Cochin breeding, genetics, and showing

[NellaBean]

Here is the leghorn/cochin.....I have 3 of these now, and have had a couple in the past (main flock rooster is a blue cochin, and I get a lot of broodies).

(pic is a few months old, that pen has been cleaned and all the kids are free ranging now)

More recent.

 

[NellaBean]

If breeding the white leghorn/cochin pullets back to cochins, does color matter? I only have a blue rooster now, but could probably pretty easily get an exhibition quality black cock if that would work better.

 

[NellaBean]

also, breeding the leghorn to the cochin is currently resulting in sex linked chicks. Girls are white with black spots and dark legs. Boys are solid white or white with barred spots and yellow legs.

Will this change once I cross the leghorn/cochin pullet back to the cochin dad? Ie, will I lose the sex linking?

 

[lilcrow]

Quote:
OK, thanks for that piece of the puzzle, so what are sjarvis and Tom referring to when they talk about introducing the Birchen color, and the incomplete pattern, specifically on the hens. I think I understand what Tom is talking about, the "pattern" of the hackles is not clear and crisp on the girls, i.e., feathers that do not have complete lacing on them, but is there something about the roo that is missing or lacking color-wise, and how would I go about introducing the Birchen color?

 

[DIXDOX]

Curious to see how this works out. I have some leghorn X Sussex crosses growing now. (didn't have cochin roo yet) I'm hoping for the larger eggs of leghorn but the calm of sussex. Hmm wonder if I bred one of them back to my cochin roo what the heck would happen?!

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
just keep breeding the crossess back to the blue one, seems what you are seeing is just leaky whites, as heterozygous white can show those dark spot colors, and the reason you are seeing sex links is not because of dominant white, but because your cochin boy is sex linked id+(responsible for colored shanks) and the hen is sex linked for Id(responsibe for clean clear colored legs, white if white skin or yellow for yellow skin) so boys will be Id/id+ and since Id is dominant over id+ they show yellow leggs, girls can only have one copy of the id+ gene from their dad, so they will have dark leggs

hope this helps...

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
OK, thanks for that piece of the puzzle, so what are sjarvis and Tom referring to when they talk about introducing the Birchen color, and the incomplete pattern, specifically on the hens. I think I understand what Tom is talking about, the "pattern" of the hackles is not clear and crisp on the girls, i.e., feathers that do not have complete lacing on them, but is there something about the roo that is missing or lacking color-wise, and how would I go about introducing the Birchen color?

what is your goals? Lacing? Spangling?

 

[lilcrow]

Quote:
OK, thanks for that piece of the puzzle, so what are sjarvis and Tom referring to when they talk about introducing the Birchen color, and the incomplete pattern, specifically on the hens. I think I understand what Tom is talking about, the "pattern" of the hackles is not clear and crisp on the girls, i.e., feathers that do not have complete lacing on them, but is there something about the roo that is missing or lacking color-wise, and how would I go about introducing the Birchen color?

what is your goals? Lacing? Spangling?

I'm breeding Birchen Cochins.

 

[NellaBean]

Quote:
just keep breeding the crossess back to the blue one, seems what you are seeing is just leaky whites, as heterozygous white can show those dark spot colors, and the reason you are seeing sex links is not because of dominant white, but because your cochin boy is sex linked id+(responsible for colored shanks) and the hen is sex linked for Id(responsibe for clean clear colored legs, white if white skin or yellow for yellow skin) so boys will be Id/id+ and since Id is dominant over id+ they show yellow leggs, girls can only have one copy of the id+ gene from their dad, so they will have dark leggs

hope this helps...

Yep, thanks for the info! My girls are probably coming up on 15 weeks for the oldest two, so in another couple months I should be able to get the next round going.

 

[Coopa Cabana]

Quote:
OK, thanks for that piece of the puzzle, so what are sjarvis and Tom referring to when they talk about introducing the Birchen color, and the incomplete pattern, specifically on the hens. I think I understand what Tom is talking about, the "pattern" of the hackles is not clear and crisp on the girls, i.e., feathers that do not have complete lacing on them, but is there something about the roo that is missing or lacking color-wise, and how would I go about introducing the Birchen color?

Nancy, here's my very uneducated opinion. Lord know I'm having enough trouble with my own Golden Laced. First off, there is no such thing as 'Birchen Color". They are called Birchen because they are the most basic color variety found on the Birchen allele. Because of this, as soon as breeders start crossing in other varieties, especially those found on other alleles, they start messing with how the alleles and genes interact with one another.

Just like some genes are more dominant than others, the same is true of the alleles.

As Birchen is the most basic color variety, you don't want to be adding anything in. Chances are, they have something added in prior generations that may be giving you fits. I think you need to be breeding out, not breeding in.

Either continue with what you have, and cull heavily, or find more Birchens to breed in to complement/improve what you already have, and continue to cull.

Again, some of the best advice I read a couple of years ago was not to breed to the standard; rather you should cull to the standard.