Bresse Chickens

[bayocum]

On another note, I was recently reading an article in the new Acres magazine (which is dedicated to poultry this month), and one of the authors made the statement that there's really no such thing as a dual-purpose bird. The claim was that it's either a good meat bird, or a good layer, but one bird can't be both. While I understand the author's point, I had to disagree. I have found our White Bresse to be excellent at both. They are great for meat, with excellent size and shape, and they are great layers, starting as early as 20 weeks and regularly providing large eggs. Of all the breeds we've raised, the Bresse seem to be a nearly perfect dual-purpose bird. Would you all agree?

 

[chiqita]

Just to clarify…it's not actually illegal to call them [COLOR=333333]La Bresse Gauloise, but the French claim that only birds raised in the Bresse region can be "true" Bresse.  Just like they claim that only sparkling wine from the Champagne region can be called Champagne.  So in the US people have taken to calling them American Bresse (Greenfire) and that name has stuck. Looking forward to learning from your experience Patsonline![/COLOR]

Except it is illegal to call sparkling wine from other areas champagnes. Look at the bottles. Same with burgendy and a lot of other wines and cheeses. They are protected terms like brand names. Im fairly sure la breese is a protected term.

Happy to be corrected if im wrong but I don't think I am. I see some good discussion coming!

 

[Bossroo]

On another note, I was recently reading an article in the new Acres magazine (which is dedicated to poultry this month), and one of the authors made the statement that there's really no such thing as a dual-purpose bird. The claim was that it's either a good meat bird, or a good layer, but one bird can't be both. While I understand the author's point, I had to disagree. I have found our White Bresse to be excellent at both. They are great for meat, with excellent size and shape, and they are great layers, starting as early as 20 weeks and regularly providing large eggs. Of all the breeds we've raised, the Bresse seem to be a nearly perfect dual-purpose bird. Would you all agree?

How does Bresse compare to the CornishX in converting efficiency of feed to meat in a very short time frame and volume of meat in that time period ? How does the Bresse compare to the commercial strains of the Leghorn in converting feed to eggs ? Please provide conclusive proof with a side by side published industry study to make a claim.

 

[bayocum]

Hi Chiqita,
This is a great discussion, well, for some people I guess ;-) Sorry, it's the attorney coming out in me. I'm not an expert in this area, but I have done some research and education over the years as a student of enology. So as I teach my business classes, there's really no such thing as "international law." There are a few laws that have some teeth, but most require the parties involved to submit to the WTO, etc, and believe it or not, when the WTO makes a decision (Brazil v US relating to cotton subsidies), the country that looses often thumbs its nose at the decision, and fails to comply (think, US losing). So the regulation in this country of the use of Champagne is not because France has created AOC's, which would make it illegal in France, but because in recent years we've signed trade agreements with France and so, if we want the benefits of those agreements, we don't infringe on the use of the word Champagne. So…as to the use of the term "La Bresse Gauloise," Frances desire to control the word is for all intents and purposes, irrelevant in the US, UNLESS, at some point a trade agreement is (or has been) signed with France under which the use of the word is prohibited. Again, this is my understanding of international law, the wine trade agreements, and how this would affect "La Bresse Gauloise." If you look at Greenfire's original info, I believe they say they "decided" to use the term American Bresse, not that they had to. If someone knows otherwise, let me know. Thanks for inspiring this process, it made me remember law school all over again ;-)
Best,
Brice @ SF

 

[juststruttin]

On another note, I was recently reading an article in the new Acres magazine (which is dedicated to poultry this month), and one of the authors made the statement that there's really no such thing as a dual-purpose bird. The claim was that it's either a good meat bird, or a good layer, but one bird can't be both. While I understand the author's point, I had to disagree. I have found our White Bresse to be excellent at both. They are great for meat, with excellent size and shape, and they are great layers, starting as early as 20 weeks and regularly providing large eggs. Of all the breeds we've raised, the Bresse seem to be a nearly perfect dual-purpose bird. Would you all agree?

Yes, I agree whole heartedly.

 

[piglett]

Yes, I am still here piglet .. and thank you for the nice welcome.

they are calling these birds "American Bresse" even though there is nothing American about them.

I need to cut some more trees down so i can have a proper pasture for my flock

I can then try raising a batch in the normal French manor

i did end up processing a hen who got her feet into freezing cold water

she got a bad case of frostbite & didn't look as though she was going to recover & be 100% again

my wife put her in the pot. the meat was much more tender than out buff orpingtons that we also raise

even though they all are on the same diet

 

[piglett]

How does Bresse compare to the CornishX in converting efficiency of feed to meat in a very short time frame and volume of meat in that time period ? How does the Bresse compare to the commercial strains of the Leghorn in converting feed to eggs ? Please provide conclusive proof with a side by side published industry study to make a claim.

It is tough to compare the 2 due to the fact that they are raised in a much different manor

in France Bresse are raised on pasture so the feed bill is almost zero

once they have grown to a point then they are moved to a building to be made ready for market

they are then feed milk & grain for a period of time (not sure how many weeks)

then they are processed.

so it's kind of like looking at apples & oranges they are just so different


The way i raise my English orpington roosters is also different from CornishX

my birds do take longer but when finished i have a product with almost no fat

& before they are even a year old they can weigh 10lbs

so i need less of them then if i went with CX birds

i also pay nothing for them due to the fact that they are left over from me hatching orpington pullets which i sell

 

[bayocum]

It is tough to compare the 2 due to the fact that they are raised in a much different manor

in France Bresse are raised on pasture so the feed bill is almost zero

once they have grown to a point then they are moved to a building to be made ready for market

they are then feed milk & grain for a period of time (not sure how many weeks)

then they are processed.

so it's kind of like looking at apples & oranges they are just so different

I would agree with piglett.

Do cornish X gain weight faster than AB? Yes. Do Leghorns lay more eggs than AB? Likely. But I think that sounds like an industry argument that misses the point. If we were to do a 5 year trial, closed flock, with birds raised in a natural environment, free-range with no GMO supplements, no antibiotics, in short, with as little input from man as possible, I think the answer would be quite different. For one, the cornishX would, if we were going purely by time-to-market weight, MIGHT win exactly ONCE, as long as they were able to avoid predation, find enough food, and survive. After that, they would not be capable of reproduction and therefor would be unsustainable, arguably one of the most important aspects of raising a flock for food. The Bresse on the other hand, would take longer to get to a market weight, but would provide eggs, hatch their young, live without artificial support and far out produce anything the CornishX could do in one generation. As for the Leghorn, there is a chance they would survive the entire 5 year trial, and might, under natural circumstances, have a chance of out-laying the Bresse, but you would be pretty hungry at dinner time. So, though both of those breeds, under artificial conditions, might outpace the Bresse in ONE area, neither would be a single solution, otherwise known as a dual-purpose bird. As for an "official industry study," I'll leave that up to others…while I go on raising Bresse

 

[Patsonline]

On another note, I was recently reading an article in the new Acres magazine (which is dedicated to poultry this month), and one of the authors made the statement that there's really no such thing as a dual-purpose bird. The claim was that it's either a good meat bird, or a good layer, but one bird can't be both. While I understand the author's point, I had to disagree. I have found our White Bresse to be excellent at both. They are great for meat, with excellent size and shape, and they are great layers, starting as early as 20 weeks and regularly providing large eggs. Of all the breeds we've raised, the Bresse seem to be a nearly perfect dual-purpose bird. Would you all agree?

I would certainly agree with that. I would stick my neck out here and say that ' La Bresse Gauloise' chickens are probably the best Utility fowl around. I am saying this because my pullets usually came into lay at 14 to 16 weeks of age, and killed out at 5lbs at 18 weeks, providing they were fed right. As a hobby breeder i wasn't into the meat side of things, i was however into producing good unrelated birds. I used to advertise my eggs on an Irish website, and endeavoured to send surplus eggs to any breeder that was willing to pay for the best and fastest postage available to me at that time. My original hatching eggs came via Germany they came airmail to me and took four days to arrive i rested them for 24 hours and then started the incubation. From 12 eggs i had five hatch.

 

[juststruttin]

How does Bresse compare to the CornishX in converting efficiency of feed to meat in a very short time frame and volume of meat in that time period ? How does the Bresse compare to the commercial strains of the Leghorn in converting feed to eggs ? Please provide conclusive proof with a side by side published industry study to make a claim.

Bresse will not stand up if you compare them to a hybrid meat bird that is processed at 8 weeks, nor a commercial hybrid production leghorns but neither of these breeds or hybrids are dual purpose. When you compare Bresse to other heritage dual purpose breeds they shine.