Brahma Thread

[BGMatt]

I'm not really promoting hatchery birds, if you look back to where I started my Brahma project you would understand why I'm trying to get the two feed stores to carry some additional types of birds. I would like nothing more than to have the kids start showing high quality, breeder bred chickens. Unfortunately, first I need to get them off of the showing fighting stock and try to make sure that there is an ample supply of birds for them to choose from.

The only breeder that I am aware of in this area is one that I wouldn't even consider buying from. When a breeder has signs all over the place telling everyone to stay out, kind of makes me think about puppy mills. After visiting her facility, I can understand why she doesn't want anyone coming onto her place. It is probably the only facility that I've ever been to that I took my shoes and soaked them in bleach after leaving.

There are some nice breeders in the northern part of the state, and my hopes are that eventually I can be one of those breeders as well. Right now, I just don't have the stock to let any eggs or chickens go next spring. In the meantime, the next best option for the kids is to encourage the feed stores to carry some "different" birds, not just the standard barred rock, sex links and rhode island reds. I suppose I could just let them show nothing at all, or even just keep the fighting stock for showing (and fighting, although it is illegal now). Sorry I started such a heated debate, didn't mean to.

No not at all! Check out APA's site, call your district director, go to local shows, that's just how connections are done. Don't expect to do everything from behind a computer desk. Shipping birds is relatively inexpensive if you have to go that route. Never give up. Contact breed clubs and find out who is in your area. I've said it before and I'll say it a million more times, most of the best breeders are NOT on-line. There's a few, and then even fewer of those that can be found on this site, but breed clubs and shows are your most valuble resources for finding actual real breeders, and not just propagators. Edit: We do have some great enablers on here too, I just don't know many people down in the SW otherwise I'd be able to recommend someone.

 

[Tammy N]

Matt, you say its not a big deal but MG is a Disease that has carriers and not one to play with it is not like ILT or a comon cold .
since talking to you i have done much more research and when you just keep treating you do not get rid of the disease you only make it stronger ,

i do not get vaccines for myself my immune system is up but i have not caught a bacterium like Mycroplasma that has no shell.

 

[Tammy N]

http://umaine.edu/livestock/poultry/mycoplasma-gallisepticum-faq

Or
Mycoplasma gallisepticum: FAQ
Anne Lichtenwalner DVM PhD, University of Maine Cooperative Extension
MG (Mycoplasma gallisepticum) is considered to be the most problematic of the poultry mycoplasmal diseases. This FAQ aims to explain the mycoplasmas in general, this disease in particular, and why it matters to both small and large poultry producers.

• MG is a slow spreading infection, and often infected birds remain healthy without showing any overt signs of disease. Once other complicating factors — such as environmental stressors (elevated heat, ammonia levels, dust, or cold drafts), nutritional deficiencies, other infections (such as infectious bronchitis or laryngotracheitis virus) — lower immunity of the flock, MG may flare up as overt disease.
• MG adversely affects fertility, hatchability, and survival of baby chicks.
• MG will spread easily to other flocks on the farm, to neighbor’s flocks, to birds of different species, and to wild birds.

What are mycoplasmas? These are very tiny bacteria-like organisms that have less of a cell wall than do other bacteria. There are many species of mycoplasma, and many of them infect only certain animals. For instance, some cause no problems; some are associated with mastitis in cattle, some with respiratory disease in pigs, and some cause mild respiratory infections in wild birds. Some are very host-species specific; for instance, M. bovis infects cattle but not pigs. In contrast, some — like MG — can infect a number of different avian hosts.
What types of birds get MG? MG can cause problems in chickens, turkeys, ducks, geese, game birds, and even wild birds, such as finches.
Is MG a problem in people? No, this disease has not been shown to cause disease in people. However, other respiratory diseases of poultry — like avian influenza — are definitely a problem for people, so contact with birds that show signs of a “cold” or sinusitis (coughing, sneezing, runny eyes, swollen faces) should be limited. If you have sudden deaths in a flock for any reason, seek help from a poultry vet (or the state vet) and MINIMIZE CONTACT. Because of dust, bacteria, fungi, molds, and viruses such as influenza, it’s good to wear a mask while working with the birds. Also, wash hands well after being around the birds and use biosecurity measures (outerwear for barn use only, footbaths, etc).
What does MG infection look like? MG infection can look like many respiratory diseases, and often occurs with several other respiratory diseases, such as Infectious Bronchitis, Newcastle Disease, and/or with E. coli infections. A cough, loud breathing, swelling of the sinuses, and watery eyes are common signs. Decreases in feed intake, egg production or weight gain will occur. Males and also younger birds tend to be more affected, and the disease is worse in the winter months. While it tends to be a more serious disease in turkeys, chickens also will show losses.
How does MG spread? Transmission directly from bird to bird via respiratory secretions, or indirectly from contaminated dust, droplets or feathers, is common. Also, it can be spread vertically: from infected parent birds via the eggs. It can live for days to weeks depending on what kind of material is present: longer in chicken manure or eggs, shorter on clean, dry surfaces. Therefore, removing infected birds and cleaning well, followed by a “down” time for the chicken areas of at least a few weeks, is suggested. In a chicken house, water from unsanitary “drinkers” is the most important source of spreading the infection from bird to bird.
How do I know if MG is present in my flock? Diagnosis can be done via necropsy and culture of ill or dead birds, along with using a blood test to see if your flock has antibodies to MG. Just having antibodies does not mean you have a current problem with MG, but once birds have been infected with it, they may be able to infect other birds, even if they don’t look sick (“carriers”). An infected flock remains infected for life. Contact your veterinarian, or your state department of agriculture, to find out more about MG testing.
How do I disinfect if MG was in my flock? Freezing does not reliably kill MG outside of the host bird, but heat and drying do. Removing the infected flock, thorough cleaning and drying out of the house, and then disinfection with bleach or any of the commercially available products, such as phenolic compounds, should be effective. Leave the premises open (bird-free) for several weeks (hot, dry weather is optimal) before restocking with new birds.
Why should I bother to prevent MG? Because it can be an underlying cause of production losses, can combine with other diseases to kill birds, and can become chronically present in a flock due to “carriers,” it’s worthwhile to prevent MG.
How can I prevent MG in my flock?

1. Start with clean birds: The National Poultry Improvement Plan (NPIP) is one of the best resources to protect your poultry investment. Starting with MG-free birds, and keeping MG out of your flock with good biosecurity, is by far the best plan.
2. Good sanitation: Keep drinking water/drinkers and feeders clean. Outside runs should be on well drained soil and water puddles should be removed.
3. Simple is best: The more birds of different ages, breeds, and types are on the farm, the greater the risk of infection.
4. Keep it clean: Don’t let wild birds, or new birds of unknown (untested) background, bring MG into your flock. Net the top of coops to keep wild birds out; keep feeders contained and think carefully before you chose to do “free range” for your flock.
5. You may want to investigate MG vaccines, which can be given to young birds by spray or eyedrops, but which come in large-dose sizes (~1000 doses) and which may not be effective. These vaccines may not be allowed in Maine; check with the state department of agriculture.

Where can I buy MG-free chicks? There is at least one heritage hatchery and there are commercial hatcheries producing NPIP-certified MG-free chickens (this information may change; look at the NPIP website to be sure information is current). ASK YOUR SUPPLIER if the chicks are from an NPIP certified MG free hatchery.
Other helpful sites:
FAQ about MG from Washington State, which gives a nice summary of biosecurity practices for the small poultry producer:http://agr.wa.gov/FoodAnimal/AvianHealth/Docs/Mycoplasmagalliscepticum-website.pdf.

 

[Tammy N]

I have these photos of Patron and his son i kept before they got sick
Since john was clean of everything im asking opinions on Patron and His son




Above Patron and one of his 8 girls Now his son

4 months and 5 months old

 

[sadieh]

My daughter showed her Buff Brahma Bantam trio today, this was her first time showing and it was a very small local youth show. She was told that her rooster is DQ because he has a white feather in each wing. Actually one wing had 2. Otherwise he was good, the pullets won best feather leg and reserve feather leg, but we were told they could stand to be darker also they were the only feather legs there

. It was really good to get the feedback, and a great experience for her, although I thought she was going to burst out in tears when he said her rooster was DQ, but she was excited to get trophy's for her pullets. Anyways we need to find her a SQ Rooster/Cockerel to compliment her pullets. Since the pullets could stand to be darker should she breed them to a darker male? How do you find the DQ for the breed and the standard of perfection? Any SQ breeders in the OK area with extra roosters?

 

[Apdeb]

I have a rooster with same fault
I was told by the experienced people here it could be a "stress feather". Remove them and see what happens when they grow back !!! The best bb breeder near you is tim63 hes in texas i believe. My roosters white is on tip of right wing feather he is a Barnevelder i felt like a chump missing the feather but it happens i think the brahma sop is on their club website im not a member I bought mine from jackie Koetadich in belchertown mass
I am using them for broodys!!

 

[brahmabreeder]

May I just say that for the record if I was going to get bantam buff or light Brahmas I would get them from Tim (although he's in TX). Those birds are gorgeous! They could possibly be light from the sun but if not yes a darker male should help. Get the APA standard of Perfection for DQ's and the standard. Talking to breeders at shows can help a lot too. You could email your district officer, Dee and see what she says. I've never talked to her and have no clue what types she raises. http://www.americanbrahmaclub.org/club-officers.html

 

[Tim63]

I'm sure someone at the Shawnee show will have some Buff Bantams for sale. I'll be there but I don't really have any birds to let go of right now. That statement about the females being too light is simply that judges opinion. Even shade is what matters. In other words a nice EVEN shade of buff all over the bird. I have dealt with the white in male birds wing bow for a few years now. The male birds will show it...the females will not, BUT will pass it to their male off spring. You can look for a male without it to produce better males. If the DQd bird has superior type, he can be used to produce good show females. When you have a large enough flock built up, you can cull every single cockerel with that trait. I have done that in the past. I still have the occasional cockerel show up with the white. Also, as someone pointed out previously, there is a difference in stress white and genetic white. Typically stress shows up in the tips of primary and secondary wing feathers, while the genetic variety will show in the wing bows and bays. Don't be suprised if you get a new male bird and next years cockerels have the white. You will just have to cull it out over time. I'm sure Gary can explain this is proper genetic terms. I'm just sharing my experience. On another point NEVER base your breeding program on one judges opinion. I'll be at Shawnee if you would like to talk more about Brahmas. You can find me in the Brahma aisle!

Tim

 

[sadieh]

Thanks Y'all for the info, I love this BYC site. I'm pretty sure the white feathers are genetic and not stress feathers, they are in the wing bow and the right wing has 2 the left wing has 1 its the entire feather not just the tip

. dgibson has offered to give her a rooster when the weather here in OK clears up. This genetic stuff is really interesting lets see if I understand correctly, so if you breed a bird with the white feathers the cockerel offspring will show it but the pullets wont, but the pullets will pass it to their male offspring? Will all the offspring carry the gene, or a percent of them? At what age do you see it in the cockerel? If the hens carry the gene but don't show the defect then how would one find out if the hen is passing the gene? Should she breed her pullets to a rooster that does not show the trait and if the Cockerel offspring show the trait then we assume it is because of the hen?

 

[Tim63]

You could separate the pullets into two pens. Breed both to the the Cockerel you get from Don. Mark the eggs and wingband the chicks. You would be able to tell if the females were carrying the gene that way. I have sold birds to folks in Oklahoma that carry that gene/defect. I am always up front and explain the whole thing to them. The type of my birds is worth dealing with the minor color issues. I would assume your birds are at least partially from my line. I remember the specific male the issue started with. I culled every single cockerel out of him, AND him. It still crops up. Last year at Shawnee I showed about 9 K's, two with the white. The judge placed them 2 and four I think out of a class of twenty something Ks. I sold one to Derrell Fowler and one to Kyle Trip. Of course I explained it to them. The type was great. I have also sold to Steve Burkhart. I assume all three showed at Newcastle. I know Don bought a pullet off me a few years ago at Shawnee also. It will crop up, you just have to cull for it.

Tim