Carotenoides . Eumélanique Phaeomelanine

[Garden Peas]

This picture is an old blue barred peahen ( 16 years old ).... Does the old blackshoulder peahen turn black on her old age ?

Et dites moi pourquoi ta paonne a-t'elle des plumes avec des yeux dans la traine?

And tell me why your peahen has eyefeathers in her train?

 

[Rosa moschata]

There are two additional elements to birds' coloration that go beyond pigment:

1) Feather structure refraction mutations also exist in other birds which will have effects on coloration. Birds which appear darker don't necessarily have more pigment -- they could also have changes in the way light refracts from the feathers. For example, there is no "blue" or "green" pigment in peafowl. Those colors are the result of light refraction, the pigment base being melanin. Among some parrot species, Violet, Gray, and possibly some Dark Factor mutations result in changes in feather structure rather than a change in pigment.

2) Related to feather structure refraction is iridescence, also a result of feather structure. There are some peafowl mutations which have a dull, or matte, look to the body color, whereas others retain the iridescent quality of the original IB.

 

[Garden Peas]

There are two additional elements to birds' coloration that go beyond pigment:

1) Feather structure refraction mutations also exist in other birds which will have effects on coloration. Birds which appear darker don't necessarily have more pigment -- they could also have changes in the way light refracts from the feathers. For example, there is no "blue" or "green" pigment in peafowl. Those colors are the result of light refraction, the pigment base being melanin. Among some parrot species, Violet, Gray, and possibly some Dark Factor mutations result in changes in feather structure rather than a change in pigment.

2) Related to feather structure refraction is iridescence, also a result of feather structure. There are some peafowl mutations which have a dull, or matte, look to the body color, whereas others retain the iridescent quality of the original IB.

What can you share with us about sexual dimorphism?

 

[Garden Peas]

Also, @Rosa moschata , while you are here, could we discuss the black shoulder gene?

My impression is that the black shoulder gene may not actually be a gene that adds black or dark coloration. My sense is that the black shoulder gene might be a gene that SUPPRESSES brown, (in a similar sense as the leucistic genes suppress all color).

So to visualize this... in the male, if the BROWN stripes on the shoulder are suppressed, the shoulder will look black... and on the hen, if the brown coloration is suppressed, than what remains is mostly very light colored, since there is not black on those feathers.

That explanation (and I have no idea if it is correct) makes sense to me, because if so, then the gene is acting the SAME way in males and in females, it is suppressing BROWN on the feathers. That's easier for me to comprehend than a gene that adds black to one gender, and subtracts color from the other gender...

 

[Garden Peas]

There's sort of a poor analogy to horses.. the bay gene restricts the black on a horse to the extremities and the mane and tail, leaving behind a brown-looking horse.

 

[Garden Peas]

Also, can you please, please tell me where to go to read about "no blue or green pigment in peafowl?" I have looked around online with little success. Where do I find this information?

 

[Jack07]

Voici ce que j'ai noter sur le forum français à propos de la mutation opale et explication de la couleur chez les oiseaux
Je rejoins la les explications de Rosa mschata

http://www.paons-faisans.forumactif.org/t2481-mutation-opale

 

[MinxFox]

Et dites moi pourquoi ta paonne a-t'elle des plumes avec des yeux dans la traine?

And tell me why your peahen has eyefeathers in her train?

He said the peahen is 16 years old. Some people have had cases where an old peahen all of a sudden starts growing peacock feathers. I think the theory is that because she is old something happens to her estrogen levels and she then grows male feathers. Kind of like how your Grandma gets long hair on her chin I guess.

I think there was a discussion about this here, but I am pretty sure it was an old topic. You might be able to find it, but I don't remember the title.

This is sort of like George Conner's unisex peafowl here: http://connerhills.com/unisex_peafowl.html
Maybe @connerhills can tell you more about this bird and if she/he is still alive?

 

[Garden Peas]

He said the peahen is 16 years old. Some people have had cases where an old peahen all of a sudden starts growing peacock feathers. I think the theory is that because she is old something happens to her estrogen levels and she then grows male feathers. Kind of like how your Grandma gets long hair on her chin I guess.

I think there was a discussion about this here, but I am pretty sure it was an old topic. You might be able to find it, but I don't remember the title.

This is sort of like George Conner's unisex peafowl here: http://connerhills.com/unisex_peafowl.html
Maybe @connerhills can tell you more about this bird and if she/he is still alive?

Thanks, MinxFox, that's an interesting link. But I don't think the photo put up by Dany necessarily illustrates the point I thought he was making, and the photo looks peculiar to me. I'd like to hear what Dany has to say about it, and where the photo is sourced from.

I'm still waiting to hear why he hasn't bothered to include the information about the Loudens' bird that he posted the other day, without attribution to Jay & Jen, and with no explanation from them about the bird.

 

[Garden Peas]

Voici ce que j'ai noter sur le forum français à propos de la mutation opale et explication de la couleur chez les oiseaux
Je rejoins la les explications de Rosa mschata

http://www.paons-faisans.forumactif.org/t2481-mutation-opale

Merci, Jack, je vien de lire vos postes... tres informants!

Avez-vous finis poster sur cette sujet?

Aussi... je ne suis pas certaine si le couleur qu'on appelle "opal" dans les paons est ce le meme couleur dont on appelle opal dans les autres oiseaux. Ce couleur est pas trop agee dans les paons, et je ne sais pas comment on a decide sur le nom...

Mon opal SP paon n'a que peu de plumes opal, puis il faut que j'irais les voir tout pres. Mais mon impression n'est jamais que les plumes soient plus fonces au l'invers... Je m'inquires si on n'a pas le nomme justement? Vous avez des opals, n'est-ce pas? Sont ils renverser comme vous ecrivez dans les postes?

J'aime bien ce que vous avez ecrit! Merci beaucoup! Moi aussi, je vais atteindre le baccalauriat degree 2eme

All -- Jacky has provided a link to a series of posts he wrote about color for the French forum, which has lovely diagrams of feather structure and a remarkably good explanation of formation of melanin.

Thanks, Jacky!