Colloncas, Huastecs, & Quechuas

[MA Mama]

Yeah, I know, right? It's amazing what you can find if you're tenacious enough. You just have to have the time to follow leads once you finally find them. From the picture of the Aymara shaman I went to reading about history of their tribe. I used the citations from the history to find people who had used the same references in their research. I just kept working my way through the web until I found people actually working on livestock preservation.


There's 2 years of web research time between the old man and the old woman. There was a year of on again / off again frustration before coming to the idea of just going through picture after picture on flickr. This wasn't out of any kind of malice but because I knew these breeds had no hope of surviving if there wasn't someone closer to the source ready and able to verify their existence.


Isn't the whole premise that these particular lineages birds came from carefully cultivated flocks handed down generation after generation and our efforts will help protect them for future generations?

I'm saying that after 3 years of searching I haven't found anything to support that premise. What I did find is people actually in South America recognizing that they have animals intrinsically tied to their cultural identity. These are the preservationists in the trenches and we need to be looking to them for guidance. They've identified some broad categories based on what the indigenous people actually call their birds. There have been a few smaller studies actually going out and taking measurements and recording unique features but that was in Columbia and another in Mexico. However, the variables being measured seemed super basic to me - like crested, non-crested, weight, color, a few more.

If I made a spreadsheet with the parameters they measured would people be willing to add to it? It'd be a way to start collectively pooling info in an organized manner.

Do you have links to the "they" you refer to? Who is "they" specifically?

 

[tbishop]

I have to say, Spark, you are making a lot of leaps of assumption that I wouldn't be comfortable with putting my faith in. I'm glad your story pleases you but you haven't done anything to convince me you are on the right track. It's almost like you are refuting someone you don't care for and making the story fit around that. If you get something definitive, please share.

 

[SparkyCrows]

This resource is specific to Columbia and was published in 2009. The University has made it available to download FOR FREE http://www.bdigital.unal.edu.co/3412/1/9789588095561.pdf
Looks like it was also printed and can be purchased?? http://www.publicaciones.palmira.unal.edu.co/paginas/zootecnia.html




Universidad Nacional de Colombia, Sede Palmira
Facultad Ciencias Agropecuarias
ISBN: 978-958-8095-56-1
Autor:
Nestor Fabio Valencia Llano
Profesor Asociado
Universidad Nacional de Colombia, Sede Palmira
E-mail: [email protected]
Diagramación:
Universidad nacional de Colombia Sede Palmira
Unidad de Medios de Comunicación - UNIMEDIOS
Comunicación Estratégica / Ideas para crecer

1. INTRODUCCIÓN
Después de 15 años de investigaciones a lo largo y ancho del territorio
Colombiano, se presenta el primer libro relacionado con la gallina criolla
colombiana Gallus domesticus (L), se identificaron 12 tipos y se describen
desde la subespecie de donde provienen, además se observaron 8 variedades de
la subespecie nanus, se resaltan las caracteristicas generales de cada subespecie,
reconociendo que ha existido un cruzamiento constante entre ellas desde antes
del descubrimiento de América (1492), y al mismo tiempo “selección” por parte
de las comunidades rurales (indígenas, negras y campesinas) por conservar
caracteres raciales y productivas de su interés, contribuyendo a embellecer el
entorno rural.
________________________________________________________________________________

According to Google Translator this says:

Nacional de Colombia in Palmira
Faculty Agricultural Sciences
ISBN: 978-958-8095-56-1
Author :
Nestor Fabio Valencia Llano
Associate Professor
National University of Colombia , Palmira
E - mail: [email protected]
layout:
National University of Colombia at Palmira
Media Unit - UNIMEDIOS
Strategic / Communication Ideas to grow
1. INTRODUCTION
After 15 years of investigations throughout the territory
Colombia , the first book is presented related to the creole chicken
Colombian Gallus domesticus ( L ), 12 types were identified and described
from the subspecies from which they come , plus 8 varieties were observed
the nanus subspecies, the general characteristics of each subspecies are highlighted ,
recognizing that there has been a constant cross between them before
Discovery of America ( 1492 ) , while " selection " by
rural communities ( indigenous, black and campesino ) to conserve
racial and productive characters of interest , helping to beautify the
rural environment.

_______________________________________________________________________

As I've mentioned there are several resources from other parts of Central and South America stashed on scribd site. I'll keep posting more as I can.

 

[tbishop]

I don't see any references to Colloncas, Huastecs, or Quechuas. How do you make the connection to these birds from that abstract?

 

[SparkyCrows]

I don't see any references to Colloncas, Huastecs, or Quechuas. How do you make the connection to these birds from that abstract?

Correct. I don't see any reference to colloncas, huastecs, or quechuas either. (BTW It's not an abstract. It's an entire book - 61 pages describing why, how, and what they found, complete with pictures and descriptions of the birds.)

 

[tbishop]

All I saw was a link to an abstract describing this book.

We've come far afield from your original statement of dishonest breeders misrepresenting their Colloncas, Huastecs, and Quechas. You've posted picture of two Peruvian chickens without description and one abstract for a book in Spanish with no specific page citations that support your claim. You've also posted a lot of self-generated suppositions to fill in your opinion. I'm having a hard time staying engaged with what you are saying. Please let me know if you have something definitive.

I stand corrected- it is a book- what page is the information that proves that colloncas, huastecs, and quechas are being mis-represented by the breeders that raise them?

 

[SparkyCrows]

All I saw was a link to an abstract describing this book.

We've come far afield from your original statement of dishonest breeders misrepresenting their Colloncas, Huastecs, and Quechas. You've posted picture of two Peruvian chickens without description and one abstract for a book in Spanish with no specific page citations that support your claim. You've also posted a lot of self-generated suppositions to fill in your opinion. I'm having a hard time staying engaged with what you are saying. Please let me know if you have something definitive.

I stand corrected- it is a book- what page is the information that proves that colloncas, huastecs, and quechas are being mis-represented by the breeders that raise them?

Really? You are expecting a book written about varieties of chickens native to Columbia to address birds on a completely different continent just because they are purportedly from South America. And....you want them to write it in English so it's easier for you to understand.

The list of native varieties identified by the Chilean blue egg researchers is in the text along the picture of the woman. This is an excerpt the aviculture europe folks pulled from a 300+ page document about these animals and a blueprint for their grassroots breed restoration. Here's the link to the full Cetsur document http://www.scribd.com/doc/59314721/Revalorizacion-de-Las-Gallinas-Mapuche

I believe I also have a digital copy of the document. Just send me a PM and we'll figure it out.

 

[tbishop]

Still no specific citations to support your claim? Can we let it rest now- I hate to take up bandwidth with circular discussions.

 

[MA Mama]

Still no specific citations to support your claim? Can we let it rest now- I hate to take up bandwidth with circular discussions.

Don't go anywhere! There ARE people on here who feel the same way you do and ask the very same questions you do. They aren't vocal because this is exactly what happens... spinning tires and pointed questions going unanswered.

As for me, I know for certain that you will NEVER see anything published about Quechua or Huastec or Koro Sea. Those names were MADE UP by Kermit. He named them. Recently. His long story short, he inherited the ONLY PARENT STOCK THERE IS of these birds and then he named them based on variety and where they came from. These are words from his mouth to my ears. Take what this from you will. Feel free to contact me privately.

 

[MA Mama]

All I saw was a link to an abstract describing this book.

We've come far afield from your original statement of dishonest breeders misrepresenting their Colloncas, Huastecs, and Quechas. You've posted picture of two Peruvian chickens without description and one abstract for a book in Spanish with no specific page citations that support your claim. You've also posted a lot of self-generated suppositions to fill in your opinion. I'm having a hard time staying engaged with what you are saying. Please let me know if you have something definitive.

I stand corrected- it is a book- what page is the information that proves that colloncas, huastecs, and quechas are being mis-represented by the breeders that raise them?

If anything is being mis-represented, it is the history of the Huastecs and Quechuas. "Collonca" is a very general term for any rumpless NON TUFTED birds. It's really just a variety.