If someone here called the city to complain about horse, chicken, duck, cow or goat poop they would be laughed right off the line. This city prides itself for being the only one up here that allows all kinds of farm animals.
City demanded on my property !!
- Thread starter Sierra pachie bars
- Start date
Quote:
A generic online "law" encyclopedia doesn't mean anything when it overlooks specific statutes
A generic online "law" encyclopedia doesn't mean anything when it overlooks specific statutes
The laws in many U.S. states allow game wardens to conduct certain types of searches with or without search warrants
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_warden
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_warden
Quote:
I don't know where the OP is, but many properties here around and in the large metro city of Phoenix, AZ and other nearby cities, still the wild west in many ways, have horse/livestock rights locked in by grandfather rights. Some on 1/4 acre or less, many on 1/2 acre or more. There's mansions here with large horse facilities that would blow the mind, along with tiny trailer lots with horse rights. All are subject to complaints by neighbors.
I don't know where the OP is, but many properties here around and in the large metro city of Phoenix, AZ and other nearby cities, still the wild west in many ways, have horse/livestock rights locked in by grandfather rights. Some on 1/4 acre or less, many on 1/2 acre or more. There's mansions here with large horse facilities that would blow the mind, along with tiny trailer lots with horse rights. All are subject to complaints by neighbors.
Quote:
A generic online "law" encyclopedia doesn't mean anything when it overlooks specific statutes
I just said it was worth reading but at least I was not quoting wikipedia.
As far as the federal government, game wardens do not have powers above the federal search an seizure laws. States can an do make laws all the time that go outside there bounds but federal judges always get the last say.
I'm pretty sure you cant be charged with any crime in any state for asking for a warrant even if they might not need one. By asking for one you cover your butt.
A generic online "law" encyclopedia doesn't mean anything when it overlooks specific statutes
The laws in many U.S. states allow game wardens to conduct certain types of searches with or without search warrants
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_warden
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_warden
I just said it was worth reading but at least I was not quoting wikipedia.
As far as the federal government, game wardens do not have powers above the federal search an seizure laws. States can an do make laws all the time that go outside there bounds but federal judges always get the last say.
I'm pretty sure you cant be charged with any crime in any state for asking for a warrant even if they might not need one. By asking for one you cover your butt.
A quote on the subject from a actual game warden on officer.com
Wow, after reading all the replies it makes me feel like I should be able to walk on water and shoot lightening bolts from my *****. Now for the rest of my reply...I'm not big into legal wording I'll try to explain as best I can (also just finished a 16 hour day so my mind might not be working right...spelling might suck too ).
We do not have any authority that allows us to violate 4th amendment rights. We are constantly obtaining search warrants to enter houses to look for illegal wildlife etc, just like any "regualar" cop does for drugs etc. We have to play the articulable suspicion and probable cause game like every other cop. Realize that every court, judge, prosecutor, and jury pool will be different all across the country. Some may allow more questionable actions than others will. If a game warden truly entered a house w/o a warrant then there is either (A) exigent circumstances or (B) never gone to a supreme court ruling concerning the entry. My agency has lost some big poaching cases because of bad search warrant entries.
Now for the "more power" aspect. In a way we kinda do when it comes to checking licenses and checkstations. That has come about through a variety of court rulings that basically boil down to our duties of fish and wildlife preservation and protection. Joe Public MUST prove to me that he has a fishing license if I see him fishing. Joe Public must also stop at a checkstation if he has been hunting etc. so we can verify that wildlife is being preserved and protected properly. In comparison you can't just pull a car over to check a drivers license. Because a lot of laws/rules are federally based we also carry federal ID through US Fish and Wildlife service. Alot of waterfowl and migratory bird stuff is federal. This is also our basis from where we can legally cross a state line to pursue a wildlife violation.
As to seizing firearms. It is not a violation of 2nd amendment. We are not prohibiting that person to own a gun, the gun(s) we seize are evidence in a crime. That also goes for ATV's, Campers, Trucks, etc. If they were used in commiting a wildlife crime they are evidence. The bigger the case the more those kind of seizures occur.
As to finding non-wildlife crime. That depends on what authority the "game warden" has in his state. I am a fully sworn certified peace officer just like any city, county, or state cop. I can write speeding tickets, arrest DUI's, seize meth found in a search etc. The difference is we focus on fish and wildlife. If we come across a non-F&G situation we will try to get a county or state cop to take care of it. This is MAINLY because defense attorneys will have a field day with us on the stand because of the "lack of experience" with DUI, drugs, etc. Same reason a deputy or state cop will try to get one of us if they stumble on a illegal wildlife situation. Avoid giving a defense attorney any "ammo".
We do not have any authority that allows us to violate 4th amendment rights. We are constantly obtaining search warrants to enter houses to look for illegal wildlife etc, just like any "regualar" cop does for drugs etc. We have to play the articulable suspicion and probable cause game like every other cop. Realize that every court, judge, prosecutor, and jury pool will be different all across the country. Some may allow more questionable actions than others will. If a game warden truly entered a house w/o a warrant then there is either (A) exigent circumstances or (B) never gone to a supreme court ruling concerning the entry. My agency has lost some big poaching cases because of bad search warrant entries.
Now for the "more power" aspect. In a way we kinda do when it comes to checking licenses and checkstations. That has come about through a variety of court rulings that basically boil down to our duties of fish and wildlife preservation and protection. Joe Public MUST prove to me that he has a fishing license if I see him fishing. Joe Public must also stop at a checkstation if he has been hunting etc. so we can verify that wildlife is being preserved and protected properly. In comparison you can't just pull a car over to check a drivers license. Because a lot of laws/rules are federally based we also carry federal ID through US Fish and Wildlife service. Alot of waterfowl and migratory bird stuff is federal. This is also our basis from where we can legally cross a state line to pursue a wildlife violation.
As to seizing firearms. It is not a violation of 2nd amendment. We are not prohibiting that person to own a gun, the gun(s) we seize are evidence in a crime. That also goes for ATV's, Campers, Trucks, etc. If they were used in commiting a wildlife crime they are evidence. The bigger the case the more those kind of seizures occur.
As to finding non-wildlife crime. That depends on what authority the "game warden" has in his state. I am a fully sworn certified peace officer just like any city, county, or state cop. I can write speeding tickets, arrest DUI's, seize meth found in a search etc. The difference is we focus on fish and wildlife. If we come across a non-F&G situation we will try to get a county or state cop to take care of it. This is MAINLY because defense attorneys will have a field day with us on the stand because of the "lack of experience" with DUI, drugs, etc. Same reason a deputy or state cop will try to get one of us if they stumble on a illegal wildlife situation. Avoid giving a defense attorney any "ammo".
Quote:
Makes perfect sense to me, Reb...
Makes perfect sense to me, Reb...
Nevermind
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Shortly before state rep Gifford (and many others) in Tucson, AZ were attacked by Loughner, Loughner was pulled over by a game & fish officer for running a redlight......but I'm puzzled by what game officer authority has to do with what happened to the OP.
If no answers were forthcoming from the city today, I think I would have filed a police report, if it wasn't already filed. OP, did the city give you the run around today when you called them?
If no answers were forthcoming from the city today, I think I would have filed a police report, if it wasn't already filed. OP, did the city give you the run around today when you called them?
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Anytime you find a note from the city on your property, call and find out what is going on. You may have a neighbor who likes to cause trouble or dislikes you. Or there may simply be ignorant and have a better view into your unfenced area than into any one else's area.
One of the neighbors down the way in Nevada had the county called out repeatedly on "cruelty to animals" reports that were based on the fact that her horses were doing what horses do - in anticipation of being fed in the evenings they were as close to the gate as they could get and wound up standing in their own manure. The deputy came out, observed that the reason the horses were standing in manure is that they weren't moving from the gate area and, being horses, continued to defecate and then stand in it. The deputies who came out were disgusted that someone was complaining; it turned out the complainant had equines confused with kitties, and when the deputies didn't cite the neighbor or "save the horses", the complainant came down and told her in person how awful icky poo she was because she knew kitties, doggies, and other animals didn't like to be in their poop and so she knew these horses were being oppressed.
A similar thing happened to a dairy farming acquaintance in Manteca. In this case some allleged humane organization actually showed up with a two stall trailer and tried to steal the dairy cows - which they described as a "liberation" and a "rescue" - because they had seen the cows standing in a very tight clump in the mud by the milking parlor door every day. Yep. Dairy cows. Nice dry corral area near the milking parlor, but they all stand as close as possible to the door because the higher the bovine status, the earliest in the door, and the more cow manure and urine in a small area, the muddier it gets. My acquaintance called the sheriff who cited the self-proclaimed animal rescuers for trespassing on the dairy farm. They had no legal right to be there; and they were darn near murdered by the first cow they tried to separate from the herd to load in the trailer. In other words, they had no clue whatsoever about stock.
Anytime you find a note from the city on your property, call and find out what is going on. You may have a neighbor who likes to cause trouble or dislikes you. Or there may simply be ignorant and have a better view into your unfenced area than into any one else's area.
One of the neighbors down the way in Nevada had the county called out repeatedly on "cruelty to animals" reports that were based on the fact that her horses were doing what horses do - in anticipation of being fed in the evenings they were as close to the gate as they could get and wound up standing in their own manure. The deputy came out, observed that the reason the horses were standing in manure is that they weren't moving from the gate area and, being horses, continued to defecate and then stand in it. The deputies who came out were disgusted that someone was complaining; it turned out the complainant had equines confused with kitties, and when the deputies didn't cite the neighbor or "save the horses", the complainant came down and told her in person how awful icky poo she was because she knew kitties, doggies, and other animals didn't like to be in their poop and so she knew these horses were being oppressed.
A similar thing happened to a dairy farming acquaintance in Manteca. In this case some allleged humane organization actually showed up with a two stall trailer and tried to steal the dairy cows - which they described as a "liberation" and a "rescue" - because they had seen the cows standing in a very tight clump in the mud by the milking parlor door every day. Yep. Dairy cows. Nice dry corral area near the milking parlor, but they all stand as close as possible to the door because the higher the bovine status, the earliest in the door, and the more cow manure and urine in a small area, the muddier it gets. My acquaintance called the sheriff who cited the self-proclaimed animal rescuers for trespassing on the dairy farm. They had no legal right to be there; and they were darn near murdered by the first cow they tried to separate from the herd to load in the trailer. In other words, they had no clue whatsoever about stock.
Quote:
OMG!! Where Was this? I need to know I have thoroughbred I don't want them stolen. Was it in michigan? I hope not.
OMG!! Where Was this? I need to know I have thoroughbred I don't want them stolen. Was it in michigan? I hope not.
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