Look at my baby Wheaten Penedesenca everyone.
Calling all Penedesencas Owners/Breeders
- Thread starter josh44
- Start date
Victoria,
Glad to hear the rooster is going to work out for you. His sisters are proving to be very interesting. Great egg color, and I actually like their dispositions. Looks like there will be a few people working on blacks this coming year.
I am going to try for olive eggers both ways. I have an Ameraucana roo as well as the 3 Penedesenca roos, plus several Ameraucana hens, so we'll see what seems to work the best. I was at a Marans show this fall that was held in connection with the annual Wisconsin show. They had an egg color display, with an egg carton filled with olive eggs, and they were absolutely gorgeous. I was glad to see the display, because it confirmed for me that my darkest Penedesenca eggs are on a par with the darkest Marans eggs. So, the olive eggs should be pretty as well.
Glad to hear the rooster is going to work out for you. His sisters are proving to be very interesting. Great egg color, and I actually like their dispositions. Looks like there will be a few people working on blacks this coming year.
I am going to try for olive eggers both ways. I have an Ameraucana roo as well as the 3 Penedesenca roos, plus several Ameraucana hens, so we'll see what seems to work the best. I was at a Marans show this fall that was held in connection with the annual Wisconsin show. They had an egg color display, with an egg carton filled with olive eggs, and they were absolutely gorgeous. I was glad to see the display, because it confirmed for me that my darkest Penedesenca eggs are on a par with the darkest Marans eggs. So, the olive eggs should be pretty as well.
Blackhorsehill, do you ever sell eggs or chicks from your black Penedesenca?
Would you honestly consider them dual purpose? They're the other Pene variety I'm interested in.
Do you have pictures of your birds?
Would you honestly consider them dual purpose? They're the other Pene variety I'm interested in.
Do you have pictures of your birds?
Denise,
I'm thrilled to have Texas to finally be able to breed these Black Hens.
Jeremy,
There are too few Black Penedesencas around that are pure for being Black Penedesencas to even consider them as dual purpose at this point, it has taken me over a year to finally locate a Black cockrel to even breed that color of them, so mine won't be dual purpose at all, strictly for dark egglaying only.
Victoria
I'm thrilled to have Texas to finally be able to breed these Black Hens.
Jeremy,
There are too few Black Penedesencas around that are pure for being Black Penedesencas to even consider them as dual purpose at this point, it has taken me over a year to finally locate a Black cockrel to even breed that color of them, so mine won't be dual purpose at all, strictly for dark egglaying only.
Victoria
Jeremy,
I have been getting a lot of requests the last 2 or 3 weeks about the same thing. I haven't decided what I am going to do as far as eggs and/or chicks. I think it is still early for me as far as feeling good about what I might have to offer people. I have birds from 3 sources, but out of around 16 birds, I only have 5 that I am certain are pure black. The rest still have issues with things like red feathers from breedings with Partridge birds, some lay very light eggs, stuff like that. It might be 2012 before I feel confident in selling anything. I won't divide up breeding pens until it starts to warm up, so that is a ways off as well. Also, the end of October, my flock was exposed to Marek's disease. I had started bringing everyone into the barn preparing for winter before we realized what was going on, so at this point, my entire flock of around 50 birds has been exposed. I don't know what that means for the future. Eggs should still be ok, because the virus doesn't survive incubation, but as far as chicks or adult birds, I don't dare send out anything that might cause others to have problems. Luckily, I sold all my extra roosters before this all happened!!
As far as whether or not the black birds are dual-purpose------ In my so far limited experience, I have not seen any blacks that fit into that category. I know that the information on feathersite as well as the Storey's guide to poultry breeds states that the black birds are supposed to be for meat, however, I am not sure that the birds that were imported were in that category. If someone knows the history of what came into the country, and who imported them, stuff like that, it would be really interesting. There are apparently 2 different strains of black birds in other countries. If you do a lot of internet searching for Galle de penedes, you will find pictures of birds at markets in Spain that certainly look like Black Penedesencas. I think they are called Franquina, but I might be remembering that wrong. I don't have my information right in front of me to quote and for some reason can't find my bookmarked pages to link to.. Other websites, like the one in Ireland, show a very upright Leghorn type of bird. Then again, sites in the UK show a bird that is closer to the ground, and might be more of a dual purpose type.
I have one rooster that is chunkier and close to the ground, but is certainly not on a par with say, my Chanteclers who do seem to be dual purpose. We excessed out a lot of Chantecler roosters this summer, and they were decent eating size. The Pene roosters are pretty scrawny. I kept one rooster who is black/red mostly because he is just so darn beautiful, and he is very upright and fairly small. I have a young cockerel from Sandhill, and it looks like he is going to be pretty upright, more like the birds on the Irish website. The hens and pullets vary, depending on where I got them from. Most are fairly leghorn type, some more so than others, so matching them up with the roos will be interesting. I don't have any recent pictures, but again when it warms up I will start putting information on my blog. I should know better if the Marek's thing has turned into something sinister by then as well. I have a friend that has some of my birds, and her roo is just fantastic. I can get him back on loan if I need him, and he is chunkier and lower to the ground as well.
I will do another post and up load the few pics I have that are decent.
Denise
I have been getting a lot of requests the last 2 or 3 weeks about the same thing. I haven't decided what I am going to do as far as eggs and/or chicks. I think it is still early for me as far as feeling good about what I might have to offer people. I have birds from 3 sources, but out of around 16 birds, I only have 5 that I am certain are pure black. The rest still have issues with things like red feathers from breedings with Partridge birds, some lay very light eggs, stuff like that. It might be 2012 before I feel confident in selling anything. I won't divide up breeding pens until it starts to warm up, so that is a ways off as well. Also, the end of October, my flock was exposed to Marek's disease. I had started bringing everyone into the barn preparing for winter before we realized what was going on, so at this point, my entire flock of around 50 birds has been exposed. I don't know what that means for the future. Eggs should still be ok, because the virus doesn't survive incubation, but as far as chicks or adult birds, I don't dare send out anything that might cause others to have problems. Luckily, I sold all my extra roosters before this all happened!!
As far as whether or not the black birds are dual-purpose------ In my so far limited experience, I have not seen any blacks that fit into that category. I know that the information on feathersite as well as the Storey's guide to poultry breeds states that the black birds are supposed to be for meat, however, I am not sure that the birds that were imported were in that category. If someone knows the history of what came into the country, and who imported them, stuff like that, it would be really interesting. There are apparently 2 different strains of black birds in other countries. If you do a lot of internet searching for Galle de penedes, you will find pictures of birds at markets in Spain that certainly look like Black Penedesencas. I think they are called Franquina, but I might be remembering that wrong. I don't have my information right in front of me to quote and for some reason can't find my bookmarked pages to link to.. Other websites, like the one in Ireland, show a very upright Leghorn type of bird. Then again, sites in the UK show a bird that is closer to the ground, and might be more of a dual purpose type.
I have one rooster that is chunkier and close to the ground, but is certainly not on a par with say, my Chanteclers who do seem to be dual purpose. We excessed out a lot of Chantecler roosters this summer, and they were decent eating size. The Pene roosters are pretty scrawny. I kept one rooster who is black/red mostly because he is just so darn beautiful, and he is very upright and fairly small. I have a young cockerel from Sandhill, and it looks like he is going to be pretty upright, more like the birds on the Irish website. The hens and pullets vary, depending on where I got them from. Most are fairly leghorn type, some more so than others, so matching them up with the roos will be interesting. I don't have any recent pictures, but again when it warms up I will start putting information on my blog. I should know better if the Marek's thing has turned into something sinister by then as well. I have a friend that has some of my birds, and her roo is just fantastic. I can get him back on loan if I need him, and he is chunkier and lower to the ground as well.
I will do another post and up load the few pics I have that are decent.
Denise
Ok, here are a few pictures.
This is Ocho from this fall. Although he is all black, I know that there is some partridge in there.
This is one of my older pure black hens. I hope to get a lot of chicks from my original hens, as they are pure black, lay great eggs, lots of them, and are just in general what I would want for a Black Pene hen. The Sandhill pullets I have look very similar, but I think they are going to be larger.
This is my Sandhill cockerel and a pullet outside in the wind.
This is Bingo, my friend's roo, again, out in the wind.
Here is a link to a website about the Vilafranca del Penedes. I think this is how the black birds got the reputation for being meat birds. Very interesting reading if you start doing searches for Vilafranca del Penedes. http://www.discover-eu.com/black-roosters-and-dumb-ducks--.html
This is a quote from Ultimate Fowl Wikipedia.
"The Penedesenca is a breed of chicken originating in the Spanish province of Catalonia, in the area around Vilafranca del Penedès, which is the main town in the region known as "Penedès". It was developed in the first half of the 20th century from native barnyard chickens, and today is noted for producing copious amounts of very dark brown eggs, said to be among the darkest of any breed of chicken.
The earliest variety was the Black Penedesenca, which became standardized in 1946, when it was better known as the Vilafranca chicken. Today after they were almost existinct during the 80's then brought back, the Black, Crele, Partridge, and Wheaten colors exist (the Crele variety shows sexual differentiation at hatching, the males being light ash-grey and the females nut-brown in color). However, no variety has been accepted in to poultry standards. All members of the breed possess red earlobes with a white center, red wattles, and an unusual red comb. Called the king's comb or carnation comb, it is similar to a common single comb but has several lobes at the rear. The breed is rare among poultry fanciers in North America, but is a common breed in Central and South America. "
I am putting together a waiting list for anyone who might want hatching eggs, and will update everyone when I have a better feel for what is happening here this next year.
Merry Christmas everyone!
This is Ocho from this fall. Although he is all black, I know that there is some partridge in there.
This is one of my older pure black hens. I hope to get a lot of chicks from my original hens, as they are pure black, lay great eggs, lots of them, and are just in general what I would want for a Black Pene hen. The Sandhill pullets I have look very similar, but I think they are going to be larger.
This is my Sandhill cockerel and a pullet outside in the wind.
This is Bingo, my friend's roo, again, out in the wind.
Here is a link to a website about the Vilafranca del Penedes. I think this is how the black birds got the reputation for being meat birds. Very interesting reading if you start doing searches for Vilafranca del Penedes. http://www.discover-eu.com/black-roosters-and-dumb-ducks--.html
This is a quote from Ultimate Fowl Wikipedia.
"The Penedesenca is a breed of chicken originating in the Spanish province of Catalonia, in the area around Vilafranca del Penedès, which is the main town in the region known as "Penedès". It was developed in the first half of the 20th century from native barnyard chickens, and today is noted for producing copious amounts of very dark brown eggs, said to be among the darkest of any breed of chicken.
The earliest variety was the Black Penedesenca, which became standardized in 1946, when it was better known as the Vilafranca chicken. Today after they were almost existinct during the 80's then brought back, the Black, Crele, Partridge, and Wheaten colors exist (the Crele variety shows sexual differentiation at hatching, the males being light ash-grey and the females nut-brown in color). However, no variety has been accepted in to poultry standards. All members of the breed possess red earlobes with a white center, red wattles, and an unusual red comb. Called the king's comb or carnation comb, it is similar to a common single comb but has several lobes at the rear. The breed is rare among poultry fanciers in North America, but is a common breed in Central and South America. "
I am putting together a waiting list for anyone who might want hatching eggs, and will update everyone when I have a better feel for what is happening here this next year.
Merry Christmas everyone!
Texas is doing fine Denise, I have him inside with a few other select birds for the Winter, not taking any chances of anything happening to him.
My one Black Penedesenca Hen that beat herself up when I moved the birds to the coop and covered run was a mess to begin with, I think anyone else would have destroyed her, she couldn't even stand and pulled herself around by her wings, took almost 3 months for her to recooperate from what she did to herself, she's now up and standing and walking, so am thrilled she's getting around better, and figured it would be the Hen that was banded as being the darkest egglayer for something to happen to. I'll breed her first to Texas when the weather breaks and I can get them both outside in a breeding pen.
I got my first egg from my Crele Penedesenca pullet 2 days ago, and was happy to see that, darker on the point end than the ball end of the egg, and taking pictures of those birds is something else, I think I'll wait until I get them outside also in a breeder pen before trying that, I really like the color of my Crele cockrel too. That pair is also caged inside for the Winter.
I know whenever I do start getting chicks I'm going to handle them as much as possible to try and tone down the flightiness of the offspring for sure.
This last week only my Araucanas and my Penedesencas have been the birds laying eggs, so was happy I am still getting eggs, and glad the days should start getting longer now. My Bantam Marans pullets laid all summer long up until last week and then just stopped flat, so was glad to have eggs from the Penedesencas
I know Winter has only just begun and I'm already ready for Spring.
Victoria
My one Black Penedesenca Hen that beat herself up when I moved the birds to the coop and covered run was a mess to begin with, I think anyone else would have destroyed her, she couldn't even stand and pulled herself around by her wings, took almost 3 months for her to recooperate from what she did to herself, she's now up and standing and walking, so am thrilled she's getting around better, and figured it would be the Hen that was banded as being the darkest egglayer for something to happen to. I'll breed her first to Texas when the weather breaks and I can get them both outside in a breeding pen.
I got my first egg from my Crele Penedesenca pullet 2 days ago, and was happy to see that, darker on the point end than the ball end of the egg, and taking pictures of those birds is something else, I think I'll wait until I get them outside also in a breeder pen before trying that, I really like the color of my Crele cockrel too. That pair is also caged inside for the Winter.
I know whenever I do start getting chicks I'm going to handle them as much as possible to try and tone down the flightiness of the offspring for sure.
This last week only my Araucanas and my Penedesencas have been the birds laying eggs, so was happy I am still getting eggs, and glad the days should start getting longer now. My Bantam Marans pullets laid all summer long up until last week and then just stopped flat, so was glad to have eggs from the Penedesencas
I know Winter has only just begun and I'm already ready for Spring.
Victoria
I am very hands on with all our chickens, and feed treats most anytime I am out with them. This time of year, it is sunflower and safflower seeds in with their scratch. They also get some extra produce from the grocery store, or what we have left over from the garden, etc. This starts when they are young and have gone outside into their chicken tractors. The end result is a huge herd of begging birds when I go outside and they are out free ranging. It is pretty comical, but I think it has had good results in keeping the Penes from becoming wacko. I also hand feed the roos. It's not like I am going to pick them up like I do the Chanteclers, but the Penes gather at my feet and beg just like the rest. Some peck at my shoes and clothes.
I've noticed that the Sandhill birds are more likely to react violently, but I haven't spent as much time with them. With winter here, I am with them more, and they are getting better about not acting like the world will end if I look at them. I am feeding the roo by hand, and he is right there when I open the pen door. The 2 pullets are still standoffish. I had been bragging about how the Penes lay all through the Wisconsin winter, but mine quit a while back, and now I see most of them are molting. Not a good time of year, but I have reports from others in the area that their birds are doing the same thing, all sorts of breeds. I wonder if the mild fall had something to do with it. Generally, they are doing really well in handling the low temperatures. Just as well as the Chanteclers, although it looks like there is some frostbite on the roos combs. Very mild, though.
I'm ready for spring, but unfortunately, we do have January and February yet. yeck.
I've noticed that the Sandhill birds are more likely to react violently, but I haven't spent as much time with them. With winter here, I am with them more, and they are getting better about not acting like the world will end if I look at them. I am feeding the roo by hand, and he is right there when I open the pen door. The 2 pullets are still standoffish. I had been bragging about how the Penes lay all through the Wisconsin winter, but mine quit a while back, and now I see most of them are molting. Not a good time of year, but I have reports from others in the area that their birds are doing the same thing, all sorts of breeds. I wonder if the mild fall had something to do with it. Generally, they are doing really well in handling the low temperatures. Just as well as the Chanteclers, although it looks like there is some frostbite on the roos combs. Very mild, though.
I'm ready for spring, but unfortunately, we do have January and February yet. yeck.
i know of at least 3 ppl with blacks that have red in there neck feathers... what im wondering is could these not be breed together and end up with a brown red/black copper colored bird??? it just seams a loss to just cull these birds when the usa gene pool is so small... now im not saying to save them and sell tham as blacks lol but as a new color...
Elias,
That is exactly what I plan on doing. I have my pure blacks, and these black/reds that are absolutely gorgeous, and lay just as well, and generally speaking they seem to lay the darker eggs. Seems like one could end up with pure black at some point out of these as well in time. So, I'm not personally worried about having these red/black birds, but would suggest it as a potential "new" color for the future. It would be unethical to sell them as pure blacks, but if people didn't care about the feather color so much as the egg color and other qualities the Penes have, I guess why not work on them as another color pattern? Just need to be honest, and let people know what they are getting. I have had some email conversations with others that have the black/reds, and they have commented on how beautiful the birds are.
Here is a picture of the red/black rooster I kept.-- Rufus Dufus -- I had a few others, but either sold or gave them away. I liked this one the best, mostly because of his personality. He has a lot more red than the others as well. His tail grew in slowly, as did the black rooster I kept, for some reason. There are a few Pene hens and a few Chantecler hens with him in this picture.
Since I'm into pictures right now, threw in this one of eggs I was getting in November. Obviously, the blue and pink ones are NOT Pene eggs.
When I was at the Marans show, I looked at the Black Coppers, and my thought was Hmmm Looks just like my black/red Penes. I know they are developing other colors in the Marans, and I think it is common in other breeds, so why should the Penedesencas be any different? I believe that they started as a land race, with ill-defined colors originally, and the 4 colors that are standard overseas were developed from the land race. As far as the blacks being meat birds, I just don't think those exist in the US. I think Josh had someone who was going to do translations of the Catalonian websites. If you are our there Josh, did this ever happen? If so, could that information be made available? Maybe that could shed some light on the mystery in that regard.
Glad you brought this up, as I think it is worth bringing to light. I know there was a lot of activity last winter, as far as organizing a club and all, but I think everyone got busy and that fell apart? Now with Christmas almost over, maybe some more organizing could be done over the winter.
Denise
That is exactly what I plan on doing. I have my pure blacks, and these black/reds that are absolutely gorgeous, and lay just as well, and generally speaking they seem to lay the darker eggs. Seems like one could end up with pure black at some point out of these as well in time. So, I'm not personally worried about having these red/black birds, but would suggest it as a potential "new" color for the future. It would be unethical to sell them as pure blacks, but if people didn't care about the feather color so much as the egg color and other qualities the Penes have, I guess why not work on them as another color pattern? Just need to be honest, and let people know what they are getting. I have had some email conversations with others that have the black/reds, and they have commented on how beautiful the birds are.
Here is a picture of the red/black rooster I kept.-- Rufus Dufus -- I had a few others, but either sold or gave them away. I liked this one the best, mostly because of his personality. He has a lot more red than the others as well. His tail grew in slowly, as did the black rooster I kept, for some reason. There are a few Pene hens and a few Chantecler hens with him in this picture.
Since I'm into pictures right now, threw in this one of eggs I was getting in November. Obviously, the blue and pink ones are NOT Pene eggs.
When I was at the Marans show, I looked at the Black Coppers, and my thought was Hmmm Looks just like my black/red Penes. I know they are developing other colors in the Marans, and I think it is common in other breeds, so why should the Penedesencas be any different? I believe that they started as a land race, with ill-defined colors originally, and the 4 colors that are standard overseas were developed from the land race. As far as the blacks being meat birds, I just don't think those exist in the US. I think Josh had someone who was going to do translations of the Catalonian websites. If you are our there Josh, did this ever happen? If so, could that information be made available? Maybe that could shed some light on the mystery in that regard.
Glad you brought this up, as I think it is worth bringing to light. I know there was a lot of activity last winter, as far as organizing a club and all, but I think everyone got busy and that fell apart? Now with Christmas almost over, maybe some more organizing could be done over the winter.
Denise
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