Consumer reports article on salmonella in store bought birds

[dichotomymom]

You're right. I don't test my birds but the fact that I know how they are handled and the fact that they are not living in standing room only and are handled by me and only me during processing greatly reduces my chances of having highly contaminated birds.

 

[bigredfeather]

Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay :

Quote:
There are absolutely, without a doubt NO hormones used in either chicken, egg, or swine feeding programs. Fact, end of story.
Jim

Lazy J, How can you be so sure? I tend to side with earlier poster that said companies that advertise no hormones ect are doing so because there are many others that do use these things. I guess I am wondering where you are getting tour facts. If you now something we don't please share.

Quote:
I don't think it's inappropriate at all. Although we will probably never see "randomly sampled chickens" from backyard producers, I can say with great certainty that birds that I raise and process have a significantly smaller chance of carrying as much disease as a chicken that is raised in closed shelter w/ 10's of thousands of other birds, then ran thru an automated processing facility. So yes I can put my home raised broilers on a pedastal, and I do. You asked what chemical interventions do BYP have in place. If you need chemical interventions to prevent contamination, then you shouldn't be processing anything. We are very meticuloius when we process, as I'm sure are the majority of other BYP. Avoiding chemicals such as chlorine is a big reason why we produce our own birds. I would rather a carcuss have a small amount of bacteria on it, that will be killed during cooking, than subject my children to ingesting chlorine ladened chicken. It's amazing to me that the FDA has measures in place and has set standards for the amount of chlorine that needs to be present in chill tanks to kill off unwanted bacteria. IMHO they should be taking bigger steps towards preventing how it gets there, rather than getting rid of it. Why do you think other countries don't accept America's chicken into their country? It's because the majority of our practices invite food born sickness, and they don't want anything to do with it.

You also asked, "What are the SOP's that a Backyard Producer uses to ensure there is no fecal contamination on the birds?"
My answer: You make sure you don't severe any of the innerds when processing, first off. Secondly, you raise your birds in a manner that allows them to not be living in their own feces. Both of these things are overlooked by large producers. They have their birds in large building, birds piled on top of each other, spreading disease to a large majority of them. Then they send them to a robotic processing plant where machines slice and dice the birds, cutting thru intestines, allowing feces to be present in the cavity of the bird or anywhere else it may fall. So how do they resolve this: Soak them in a tank of water that can have as much as 37ppm of chlorine in the water. Yea, that sounds yummy.

Obviously we have a different view of things which is fine. I will continue to feed my family with birds that don't have any inspections by the FDA, and be confident that they are eating something that is more nutritious and safer to eat than a chicken off a grocery store shelf, and is superior to its counterpart.​

 

[Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay]

Quote:
Lazy J, How can you be so sure? I tend to side with earlier poster that said companies that advertise no hormones ect are doing so because there are many others that do use these things. I guess I am wondering where you are getting tour facts. If you now something we don't please share.

First, there are no hormones approved for use in swine or poultry feeding. That information is published in the Feed Additive Compendium.

Second, since hormones are proteins they are digested by the stomach and inactivated. So feeding is not a method to use for administering hormones.

In the cattle industry hormones to improve feed efficiency and growth rates must be injected, the most efficient approach at this time is a slwo release bolus implanted into the calves ear. This is not practicle for chickens or pigs.

The "Hormone Free" marketing scheme used by Tyson several years ago was pulled after the FDA and USDA called their bluff. The "Hormone Free" implied that others were using hormones which is an impossibility based on currently approved and available technology.

Jim

 

[Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay]

Quote:
That is for you, but making the assumption that your standars apply to EVERY backyard producer selling to the public is inappropriate.

I have no issue with you producing your own chickens, that is exactly what we do at our farm. However, when you or I begin selling that product to the public we need to take steps to ensure that our customers are protected and that they have assurances of wholesomeness and safety.


Jim

 

[dichotomymom]

We must be licensed in Indiana to sell egg and meat to the public. I am not egg board certified because as of now, I sell only to family and friends but I'm guessing the meat certificate comes with some form of inspection although I know that the egg does not.

 

[AHappychick]

Quote:
There are absolutely, without a doubt NO hormones used in either chicken, egg, or swine feeding programs. Fact, end of story.
Jim

Lazy J, How can you be so sure? I tend to side with earlier poster that said companies that advertise no hormones ect are doing so because there are many others that do use these things. I guess I am wondering where you are getting tour facts. If you now something we don't please share.

Quote:
I don't think it's inappropriate at all. Although we will probably never see "randomly sampled chickens" from backyard producers, I can say with great certainty that birds that I raise and process have a significantly smaller chance of carrying as much disease as a chicken that is raised in closed shelter w/ 10's of thousands of other birds, then ran thru an automated processing facility. So yes I can put my home raised broilers on a pedastal, and I do. You asked what chemical interventions do BYP have in place. If you need chemical interventions to prevent contamination, then you shouldn't be processing anything. We are very meticuloius when we process, as I'm sure are the majority of other BYP. Avoiding chemicals such as chlorine is a big reason why we produce our own birds. I would rather a carcuss have a small amount of bacteria on it, that will be killed during cooking, than subject my children to ingesting chlorine ladened chicken. It's amazing to me that the FDA has measures in place and has set standards for the amount of chlorine that needs to be present in chill tanks to kill off unwanted bacteria. IMHO they should be taking bigger steps towards preventing how it gets there, rather than getting rid of it. Why do you think other countries don't accept America's chicken into their country? It's because the majority of our practices invite food born sickness, and they don't want anything to do with it.

You also asked, "What are the SOP's that a Backyard Producer uses to ensure there is no fecal contamination on the birds?"
My answer: You make sure you don't severe any of the innerds when processing, first off. Secondly, you raise your birds in a manner that allows them to not be living in their own feces. Both of these things are overlooked by large producers. They have their birds in large building, birds piled on top of each other, spreading disease to a large majority of them. Then they send them to a robotic processing plant where machines slice and dice the birds, cutting thru intestines, allowing feces to be present in the cavity of the bird or anywhere else it may fall. So how do they resolve this: Soak them in a tank of water that can have as much as 37ppm of chlorine in the water. Yea, that sounds yummy.

Obviously we have a different view of things which is fine. I will continue to feed my family with birds that don't have any inspections by the FDA, and be confident that they are eating something that is more nutritious and safer to eat than a chicken off a grocery store shelf, and is superior to its counterpart.

Thank you you said it better than I.

Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay what yopu are saying is lies, later today I will pull clips of the actual FARMERS speaking about it. I am possitive that the Dirty Jobs eposode I speak of is a place where it is actaully said outright very matter-of-factly. I would apreciate it if you dont speak down to me like I am some unedjucated person who believes all the hype and that Massive corporations are out for our best interests and not their own pocket. If feeding antibiotics and growth hormones to animals add a fex extra pennies (which equalls millions on a commercial scale) in the CEO's pocket then so be it. It was not until true medical studdies showed that pour children are being effected by the growth hormones in particular that was causing early puberty especially in those with a large diet of commercial chicken. Fact of the matter is whether you choose to believe oit or not, real farmers and BYC enthusiests will more often raise a better product then some factory type place, its just common sence.

 

[dichotomymom]

Ouch, I didn't mean for my posting to turn into an accusation of private farm methods vs commercial but I do think it's good to dialogue about people's perceptions of what farm methods are most common and what that means for their meat!

 

[bigredfeather]

Quote:
Informative threads usually start off innocent enough. I think the topic of your OP is directly related to how the birds are raised and processed.

 

[Buster52]

Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay :

Second, since hormones are proteins they are digested by the stomach and inactivated. So feeding is not a method to use for administering hormones.

This makes no sense, seeing humans with hormonal imbalances take their hormone supplements orally. Maybe "it is just more effective injected", would be a better way to describe it.

It is true that giving hormones to poultry, however it is administered, is banned in the US. It is also true, however, that large producers do in fact administer antibiotics as a routine preventative measure. Critters confined in a small space in large numbers are much more likely to get sick. A confinement operation couldn't function without antibiotics, which is one of the big problems with that sort of operation. Not only does it pollute the environment and the folks who consume the birds, it also creates superbugs resistant to antibiotics.​

 

[Bossroo]

Wouldn't anyone in the chicken selling to the public business put on their label that their chicken is hormone free when there are quite a few stating that the commercial chickens are laced with it? As for chlorine, one would be hard pressed to find a household that doesn't have a cleaning product without it. when it is exposed to water and/or air, it becomes gasous and evaporates rapidly. Try not to chlorinate your public swimming pool ( city, apartment complex, residential) for a week and see what happens. What about all of the chlorine used in everyone's laundry? What about all of the chlorine used in all of the municipality drinking water systems? What does the backyard chicken processor use to disinfect their knives, kettles, work surfaces, or their own kitchen sink and countertop, etc after their work is done if not a chlorine product?