Can't find an answer - share raising

[debir1966]

I have tried several different wordings to try and find an answer to my question, but google has not been able to decipher what I am trying to ask!

When I was a kid, my parents raised two pigs, one for our family to butcher, and one for my uncle to butcher. The agreement was that my parents would provide the facilities and labor for both pigs and my uncle would provide the feed for both pigs. Each person bought their own pig and paid for their pig to be butchered, vet costs were split for regular prevention, but each person paid for their pigs individual vetting if it was needed.

Presently, I am living on a small farm and planning on raising my own meat chickens. My cousin has shown an interest in doing a share raising deal, but I want to make sure it is fair to both of us.

The above story for the pigs sounds fair, but back then the cost of feed was quite a bit cheaper (yeah, I am 45 LOL). Nowadays the cost can be very prohibitive.

Using the data supplied by DianeS:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DianeS

All the meat chickens are in the fridge/freezer, and I have done up my numbers (cost, poundage, etc) to share. (Sorry for the formatting stuff, it looks fine in the edit screen, but obviously not so fine when it's live.)

In March we purchased 4 Rhode Island Red day-olds and 2 Americauna day-olds. So the costs for the heating lamp, feeder, and waterer belong to those chicks. We also purchased 25 Cornish Rock cross day-olds, and the additional feeders to support those.

Cornish Rock chicks 25 $1.49 $37.25
RIR chicks 4 $2.49 $9.96
Ameraucana chicks 2 $2.99 $5.98

$53.19 Cost of chicks

PRODUCT COST cornish-only?
Waterer $4.99
Feeder $8.99
Sav-a-chick powder $2.99
Heat lamp $20.00
white feeders $1.98 $1.98
Emergen-C $4.00 $4.00
Electricity ?
Water ?

$42.95 Product costs for chicks $5.98 Product costs for Cornish alone

Deaths in the first week included 1 RIR, 1 Americauna, and 4 Cornish, bringing my total to 25 birds. For the 9 weeks I grew the Cornish, I spent $170.71 on feed.
PRODUCT WEIGHT COST
Chick Starter 18% 50 $15.99
Chick Starter 18% 50 $15.99
Flock Raiser 20% 50 $21.20
Meat Chicken 22% 40 $14.51
Meat Chicken 22% 40 $14.51
Meat Chicken 22% 40 $14.51
Meat Chicken 22% 40 $14.51
Meat Chicken 22% 40 $14.51

350 $125.73
$0.359 per pound of food at 8 weeks

Organic 20% 40 $22.49
Organic 20% 40 $22.49

430 $170.71
$0.397 per pound of food at 9 weeks

The chickens were butchered over a four day period, but the days were not consecutive. Two chickens weren't done until they were 10.5 weeks. Carcass weight includes bones, I took all the chickens down to plucked or skinned whole birds.

Date Processed Live Weight Carcass Weight H/R (Hen or Roo)

5/16/2012 5.33 4.00 H
5/16/2012 5.33 4.25 H
5/16/2012 5.33 4.00 H
5/16/2012 8.00 5.50 H
5/18/2012 6.00 4.50 H
5/18/2012 6.00 4.50 H
5/18/2012 7.00 5.00 H
5/18/2012 5.50 4.00 H
5/18/2012 7.50 5.50 H
5/18/2012 9.00 6.00 R
5/18/2012 8.00 5.00 H
5/18/2012 6.00 4.50 H
5/26/2012 7.00 5.00 R
5/26/2012 7.50 5.00 R
5/26/2012 9.00 5.50 R
5/26/2012 10.00 6.00 R
5/26/2012 8.00 5.25 R
5/26/2012 7.00 4.75 R
5/26/2012 6.00 4.50 R
5/29/2012 9.00 5.50 H
5/29/2012 7.50 5.00 H

TOTALS 149.99lb 103.25 lb
(Plus approximately 12 lbs of giblets and feet, which I did not include in these weights or in the cost analysis)

So for the analysis:
CORNISH CHICKS $37.25
MISC $5.98
FEED $170.71

$213.94 TOTAL COST FOR 21 CORNISH TO 9 WEEKS

$213.94 Cornish costs
103.25 Total carcass weight

$2.07 cost per pound for whole birds in freezer

I am quite satisfied with that. (I could have been more exact with assigning the cost of feed, but I did what I could. In my extimate, my laying chicks have cost $10.67 apiece to date.) I expect to do meat chickens again in the future, but only after I find a source for bulk food that costs less. But for happy, healthy, back yard meat chickens that were finished on organic food, I am accepting of $2 per pound. The meat is more tender than store-bought, and it has more flavor. Even my husband noticed and agreed with that. But I need the cost to come down if I am going to do this regularly. All in all I'm pleased with this experiment.
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I have taken DianeS's numbers and converted them into what my cost would be per chicken.

Her 25 chickens at 430 pounds of food in 9 weeks, costing about .40 cents per pound . Using the cost I would pay ($16.00 for 50 pounds, that is figuring in taxes and gas) would be about .32 cents per pound.

Her chickens averaged eating 17.2 pounds each to get to the 5 pound processed chicken weight. Using my cost of .32 cents a pound, the feed bill per chicken would be $5.50.

If my cousin paid for all the feed, her chickens would cost her $11.00 each, and that is not adding the starting cost of buying the chicks themselves or shipping.

This seems like an outrageous price to pay, so I am questioning the fairness of the 100% facility/labor x 100% feed agreement, even though that has always seemed like a fair deal to me in the past.

So I am hoping someone has current experience and/or input on this type of agreement (and maybe someone to double check my figures LOL, I am terrible at math!).

Does anyone do share raising anymore (for chickens, pork, beef, what-ever!)? What agreement do you use that you feel is fair to both/all parties. I have other people interested in doing this with us also.

Thanks so much!

 

[FireTigeris]

Ok, I'd suggest the deal that sounds good to you. (as if you are housing them the predator problem is yours and the manual work to keep them clean is too and the having to find a chicken sitter if you want to leave...)

I'd propose the normal arrangement and see what your other participant says, (as you have more labor) if the other one thinks it is unfair they can suggest something and you check to see if it is fair.

the other person may just agree to that arrangement even if in money it seems unfair to you in your favor.

 

[Life is Good!]

We do a share arrangement with beef. Our family knows a farmer who raises beef cattle (Angus heifers and Hereford bulls) - the farmers family raises Hereford heifers for milk - but the bulls are useless to the family, so she grows them out and sells them - same with the Angus. I'm not sure her arrangement with her family, as to price and such - but for us, she takes the cost of feed and sells them to us for cost of feed per pound - so her cost of feed is fixed across all her customers (there's 10 families in our area alone who are going in on this), as she's raising a beef herd of 40-50 critters, so that's gotta be 50-80 customers!

So each cow costs differently, based on weight - her feed cost is fixed, so she does simple math: Feed cost total divided by pounds of beef sold (the packing house weighs each prior to butcher). Seems ok with me, a customer for 4 years. She has never charged us for husbandry costs or housing costs (straw, etc.) - strictly feed costs. I had never stopped to think about the economics of it - her costs must be comparatively low - the barns are in good shape, the fences are as well - so the only housing cost is straw for the barn, and they grow their own! So, yes, we're paying a lot for the meat, but it's well worth it to us! She hasn't ever charged us for labor. Our 1/2 a cow last year (despite the high costs of corn) came out to $1.99 per pound total. $1.99 for ground 92% lean, $1.99 for ribs, $1.99 for roasts, $1.99 for t-bone steaks - wow! Yes, it's a huge outlay of $$ all at once, but the savings overall are so well worth it!

Hope this helps!

 

[Oregon Blues]

debir, you are paying a lot for feed. Are you feeding organic? Then you need to compare the final cost to what you would pay for pasture raised organic chickens, not what you'd pay for a chicken from the grocery store.

I suggest that you start by raising a few just for yourself, so you can see how much work and if you even like doing it.

 

[FireTigeris]

That'd be low here for a fifty pound bag... $16...

and that's for generic layer feed

 

[debir1966]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

FireTigeris: I sent her a cost break-down. I really would love to do it, I just want to make sure it is a fair deal on both sides

Life is Good!: that sounds like an excellent deal! $1.99 cut and wrapped is an excellent price! Beef around here (Idaho) is ultra expensive right now, 2-3 month old calves are going for $500.00 for beef breeds, and ready to butcher beef is selling for minimum $2.00 a pound hanging weight and then add $.50 a pound to cut and wrap cost, and that was the cheapest I could find.

Oregon Blues: it is $14.45 for a 50 pound bag of meat builder which is made by a small feed store (not a commercial brand). I figured about $16.00 a bag if I included tax and gas to go get it (it is not local, about 60 miles, but we would do bulk, multi-purpose runs to get it twice a month. I don't have the specific ingredients (yet), but we love the lay mash that they make there, it is $13.25 a bag compared to the purina type crumble we can buy locally for $17.89 a bag, and we have to add scratch and oyster shell to the crumble, but it is all mixed into the product they make themselves and the hens love it!

I have ordered 10 meat chickens, 5 Cornish Rocks and 5 Black Broilers from Ideal Poultry. They do not ship until the end of this month and I am tempted to call up and add a few to my order LOL. We have raised meat chickens in the past, but it has been y.e.a.r.s ago (about 20?) since we raised them last and I don't remember how much food they went through.

I am planning on trying free-ranging the meaties and see how it goes. If I had the correct setup, I would free-range half and confine half and compare cost and growth rate... I may still try to do that if I can get a confined area set up.

 

[FireTigeris]

One thing I have learned fair is what the people involved agree on.

I've had deals both ways- some I thought 'gee that doesn't sound fair for him/her' but they thought it was fair for a variety of reasons.

I have also been willing to take a deal where I come out behind by a couple dollars an hour or so just to get the product/service I needed but couldn't do myself, it was 'fair' to me. No matter if it was expertise or time I was 'paying extra' for.

 

[vsmenagerie]

What about she buys the chicks, and you split the feed? Who is processing? I think these deals are great and may not always work out perfectly at a 50/50 split. But I don't think its always necessary. If she didn't want to go in with you, would you still do it? I think I would be good with raising some and processing them for a family member or friend, with what I suggested above. Good luck!