brooder over crowding?

[DavidFromGlenEden]

Hey miss K, I agree with the nipple drinkers but wouldn't the excess drops wet the mulch and eventually create more humidity? Is the cup nipple drinker hygienic? Perhaps less humidity but shared cup, bell drinkers aren't the best either in terms of contamination spreading through shared water. Shall I not worry as long as there's no poo in there, how about gizzard infection for example?

Where I'm trying to get to is which watering system best/hygienic in a brooder or any other environment?

Many thanks,

David

 

[aart]

Not sure if this will apply to quail but:

Here's my notes on chick heat, hope something in there might help:

They need to be pretty warm(~85-90F on the brooder floor right under the lamp and 10-20 degrees cooler at the other end of brooder) for the first day or two, especially if they have been shipped, until they get to eating, drinking and moving around well. But after that it's best to keep them as cool as possible for optimal feather growth and quicker acclimation to outside temps. A lot of chick illnesses are attributed to too warm of a brooder. I do think it's a good idea to use a thermometer on the floor of the brooder to check the temps, especially when new at brooding, later I still use it but more out of curiosity than need.

The best indicator of heat levels is to watch their behavior:
If they are huddled/piled up right under the lamp and cheeping very loudly, they are too cold.
If they are spread out on the absolute edges of the brooder as far from the lamp as possible, panting and/or cheeping very loudly, they are too hot.
If they sleep around the edge of the lamp calmly just next to each other and spend time running all around the brooder they are juuuust right!

The lamp is best at one end of the brooder with food/water at the other cooler end of the brooder, so they can get away from the heat or be under it as needed. Wattage of 'heat' bulb depends on size of brooder and ambient temperature of room brooder is in. Regular incandescent bulbs can be used, you might not need a 'heat bulb'. You can get red colored incandescent bulbs at a reptile supply source. A dimmer extension cord is an excellent way to adjust the output of the bulb to change the heat without changing the height of the lamp.

 

[chickens really]

I never set my temp to anything...I watch my Chicks and Ducklings and go by how they are acting..Little birds are tough and can handle cooler temps as long as they have an appropriate warm spot to sleep..Huddled up Chicks are cold chicks and then can suffer starve out because they do not eat enough..
I think the OP is getting the just of it now with understanding...Best wishes.

 

[DavidFromGlenEden]

I use the ceramic heat lamps as I had a few light bulbs that blew, they also have a 2000 hours lifespan as opposed to the ceramic ones that are made for reptiles ie meant to last for years without interruptions.

Does height of the heat light really matters? For example some companies offer heat plates for saving energy. I suppose having the heat light up 18 inches high allows to cater for more chicks.

About the broken beak incident, a fight can happen so quickly in a brooder or any other environment. Would the best water system be a nipple drinker with no cup? This would avoid any bacteria shared in a communal bell drinker say.

As per the huddling, I believe there would have been some tiny small drafts leading the chicks to either huddle under the light or in a corner.

Cheers,

David

 

[chickens really]

I use the ceramic heat lamps as I had a few light bulbs that blew, they also have a 2000 hours lifespan as opposed to the ceramic ones that are made for reptiles ie meant to last for years without interruptions.

Does height of the heat light really matters? For example some companies offer heat plates for saving energy. I suppose having the heat light up 18 inches high allows to cater for more chicks.

About the broken beak incident, a fight can happen so quickly in a brooder or any other environment. Would the best water system be a nipple drinker with no cup? This would avoid any bacteria shared in a communal bell drinker say.

As per the huddling, I believe there would have been some tiny small drafts leading the chicks to either huddle under the light or in a corner.

Cheers,

David

Drafts are no good ....A cardboard walled brooder in the coop holds in heat..

 

[aart]

Does height of the heat light really matters? For example some companies offer heat plates for saving energy. I suppose having the heat light up 18 inches high allows to cater for more chicks.

Height of lamp depends on what wattage the lamp is, why it's good to use a thermometer of the floor of brooder to 'test' the temp the chicks can feel.
Once you get to know your lamp and the chicks behaviors,
you don't necessarily need to use the thermometer-but it's still a good tool.

Lamps and plates heat differently.
Lamps heat the air and surfaces within it's range,
like the floor of the brooder and the chicks.
Plates are meant to heat by contact, the chicks must be able to touch their backs to the plate.

I've found ceramic bulbs to not spread enough heat a large enough area to be worth using. Very hot right underneath but cooling quickly as you move outward.

 

[DavidFromGlenEden]

Great feedback BYC, thanks for your support.

 

[aart]

@DavidFromGlenEden
saw this and thought of you...looks like good info on brooding quail:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/incubating-button-quail-eggs.1211703/#post-19290801

 

[lazy gardener]

All my brooders come with a thermostat tuned to different stages of their week of age. A bit crowed, yes, point taken, since the picture was taken I bought another ceramic lamp and separated the nursery brooder into two.

If your heat lamps are running on a thermostat, this is your problem. If the heat is cycling on and off, the chicks are pig piling when the heat goes off.

I agree with other posters that your chicks are too crowded. I have no idea what the spacing needs are for quail compared to chicken chicks, but... it's very important to have a warm space in the brooder with a foot print big enough that all the chicks can spread out in that heated area within the therapeutic temperature which meets their needs, neither too warm or too cool. The remainder of the brooder space needs to be much cooler.

As for the two chicks that had a broken beak, my strong suspicion was a fight for territory/pecking order.

I highly doubt that any kind of pecking order dispute among chicks can result in a broken beak. Looking at your set up, and knowing that you've had pig piling issues, I think the broken beaks are occurring when those beaks get caught in the 1/4" vertical wire in your brooder. Chicks are born with an innate ability to seek new and novel ways to commit suicide. If there is any thing in the brooder that they can possibly hurt themselves on, they will find it.

 

[DavidFromGlenEden]

Thanks Lazy Gardener, yes although the thermostat sounds like a good idea (in my mind) the oscillations of heat on and off did create heatwave leading the chicks to huddle/pile up either under the light or against the furthest corner.

When chicks/quails perhaps chicken beak fight, does the bottom/lower beak break? Additionally there was no other injuries, no poached eye, front facial blood, it was just the beak alone. So yes, getting their head stuck in the metal mesh is also a possibility. Possibly because they wanted to have more heat.

Thanks for your support

David