Can a chick that comes from a brown egg lay blue or green eggs?

[artvandolay]

Hello,

I had a barnyard mix with some EE, but the blue eggs were cracked so I tossed them. I am wondering if one of the brown eggs could have possibly had a gene that passed on the blue eggs trait even if they hatched from a brown. Is this possible?

TIA

 

[Lady of McCamley]

The answer to that is yes....or no...it depends on your genetics of the parents.

Blue eggs are caused by the oocyan gene (that causes bile to be thrown into the shell gland to produce blue shells). It only takes one oocyan gene to cause blue shells.

Brown shells are caused by a hemoglobin wash applied as the egg travels down the egg duct. It literally is a reddish brown (iron based) tint applied to the shell. Brown wash over white shell (no oocyan gene) produces brown tints of eggs. Brown wash over blue shell produces green tint eggs. Dark enough brown wash over blue shell produces olive shell eggs. There are about 13 genes that control the brown wash application, so it varies as to how much of that is passed along to the offspring. I typically find that if a I breed a dark brown line to a light brown line I get offspring with a middle brown egg...but it varies.

We can tell from the brown shell egg that momma did not have the oocyan gene, so she did not carry the genetics for a blue shell. She won't be passing anything along that way. However if she is bred to a rooster who does carry the oocyan gene, she could have offspring that lay green eggs. Here's the breakdown

Dad has only 1 blue shell gene....momma has none....50% of the chicks could have green eggs (with 1 blue shell gene from dad and some brown wash from mom) and 50% of the chicks could have brown tone shells (did not inherit dad's 1 blue shell gene, left with whatever brown genes from dad and brown genes from mom).

If dad happens to have 2 blue shell genes...then 100% of the chicks will inherit 1 blue shell gene applied with mom's brown shell genes (and whatever dad has), and you will get shades of green to olive.

Wait until the daughters lay eggs, breed the green shell daughters back to dad (since now you know he has at least 1 blue shell gene), and you begin to set your green/blue line...25% will have 2 blue shell genes, 50% 1 blue shell gene, 25% no blue shell gene.

It's a lot of fun.

Good luck on your turn out.

Lady of McCamley

For fun here's a photo of my lines as I was setting color:

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Thanks, I am going to have to read your explanation and look into this again. I would only keep one or 2 roosters. I am hoping either to keep and Australorp from a separate clutch or and Erminette from another clutch. If I get a hen that lays blue or green eggs, I was hoping I could keep that one and then perhaps breed it with one of those two roosters.

I just didn't know if I could have any with the genes for green or blue eggs. These are the combinations it could be but none of the actual blue eggs were incubated.

Marans, Old English Orpington, Olive Eggers, Easter Eggers, Brahma, Dominique, Plymouth Rock
I think I have at least two easter eggers that hatched but they were in brown eggs.

If you hatch brown eggs with hens bred to Australorp or Erminette, you'll only get brown layers.

If you hatch blue/green eggs from hens bred to Australorp or Erminette, you'll get 50% blue/green layers and 50% brown layers. You will have to only set blue eggs if you want to keep your chances of getting blue/green if you use brown layer rooster lines.

LofMc

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Pure breeds just help us know what the genetics are without surprises. Of your chicken choices, only the hybrids of Olive Egger and Easter Egger will have a chance to have a blue shell gene (as they are hybrids of blue shell layers...either Cream Legbars or Ameraucanas or Araucanas typically).

The further you breed away from the blue shell lines, the greater the chance you will breed out your blue layers especially if you are setting brown eggs. Why? Because you KNOW that the hen didn't carry the blue shell gene as she was laying a brown egg. That means the rooster will have to have the blue shell gene. Since he doesn't lay eggs, the only way you can figure out his genetics is by testing him over brown layers to see if you ever get a blue/green layer. That's time consuming obviously...and if he is a hybrid, he probably has at best 1 blue shell gene (if he came from a pure bred blue shell layer and a pure bred brown layer). The further your generations out with the rooster, you soon get no blue shell gene.

So you have to test your rooster to see if he carries the blue shell gene otherwise only set and hatch blue shell layers to keep your blue shell line going otherwise you'll soon breed out the blue.

LofMc

 

[Lady of McCamley]

I figured if they were both brown I would only get brown unless there was some gene that maybe made it?

If I get a blue/green laying hen from this clutch and then use one of those I figure I could get some future blue/green layers. What do you mean set?

Hen with brown egg has only brown genes...NO blue shell gene. Hen lays brown egg bred to a rooster who carries a blue shell gene (assume 1 if he is a hybrid) will have 50% chance of laying blue/green eggs as 50% chance of inheriting the 1 blue shell gene....which is dominant...you only need 1 blue shell gene to get blue shells.

If you KNOW your rooster carries a blue shell gene, you can set (as in place into incubation or under a broody for hatching) brown eggs knowing you have 50% chance of brown and 50% chance of blue. Hatch blue from those daughters, bred to a blue shell gene rooster, you begin to increase your likelihood of getting blue layers).

However if your rooster choices are brown layers, it means you will at most have 50% chance of getting blue only if you set blue eggs. If you set brown eggs you will only get brown layers as there is no blue shell to be passed from either mother or father.

LofMc

 

[Lady of McCamley]

It can be any one of these: Marans, Old English Orpington, Olive Eggers, Easter Eggers, Brahma, Dominique, Plymouth Rock

The only way the chicks will grow into blue/green/olive laying hens will be if the rooster was an Olive Egger or Easter Egger if all the others are pure breeds.

And that is likely 50% chance as most OE and EE have only 1 blue shell gene to pass.

LofMc

 

[Lady of McCamley]

Ah, so the dominant gene only comes from the Rooster and a blue-laying hen. No brown-laying hens will have the gene then?

I guess I would have to have a rooster that had that gene, but I would only know if I start breeding it with a blue-shelled hen.

To have blue shell eggs either the hen (mother) or the rooster (father) must have the genetics for blue shells. (Chickens, like humans, are diploid meaning every trait has 2 genes that control that trait. In chickens, blue shell is controlled at one slot of 2 genes. Since blue is dominant, you only need 1 of those 2 genes at that slot to get blue shells).

You can breed a blue shell hybrid rooster (meaning he only has 1 blue shell gene) to a brown laying hen and get SOME blue laying daughters...typically statistically 50% as 50% of the time he passes his 1 blue shell gene and 50% of the time he passes that empty slot with no blue shell gene.

The only way to test an Easter Egger or Olive Egger rooster is to set him over brown or white layer and check the daugthers. If you hatch 10 daughters, statistically 5 of them will become blue shell layers while 5 of them will be brown layers.

If you set an unknown blue shell gene rooster over a blue layer hen, you won't know who passed the genes as you KNOW the hen has at least 1 blue shell gene. The rooster could have no blue shell genes.

If you want to get and keep blue shell layers, only set blue eggs, or only breed from a rooster you KNOW has blue shell genes.

Hope that makes sense now.

LofMc

 

[artvandolay]

Did you just get these hens from someone else? I dont understand how they might have been bred

Yes, this first clutch was a barnyard mix of the mentioned breeds, some pure and some mixed.

I added a few Australorps to that clutch.

Then I got another clutch of eggs that are Erminette and Mille Fleurs, but these are 4 weeks younger and just hatched last week.

 

[artvandolay]

It is possible depending on what genes the chicken has. Who are the parents?

It can be any one of these: Marans, Old English Orpington, Olive Eggers, Easter Eggers, Brahma, Dominique, Plymouth Rock

 

[artvandolay]

The answer to that is yes....or no...it depends on your genetics of the parents.

Blue eggs are caused by the oocyan gene (that causes bile to be thrown into the shell gland to produce blue shells). It only takes one oocyan gene to cause blue shells.

Brown shells are caused by a hemoglobin wash applied as the egg travels down the egg duct. It literally is a reddish brown (iron based) tint applied to the shell. Brown wash over white shell (no oocyan gene) produces brown tints of eggs. Brown wash over blue shell produces green tint eggs. Dark enough brown wash over blue shell produces olive shell eggs. There are about 13 genes that control the brown wash application, so it varies as to how much of that is passed along to the offspring. I typically find that if a I breed a dark brown line to a light brown line I get offspring with a middle brown egg...but it varies.

We can tell from the brown shell egg that momma did not have the oocyan gene, so she did not carry the genetics for a blue shell. She won't be passing anything along that way. However if she is bred to a rooster who does carry the oocyan gene, she could have offspring that lay green eggs. Here's the breakdown

Dad has only 1 blue shell gene....momma has none....50% of the chicks could have green eggs (with 1 blue shell gene from dad and some brown wash from mom) and 50% of the chicks could have brown tone shells (did not inherit dad's 1 blue shell gene, left with whatever brown genes from dad and brown genes from mom).

If dad happens to have 2 blue shell genes...then 100% of the chicks will inherit 1 blue shell gene applied with mom's brown shell genes (and whatever dad has), and you will get shades of green to olive.

Wait until the daughters lay eggs, breed the green shell daughters back to dad (since now you know he has at least 1 blue shell gene), and you begin to set your green/blue line...25% will have 2 blue shell genes, 50% 1 blue shell gene, 25% no blue shell gene.

It's a lot of fun.

Good luck on your turn out.

Lady of McCamley

For fun here's a photo of my lines as I was setting color:


View attachment 3480737

Thanks, I am going to have to read your explanation and look into this again. I would only keep one or 2 roosters. I am hoping either to keep and Australorp from a separate clutch or and Erminette from another clutch. If I get a hen that lays blue or green eggs, I was hoping I could keep that one and then perhaps breed it with one of those two roosters.

I just didn't know if I could have any with the genes for green or blue eggs. These are the combinations it could be but none of the actual blue eggs were incubated.

Marans, Old English Orpington, Olive Eggers, Easter Eggers, Brahma, Dominique, Plymouth Rock
I think I have at least two easter eggers that hatched but they were in brown eggs.