever!

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People do not have to agree, of course. However, the rules promote maintaining a friendly and educational atmosphere, and I generally find this encourages better debate and opportunities to educate, whereas people can be turned off entire causes (ie. 'preserving heritage breeds') when points are too forcefully or rudely made.

 

[kathyinmo]

Here is a Speckled Sussex I saw that the show I was at this past weekend.

Great! Do you have more pictures from the show?

 

[ashandvine]

This guy came to visit my yard and I snapped a quick pic (through the window so I know it isn't great BUT) can I have a chime in on breed and type? Thanks.

 

[OSUman]

Silver Laced Wyandotte again from the show I was at this past weekend.

 

[OSUman]

New Hampshire

This guy came to visit my yard and I snapped a quick pic (through the window so I know it isn't great BUT) can I have a chime in on breed and type? Thanks.

 

[Yard full o' rocks]

This guy came to visit my yard and I snapped a quick pic (through the window so I know it isn't great BUT) can I have a chime in on breed and type? Thanks.

I can't speak to type as I am not up to speed on the breed, but looks like a New Hampshire to me. Kathy? Whatcha say??

 

[punk-a-doodle]

OSU, New Hampshire came to mind, but I am still very much learning my breeds!