Can someone please make a Pea color chart............

[deerman]

All silver pied are white eye.

cant be barred wing and solid wing, or pied and silver pied . looks like 3 patterns most on one bird.

Blue can be split to any color, but recessive color cant be, all the other colors are recessive.

 

[deerman]

patterns barred wing is dominant others are recessive except white eye.

 

[Kedreeva]

Ok, so let me see if I have this right... and I will post the outlined chart when I am done...

Blue can be split to any color... but no other color can be split to another. So blue split anything, but no purple split anything or white split anything... BECAUSE blue is dominant color. Right?

Pied and silver pied mutually exclusive... barred and BS mutually exclusive... silver pied and white eye mutually INclusive.

For pattern splits...
BW split BS
BW split pied
BW split SP (which would mean WE?)
BW split WE (not SP though)

Can any other patterns be split? Like... BS split SP? Let me chart out what I have and I'm sure I will have more questions... thank you for being patient

 

[Kedreeva]

PeafowlColors.xlsx - 26.63 KB

Ok so here is the blank excel sheet with the possible colors along the top and one side.... let me know if I missed any if you can. I still have to fill out the sex linked ones along the left edge for male and female, I just didn't have time yet.

So my questions in order to fill it out-

1) Will every pure color bred to its own color (no splits obviously) always breed true to the color?
2) Say there is a sex linked color (let's say purple). Will purple bred to purple (no splits), breed true? Or will only 1 gender show the color in this case?
3) For sex linked colors: If the dad is the sex linked color (say purple) bred to another color (say blue)- which gender of the babies shows the color? What about if the mom is the color instead?
4) For sex linked colors: Do all other colors behave the same when bred to sex linked? What I mean is, if a blue is bred to a purple, one gender shows up purple the other blue... but what if you bred a purple to an opal? Would one gender be purple and the other gender opal? Or would one still be purple and the other be blue split something since opal is recessive?
5) For splits, what are the percentages of colors in offspring if each parent is split the same color? What if the parents are split to different colors? For instance, blue split bronze bred to blue split opal... are the kids all blue split opal and bronze? Is that even possible? My chart will need editing if it is @.@
6) What DOES happen when you breed two colors that are not blues? Like, if you bred a bronze to an opal?

I'm sure I will think of other questions... trying to wrap my head around this genetics thing as best I can.

EDIT: Ok, I am assuming the barred wing pattern acts like the india blue color and is the only one that can be split to patterns. So here's what I have for pattern combination... please tell me if I missed any (or if I messed up and certain combinations are... UNPOSSIBLE!) so I can make a chart outline.

Barred Wing
Barred wing silver pied (meaning white eye too)
Barred wing white eye
Barred wing pied
barred wing pied white eye
Barred wing silver pied (meaning white eye too) split Blackshoulder
Barred wing white eye split BS
Barred wing white eye split BS silver pied (?? I guess this would mean it displays white eyes but doesn't display silver pied?)
Barred wing pied split BS
Barred wing pied split BS white eye
Barred wing pied white eye split BS
Barred wing split BS
barred wing split BS silver pied (meaning white eye)
Barred wing split BS pied
Barred wing split BS pied white eye
Barred wing split SP (meaning white eye)
Barred wing white eye split SP (Would this be the 'dark pied' bird thrown from silver pied pairings?)
Barred Wing split white eye
Barred wing split pied
Barred wing split pied white eye

Blackshoulder
Blackshoulder silver pied (meaning white eye by default)
Blackshoulder pied
Blackshoulder pied white eye
Blackshoulder white eye

Where does the 'white' color fall in terms of pattern? Do they still carry these things but not display any of them because of the alleles that cause the white coloration?

 

[ChooksChick]

Have you seen this? http://www.leggspeafowl.com/upavarieties.htm

 

[Kev]

Blue is always Dominant

Blue is the whole phenotype, not one gene or a specific gene. It's incorrect to call "blue" dominant, because it's the whole bird(all of its genes) and a mutation is one gene, not the whole bird. Instead, the mutant gene is what gets labeled 'dominant' or 'recessive'.

Kedreeva:

A lot of these questions really are basic genetics related, not specific to peafowl. Would suggest a basic general genetics page.. The "rules" are pretty similar across species- pea genetics goes the same way it does for peafowl genetics. It seems confusing but in reality peafowl genetics are incredibly simple. (chicken genetics far more complicated due to hundreds of mutations) Learning basic genetics will make it much easier to understand peafowl genetics.

Recessives always breed true, when pure. Example: opal is recessive.. Therefore every visually opal bird is pure for opal. So, opal x opal always 100% opal. Same for purple(a recessive sex linked gene and yes purple male x purple hen always 100% purples).

So far, only white and pied are said to be alleles. Which means any bird can be split for anything else.. the only exceptions are pure pied cannot be split for white and pure white cannot be split pied. A single Blue can be split for black shoulder, opal, bronze, pied(or white). There's no real limit.

That is the reason it's simply much easier when answering somebody's question, to assume the blue they have is pure blue and their black shoulder is not split for anything.. otherwise you will have to write pages long answer. This is the normal standard in any genetics discussion.

Bronze x opal= blue looking birds. This an example why it's not a good idea to say "blue is dominant". Opal affects only one gene, while bronze affects only one and a different gene. Bronze is wild type for the opal gene and opal is wild type for the bronze gene.. both are recessive.. so the result is blue.

question #5 is also basic genetics question.. and where Punnett squares come in. Punnett squares are very very useful in understanding what sort of results to expect from crosses like that.

White has been labeled a pattern by peafowl people. All the White gene does is "prevents any color or pattern the bird HAS from being visible". Have a black shoulder purple white eye bird in front of you. You can see those colors and white eyes on that bird plainly, right? Now take a bucket of white paint and pour it over the bird. Now it's "all white".. but you KNOW it's a BS purple WE... except you can't see that anymore. That's what the White gene does. It's not a color, nor does it "get rid of whatever color genes is present".




p.s. personally I consider the term "barred wing" unnecessary. it's the wild type.. the default. So it can be left out, for example if talking about a purple, one assumes it is a "barred wing purple".. UNLESS, "black shoulder purple" is said then you know it is not a "barred wing". Black shoulder is a mutation.. it's habit to list the mutations, not the wild type in general.​

 

[deerman]

Kev, i agree about the blue , barred wing and the white.

White is not really a color ,but an absent of color. Yes it does mask other colors and patterns.

Also agree that it understood if pattern is not listed ,its a BARRED WING.

Myself if you learn the bascis, its easy to know what each pr will produce.

Think what really blow people away is when they hear 225 variety.

Just 12 colors and 5 patterns, heck think variety bred so far is just little over 110.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Kev]

No problem- great to see you contributing here too. Starting to see 'blue is dominant' more and more lately.. that needs to be stopped before it runs off and becomes used way too much. Genetics is hard enough for many to learn as is, no need to add in confusing terms and wrong concepts.

I find a little irony in those barred/solid wing names, because it's almost the reverse in females.. blue hens have solid wings.. bs hens have uh.. not solid wings..

 

[deerman]

Quote:
Yes most colors and pattern are name after the peacock ,not the peahen,except silver pied. (hen has silver backs)

Male blackshouder have solid color shoulder, reason they need call solid wing , as BS purple,cameo,peach have brown shoulders, opal,charcoal have grey color shoulders.

Just look at a blue peahen she has green neck feathers NOT BLUE.

 

[Kedreeva]

Oh, I've tried to learn some on genetics, I'm just really bad at it.

So then my last question, I think.... if you have a blue split white... kids would be blue, blue split white, and white? Same goes for all splits... blue, blue split the color, and the color (assuming the splits are the same)... and if they are different it'd only be blue and blue split? Or are there no pure blues from any of them?

Sorry for all the questions... like I said, I'm really bad at it and I'm trying my best to understand.